My takeaway is that GM has delayed introduction of Super Cruise until it actually worked reliably. What a concept! Are you listening, Tesla?
-
Want to remove ads? Register an account and login to see fewer ads, and become a Supporting Member to remove almost all ads.
Your takeaway should probably be that GM has delayed introduction of Super Cruise, period. There's no evidence w/ regards to how reliable it will be when released.
do you take the same stance when Elon/Tesla delayed any one of its billionth features that he at some point promised?
or did you repeat elon's excuses and promises verbatim...i highly distaste hypo-critics.
Last edited:
And by association... how does someone live with themselves after they allow the car to make decisions for them, which causes an accident where one of their passengers - a friend or family member - dies. AP2 does lots of crazy things, not the least of which is throwing your vehicle into the opposite lane of traffic which has been documented numerous times. One day that will cause a head-on collision. A human driver in the same situation would likely not have caused this.
Skotty
2014 S P85 | 2023 F-150L
What's missing here is patience and actual statistics. I think pro-self-driving folks are often overly optimistic about capabilities and timelines. Some say Tesla lies. I don't think they do. I think they are just overly optimistic and can't meet their own ambitions as stated.
The important matter for self driving or autopilot technology in the wild is that the statistics show it is generally safer than human driving. But even then, you have to ask yourself, are you an average driver? If you are an above average driver, you may still be better than autopilot or self driving technology. Neither will ever be entirely flawless, and crashes will happen in both cases. It's just a question of trying to accurately assess the risks of you driving versus the car driving itself, and accepting those risks and whatever consequences may result.
If you crash when AP or self driving would not have, do you lament that you didn't turn over the driving to the car? If you crash when AP or self driving is driving and you would not have, do you lament that you didn't drive yourself? It's all hindsight. Sometimes $*** happens. You just have to assess the risks as best you can, make the call, and live with the result, good or bad.
The important matter for self driving or autopilot technology in the wild is that the statistics show it is generally safer than human driving. But even then, you have to ask yourself, are you an average driver? If you are an above average driver, you may still be better than autopilot or self driving technology. Neither will ever be entirely flawless, and crashes will happen in both cases. It's just a question of trying to accurately assess the risks of you driving versus the car driving itself, and accepting those risks and whatever consequences may result.
If you crash when AP or self driving would not have, do you lament that you didn't turn over the driving to the car? If you crash when AP or self driving is driving and you would not have, do you lament that you didn't drive yourself? It's all hindsight. Sometimes $*** happens. You just have to assess the risks as best you can, make the call, and live with the result, good or bad.
I do. I don't tend to comment on the reliability of any unreleased feature of EAP or that of FSD as a whole(as it's entirely unreleased). To that point, I don't recall ever seeing any positive claim about the reliability of future updates/features by anyone else either(other than Musk, himself). The people making claims about how reliable it will be tend to be those claiming it won't work.
And I highly distaste tu quoque arguments.
JeffK
Well-Known Member
Exactly, I can claim as fact that with regards to FSD hardware that in the future cameras will still work like cameras and radar will still work like radar.
I can also claim that Tesla has said that, if need be, the unit which is performing the inferences, in this case a custom DrivePX2 based board is easily upgradable.
We can also use statistics to measure performance of a neural network.
To be absolutely clear, we cannot use statistics to measure the performance of a neural network that does not yet exist
JeffK
Well-Known Member
To be absolutely clear, we cannot use statistics to measure the performance of a neural network that does not yet exist
Sure, but we can use statistics to measure the performance of any networks that do exist. We can also test the ones for self driving in shadow mode without negatively impacting drivers.
There are several models that do exist already though (object detection).
Is that implying you work for Tesla? If so, then I'll defer to your insider knowledge. If not, then we can't test anything; only Tesla has knowledge of what is/isn't in that data.
JeffK
Well-Known Member
We humans, we researchers, and no, not just Tesla.
You can go take some random footage of a road and run it through any self driving or partially self driving networks (ADAS) and measure results. George Hotz was doing this with cell phone footage.
You can go to openAI get some tools and even do this with video games.
Ok... I'm lost. I was just saying we can't say anything about the reliability of future EAP/FSD features that have not yet been made by Tesla.
JeffK
Well-Known Member
Yes, you are lost. You are concerned with only the software in which stats will be given to regulating bodies before it's ever allowed to drive itself.
You seem to not believe in statistics. Just because you, personally, don't have insight into the proprietary data doesn't make it any more or less effective.
Tesla's rebuttal - Why would we do it, when our customer can be our beta testers?
Well what they got at the moment is a $3,500 option.
Cadillac | 2018 CT6 Sedan - Build Your Own
Can't wait for them to add the Super Cruise features:
Cadillac Super Cruise™ Sets the Standard for Hands-Free Highway Driving
They're gonna have "Precision LiDAR Map Data". Man, that's like Trust On A Stick!
Cadillac | 2018 CT6 Sedan - Build Your Own
Can't wait for them to add the Super Cruise features:
Cadillac Super Cruise™ Sets the Standard for Hands-Free Highway Driving
They're gonna have "Precision LiDAR Map Data". Man, that's like Trust On A Stick!
Last edited:
Wow, so super cruise map restricted to highways? Maybe Tesla ought to do that, I'd love to see the anger threads then...
Similar threads
