Have you lost faith in Tesla?

[Durzel]

What do you mean "come clean"? He appears to be openly advertising the fact that he had shares and made money on them! If I had looked at lots of vehicle brands and had good information about which were likely to be successful I think I would know which car I would buy and I think I know which company I would invest in. Would you believe someone who told you that a certain company had the best margins in the business yet wouldn't put their own money where their mouth is?

The problem is the conflict of interests. He has a platform that reaches a decent number of people, which he will know, and he's a shareholder.

It's not in his best interests to be overly critical. I'm not saying he is likely to move the stock price of his own accord, but what he does post is likely to get picked up by other media outlets, and could as a whole have an effect.

I think fundamentally you can't really be objective - or trusted to be - if you have a financial interest in the stock going up.

 

[DaveW]

You’re more than welcome to. Be prepared obviously.

Get over yourself!

This kind of stuff gets on my nerves. I shouldn’t have to do all this on a £60K car and certainly not find out AFTER I’ve bought it that I may need to lol! That’s NOT a solution. Blows my mind that you think this is acceptable.

Oh, and stop taking everything so seriously dude.

Get over yourself!

It's hard to know sometimes when someones being light hearted or not at times, but I genuinely do find this place miserable at the moment, big change from how things were, coming here for help is a lot more rewarding than coming here to play the same song on the worlds smallest violin, every day.

For you, if you genuinely found out after taking delivery of your car that they were going to remove USS (guessing you found places like this after the event, not before) then you have my sympathy. I personally bought the car knowing that they weren't going to be there from day 1, so I've got nothing to moan about, other than being stupid if it bothered me that much, I've gone in eyes open.

 

[Durzel]

From what I can gather it was very much hit or miss as to whether people actually got notified about the car they ordered not having parking sensors. The popup that some people got only applied to orders in progress when the announcement was made. Since the majority of people would have bought the car on finance, it could have been the finance company that placed the order got it (or not).

As I understand it that popup doesn't happen anymore, since parking sensors haven't been advertised since Tesla said they were removing them.

Notwithstanding all of the above there's been several posts on the UK Facebook group from people who are simply incredulous that they are missing, i.e. they took it as read that the car would have them (since what car at this price point, or indeed what decently priced car at all built in recent years doesn't?). I must admit, before this all happened, if I were dropping £50k+ on a car - finance or not - I wouldn't even ask if it had parking sensors, I'd take it as read it did.

 

[CWT3LR]

Get over yourself!

It's hard to know sometimes when someones being light hearted or not at times, but I genuinely do find this place miserable at the moment, big change from how things were, coming here for help is a lot more rewarding than coming here to play the same song on the worlds smallest violin, every day.

For you, if you genuinely found out after taking delivery of your car that they were going to remove USS (guessing you found places like this after the event, not before) then you have my sympathy. I personally bought the car knowing that they weren't going to be there from day 1, so I've got nothing to moan about, other than being stupid if it bothered me that much, I've gone in eyes open.

You sound like someone who finds it very difficult to cope with opinions expressed that do not accord with your world view.

 

[CWT3LR]

I must admit, before this all happened, if I were dropping £50k+ on a car - finance or not - I wouldn't even ask if it had parking sensors, I'd take it as read it did.

Especially if every test drive car, website, etc shows them as present up to the point you ordered the car.

It is very unusual these days for cars to be stripped out. There used to be an adage - if you want to know what will be on every car in ten years time, look at today's S Class Mercedes. At this rate, the adage will be look at what's on a Model 3, because your car won't have it soon!

 

[Ratch]

From what I can gather it was very much hit or miss as to whether people actually got notified about the car they ordered not having parking sensors.

This is how I found out - I HIT a Tesla Supercharher 30 mins after picking the car up from the ‘dealer’ because I was waiting for the beeps! The only reason I didn’t do any damage was because I broke when I realised I had to be way too close. I thought it had some new fangled sensors that aren’t visible

WTF?

 

[DaveW]

You sound like someone who finds it very difficult to cope with opinions expressed that do not accord with your world view.

You sound like someone that assumes a lot, with very little knowledge on the subject. There's both of us throwing out wild and unfair assumptions.

You've got me very wrong, my post was about the constant barrage of the same issues and moaning over and over again, making this place much less fun. Balance is important, I don't expect to agree with everyone, if I found it difficult to deal with differing opinions, I'd never leave the house.

 

[yessuz]

I would send you to Coventry but you are already in Wales so it would not be much of a punishment

send him to Grimsby

 

[Blokie]

This is how I found out - I HIT a Tesla Supercharher 30 mins after picking the car up from the ‘dealer’ because I was waiting for the beeps! The only reason I didn’t do any damage was because I broke when I realised I had to be way too close. I thought it had some new fangled sensors that aren’t visible

WTF?

Did you reverse with your eyes closed so you couldn't see the reversing camera?

 

[Jason71]

Have you lost Faith in this Thread?

O No
O Nearly
O Yes

 

[DaveNN]

Not sure

 

[CWT3LR]

Have you lost Faith in this Thread?

O No
O Nearly
O Yes

Huge assumption behind your question Jason.

That I had faith in the first place. We are not ALL lapsed believers - some of us were infidel / kafir over this thread from the outset......

 

[Jason71]

Huge assumption behind your question Jason.

That I had faith in the first place. We are not ALL lapsed believers - some of us were infidel / kafir over this thread from the outset......

Which was the first thing I posted about the survey on this thread 21 pages ago

 

[CWT3LR]

Which was the first thing I posted about the survey on this thread 21 pages ago

I meant your question about the thread, not the thread itself. But then again....

 

[Durzel]

You sound like someone that assumes a lot, with very little knowledge on the subject. There's both of us throwing out wild and unfair assumptions.

You've got me very wrong, my post was about the constant barrage of the same issues and moaning over and over again, making this place much less fun. Balance is important, I don't expect to agree with everyone, if I found it difficult to deal with differing opinions, I'd never leave the house.

My perspective on this is that I want to be upbeat about Tesla in so far as it impacts UK customers, but I'm finding it difficult, for the following reasons (in no particular order):

• "Full self driving" development has been non-existant in the UK/Europe. Literally nothing of substance has changed in the ~3 years I've owned my M3P. All I can actually remember happening is the car seeing speed limit signs, and "Traffic Light Stop and Go". This is very different to the picture that was painted when I bought the car (I was naive).
  
  
• ..consequently FSD (the option) feels like a massive scam. I keep telling myself not to think about how much I would have had I put that £5,800 in Tesla shares - for example - in March 2020 rather than an option that is almost completely crippled.
  
  
• None of the features in EAP/FSD - Summon, Autopark, NoA, etc have seen any material (UK/Europe) improvement since I've owned the car. Summon is hopeless, whereas Kia/Hyundai enjoy full remote summon & self parking from several metres away. Mercedes have level 3 lane keeping, several other prestige and non-prestige brands also have a version of lane keeping.
  
  
• Hardware just keeps getting downgraded or deleted for no good reason. This doesn't directly affect me because I haven't bought a new car, but I had been keen to consider "refreshing" my M3P with a new one, but whilst there have been things added (Ryzen, heatpump, heated steering wheel, etc) there have also been things just arbitrarily taken away for no good reason (passenger lumbar, USB data, ultrasonics). It feels to me like Tesla are testing the limits of what they can get away with without materially affecting actual demand.
  
  
• Software development seems almost entirely centred on gimmicks while fundamental things that don't work as well as on other, cheaper cars is left unfixed for months, or years. Auto wipers is still highly variable, auto headlights has only just recently been improved (substantially, to be fair). Matrix functionality doesn't exist even though cars have come with those headlights since Q1 2021. One could argue that we're not entitled to any software updates post-purchase - like with non-Teslas - but that runs counter to one of the assumed USPs of the car, in my opinion. The lion share of software development seems to be focused on Full Self Driving (Beta) which we won't get a sniff of here for years.

All in all it feels like Tesla are resting on their laurels with the cars, when that's the opposite feeling I had about them when I bought mine. it is depressing to think about.

 

[DaveW]

My perspective on this is that I want to be upbeat about Tesla in so far as it impacts UK customers, but I'm finding it difficult, for the following reasons (in no particular order):

• "Full self driving" development has been non-existant in the UK/Europe. Literally nothing of substance has changed in the ~3 years I've owned my M3P. All I can actually remember happening is the car seeing speed limit signs, and "Traffic Light Stop and Go". This is very different to the picture that was painted when I bought the car (I was naive).
  
  
• ..consequently FSD (the option) feels like a massive scam. I keep telling myself not to think about how much I would have had I put that £5,800 in Tesla shares - for example - in March 2020 rather than an option that is almost completely crippled.
  
  
• None of the features in EAP/FSD - Summon, Autopark, NoA, etc have seen any material (UK/Europe) improvement since I've owned the car. Summon is hopeless, whereas Kia/Hyundai enjoy full remote summon & self parking from several metres away. Mercedes have level 3 lane keeping, several other prestige and non-prestige brands also have a version of lane keeping.
  
  
• Hardware just keeps getting downgraded or deleted for no good reason. This doesn't directly affect me because I haven't bought a new car, but I had been keen to consider "refreshing" my M3P with a new one, but whilst there have been things added (Ryzen, heatpump, heated steering wheel, etc) there have also been things just arbitrarily taken away for no good reason (passenger lumbar, USB data, ultrasonics). It feels to me like Tesla are testing the limits of what they can get away with without materially affecting actual demand.
  
  
• Software development seems almost entirely centred on gimmicks while fundamental things that don't work as well as on other, cheaper cars is left unfixed for months, or years. Auto wipers is still highly variable, auto headlights has only just recently been improved (substantially, to be fair). Matrix functionality doesn't exist even though cars have come with those headlights since Q1 2021. One could argue that we're not entitled to any software updates post-purchase - like with non-Teslas - but that runs counter to one of the assumed USPs of the car, in my opinion. The lion share of software development seems to be focused on Full Self Driving (Beta) which we won't get a sniff of here for years.

All in all it feels like Tesla are resting on their laurels with the cars, when that's the opposite feeling I had about them when I bought mine. it is depressing to think about.

I can fully understand being put out about FSD, or even EAP. Had two different Model 3 courtesy cars the other week, one had FSD and one had EAP (had to send the first one back as it was making a knocking noise over 60mph!), FSD wouldn't even engage NOAP for me, so was totally useless and EAP, when I did get NOAP working, it was more of a hassle than a help, badgering me about changing lanes to overtake when it knew I was about to come off the motorway.

I very nearly got EAP when getting my MYP, so glad I didn't bother. Wasn't going to do it on the M3P I got in 2019 as that was a lease car, even if FSD was half decent, I wouldn't have got the value from that.

Other than the ultrasonics, I can't say the other changes have worried me too much, I can understand how it might annoy others though. The heat pump, upgraded processor and heated steering wheel have made a big difference, the screen is a treat to use, everything is instant, never had a car with a heated steering wheel before, never knew I needed one until I had it . The heat pump has meant that the MYP is looking to be slightly more efficient than my older M3P, didn't think it would with the bigger/taller car and wheels.

Hopefully the FSD stack will make it over here, getting rid of a lot of the issues we face in regular AP and beyond, that would hopefully restore some "faith" in Tesla again, same with engineering their way out of the removal of USS.

There have been some nice small improvements, but yes, more 'fun' stuff than useful

 

[Obie]

Its not all bad at Tesla. Here are a couple of under hood comparison pictures between the Model Y and Ford Mach E with a Munrow video on the same subject, not biased but based on fact i think.

 

[Adopado]

The problem is the conflict of interests. He has a platform that reaches a decent number of people, which he will know, and he's a shareholder.

It's not in his best interests to be overly critical. I'm not saying he is likely to move the stock price of his own accord, but what he does post is likely to get picked up by other media outlets, and could as a whole have an effect.

I think fundamentally you can't really be objective - or trusted to be - if you have a financial interest in the stock going up.

There is definitely potential for a conflict of interests if Sandy Munro hides his shareholding and is seen to be promoting a company unfairly... but I think it's completely different if he is open about his investments and can clearly support his opinions with objective evidence. He doesn't come up with that evidence on his own, he has teams of engineers who carry out the work and write it up ... and it's then openly published! He couldn't get away with any level of misrepresentation without it being very very obvious. If validly expressed views influence the market I would think that's legitimate.

 

[DeejUK]

Hardware just keeps getting downgraded or deleted

I have similar sentiments to @Durzel. The last few times I've been on the motorway, it's been eastbound in the morning and westbound in the evening. Autopilot won't work eastbound in the morning, and won't lane-change to the right around midday. On the way home it won't work westbound, and of course if I come home earlier then lane-change won't work when I'm done passing someone. This is of course assuming it's sunny; if it's raining then it won't work at all because the cameras' views are obscured.

In my limited motorway driving, Autopilot has become non-functional in winter. It didn't used to be like this in the previous 5 years of owning my MX; maybe the Autipilot 2.5 'upgrade' was a bad idea.

 

[DeejUK]

...and FWIW, I miss being excited about Tesla. I was looking forward to the MYP for literally years. I remember showing my kids the self-driving demos, and saying to them that they might not need to bother with driving tests by the time they were old enough. I wanted a Cybertruck. I was expecting range to be much better ten years after I bought my first EV (and it is), but the increases since getting my MX haven't been so dramatic. It was nice being excited about Tesla's latest presentation, and believing that some of the cool stuff they were talking about might happen. It's a bit of a downer realising that it was mostly vapourware. Yes, I do not get out enough.

For all the people still loving the Tesla experience: please continue to do so. I genuinely don't want to spoil your fun. I think I started the thread to find out if I was alone in becoming disillusioned about what Tesla is doing as a company, and the experience of owning a Tesla.