Here Are A Few Indications Of Upcoming Tesla Model S/X Upgrade: Video

[TMC Staff]

How about a 120 kWh Model S and Model X and 400 miles (640 km) of range? As our recent attention was mostly focused on the Model 3 and Model Y, there are reasons to expect an upcoming significant upgrade to the Model S and Model X cars. Sean Mitchell, in one of his recent...
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[Cloxxki]

Hear me out.

New Roadster will have three motors, right? They'll have to be pretty strong ones.

Now, wouldn't they manage to get three smaller ones into S and X? Let's just imagine they manage to use the ones such as in the Model 3 as a rear motor. With the Performance ones, that's 3x211= 633kW. A suitable upgrade. With a 120kWh pack as I do feel should be child's play to Tesla, using smart fuses, I bet they might make all that for a short burst. The longer bursts would be roughly 50% more than 3PD, for 473kW in theory. With a relatively modest added mass and 50% more power, Model S would for sure haul.
To add to that, the Model 3 motors are really efficient. If they can be combined front and back (I've heard that might pose efficiency hurdles somehow due to lack of freewheeling?) that would reduce consumption and thus improve range even more. By now, those Model 3 rear motors ought to be really affordable.

Elon said there were no plans to stick 2170s into S and X. If true, what could the next S/X battery be made up of?
If they are conservative about more performance, they might consider 26700. Fewer cells to stack and solder but even with smart fuses and at 120kW, output power wouldn't be amazing.
There's also 22700 which might be a relative incremental change, just because they can.
I also like the ideal of going 18700. This would boost the current pack to 110kWh total even before any chemistry or layout change. Keep in mind, before Model 3 was launched, Elon and JB said they had +15% energy density at chemistry level, in the lab. That never made production though and what they did bring for Model 3 seems to offer only improved (dis?)charge rates.
With with 18700's and energy density focused cells, they could be over 125kWh total. That's using the same old small modules and cooling loops. Now with their new packaging insights and cooling tech, large modules, really to ought to be over 130kWh.
What 18mm cells do is help cooling and with it higher extended (dis)charge rates.
With with Model 3's tried and true chemistry and some smart fuses, a 120kWh pack out of 18700 seems well on the cards, and Panasonic might be able to retrofit their machines to keep shipping these. Charge rate? Around 400kW if the cabling is made ready for it.
120-130 kWh and efficient motors, that brings well over 400mi EPA range indeed. Needless, but very cool.

 

[Ostrichsak]

Three motors wouldn't make sense since it adds weight & cost plus the motors aren't the bottle neck as proven by the house rating debacle. The Roadster will be the first car with enough power to require three motors & it's going to take more than double of what today's P100D has in terms of kWh.

 

[Brando]

Continuous improvement - confuses some. IF you can "see" a change, I guess we call it a refresh.

NO competitor yet. What car is quicker to 60 or which are quicker to 1/4 mile - no other Sedan, right? and only million dollar sports cars come close, right? IF you have the best, why upgrade? Better to wait to see IF anyone will compete. why not?

Many still seem to confuse format with chemistry - two different features.

side note: when will/did model 3 out number Model S? Model 3 out number both Model S/X when? already happen??

 

[Jack007]

So I'm thinking they might wait for the S & X upgrade to when the solid state batteries are ready.

 

[jboy210]

First, does any YouTuber know more than any of us?

Second, I could see Tesla moving to a new battery pack at some date.

Third, Hopefully they may be able to even increase the range of existing batteries, like they did on the Model 3, with a software update.

 

[CameronB]

Whether any of your predictions pan out - or not - I appreciate the solid and thoughtful analysis. Nice work!

 

[turtlesz]

Would be nice to have more range on the X. Our 75D has all but been replaced by the Model 3 for long distances and going to areas with less abundant charging options. 400+ mile X would help range anxiety when going camping and such.

 

[CarlK]

Elon has said any new technology will be used in the S/X first. That apparently was not followed as the Model 3 has a few new tech that S/X does not have, such as battery and power/charging management system. Timing certainly plays a major role of it. Model 3 needs to be released before S/X has a chance to do major upgrade. I have to think there will be a few new stuff when it's S/X's turn.

 

[Brando]

Would be nice to have more range on the X. Our 75D has all but been replaced by the Model 3 for long distances and going to areas with less abundant charging options. 400+ mile X would help range anxiety when going camping and such.

SIDE NOTE: Rivian business plan, a side from direct sales, is to have destination chargers at more remote camping areas and sell all inclusive vacation packages including rental of their vehicles. I don't quite get it, but they seem to think it is a plan to set them apart and generate extra business, not just compete against all other SUV/Truck products.

Long way to say, Rivian may be installing the chargers you are looking for your Model X.

 

[CarlK]

There are more Tesla destination charger than you probably realize. I'm sure there are a lot more than Rivian could ever install. Check the Tesla destination charger map or call up places you plan to go. Some of them that have chargers may not even on that map or they could have non-Tesla chargers that you can use with an adapter.

 

[Sharpgt]

All of the above is guesswork but I can’t imagine Tesla not updating the batteries in the S/X to the cells found in the 3. They have already met their commitment to Panasonic for battery purchases and the larger cells with more efficient motors should extend the range close to 400 miles. I have a Porsche Taycan on order but hope Tesla refreshes/updates the S so I can buy another one instead of the Porsche. Despite all of the advantages offered by Tesla I wouldn’t want two identical cars but wouldn’t mind an “older” 2017 and a refreshed 2020. PS I also have a Y on order but would prefer an improved S. I hope Elon is listening

 

[Brando]

All of the above is guesswork but I can’t imagine Tesla not updating the batteries in the S/X to the cells found in the 3. They have already met their commitment to Panasonic for battery purchases and the larger cells with more efficient motors should extend the range close to 400 miles. I have a Porsche Taycan on order but hope Tesla refreshes/updates the S so I can buy another one instead of the Porsche. Despite all of the advantages offered by Tesla I wouldn’t want two identical cars but wouldn’t mind an “older” 2017 and a refreshed 2020. PS I also have a Y on order but would prefer an improved S. I hope Elon is listening

wow, not even 2 years old (june 2017 P90D introduced)
Don't you have 8 year drivetrain warranty?? and all other parts are at least 4 years, right?
Perhaps you should just save up for a Roadster - keep your 2017 for 8 years.
Anyway, thanks for helping to support the used market.

good luck and enjoy !

 

[Cloxxki]

wow, not even 2 years old (june 2017 P90D introduced)
Don't you have 8 year drivetrain warranty?? and all other parts are at least 4 years, right?
Perhaps you should just save up for a Roadster - keep your 2017 for 8 years.
Anyway, thanks for helping to support the used market.

good luck and enjoy !

You trusted the wrong source, must be new to Tesla ;-)
Example link:
Tesla Now Offers Ludicrous Retrofit For Model S P90D

 

[AwlBidnz]

Would anyone on this thread be able to pontificate on the possibility of a CCS adapter for the S & X?

 

[sandpiper]

I’m not sure that I can ‘pontificate’ but it will
absolutely happen. Somebody showed a photo of it in another thread. As to timing, who knows? I expect it will be released at the same time that the S/X are revised with built in dual ports, like you see on the 3s in Europe. As to when that will be, I’d say within 6 months for sure, but that’s just a guess.