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Honest review of the wheel

Hayseed_MS

Spreader of "Endless Non Sequitur"
Jan 19, 2021
2,860
12,329
Strongbadia
It's funny (or not) that 4 to 1 owner reviews of the Yoke are positive, yet 1 in 4 of unbiased reviews are negative. I guess when you own it, at over $100K, it better be good! Just funny how perception changes based on the interest in the vehicle. Have driven the yoke several times. If I were to buy one, absolutely would be changing it to one of the after market options for a full wheel. I use the top half of the wheel almost exclusively in my most comfortable driving position.

I missed the poll - where did you get these numbers from?

I placed my order before the refresh was even announced. When I found it would have the yoke, I was very skeptical about it working - even to the point of looking elsewhere. Took me two blocks of driving and no issues again. I never have driven in the top half of the wheel so no missy there. Over 34k miles in 10 months over 15 states and various terrains. Several roundabouts daily. No issues. No miss of the stalks, horn, etc. The one miss I did have was I hit the right turn signal to advance the next song.

I switch back and forth with a couple "normal" cars. No issues. My family drives for me when on trips - they both have those life-saving round wheels and gas cars. Not one near miss or issue switching back and forth.

If I did not like the yoke, I would get rid of the car, not just type justifications to strangers on the internut. I owe you guys zero reasons why I do what I do but I do post my personal experience on this one to inform those on the fence that there is a lot of hyperbole and robe tearing on the yoke. It is not inherently unsafe or difficult to use. Decide if it is right for you or not and move on in one direction or the other.

Besides saw this on reddit - how could you argue with this advantage?
1651840745194.png
 
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It's funny (or not) that 4 to 1 owner reviews of the Yoke are positive, yet 1 in 4 of unbiased reviews are negative. I guess when you own it, at over $100K, it better be good! Just funny how perception changes based on the interest in the vehicle. Have driven the yoke several times. If I were to buy one, absolutely would be changing it to one of the after market options for a full wheel. I use the top half of the wheel almost exclusively in my most comfortable driving position.
That's totally expected. The people who buy a Model S with a yoke are a self selecting group - if you hate it, why would you buy the car? By default the people who buy the cars are those who are at least open to trying it.

Well, I haven’t used the yoke IRL yet, but, I would point out that these frustrations about “having to pull into traffic partway to get a view” demonstrates why a first-principles approach to (at least) camera placement (for FSD) would be optimal. If placed at the corners of the vehicle, the situational awareness would be fantastic.

As far as this frustration, idk, I would feel the edge of the screen with my right hand?
My biggest concern and complaint with the yoke is not the yoke itself but Tesla's baffling decision to get rid of the stalks for the turn signal and gear shifting. I've used enough 'automatic' systems (on Teslas and otherwise) to know that they get things wrong on a regular basis. A fundamental advantage of physical controls is the tactile feed back you get and the ability to operate them without actually looking at them. (or moving your hand from the steering wheel in this case) Given the fact that you frequently are shifting at times when you have a lot to keep track of (backing out of a parking space in a busy parking lot,) anything that makes you think more or otherwise distracts you is a significant drawback.

Of course the final question with this is "why?" What advantage is there to removing the turn signal and gear shift stalks?
 

DayTrippin

Active Member
Supporting Member
Apr 30, 2021
1,528
1,772
Park Cities, TX
Well, I haven’t used the yoke IRL yet, but, I would point out that these frustrations about “having to pull into traffic partway to get a view” demonstrates why a first-principles approach to (at least) camera placement (for FSD) would be optimal. If placed at the corners of the vehicle, the situational awareness would be fantastic.

As far as this frustration, idk, I would feel the edge of the screen with my right hand?
Either more forward for existing cameras, or more cameras would help. I almost had the nose taken off my S yesterday because of the inability to see approach traffic from the side and no way to quickly reverse. Situational awareness is an area where Tesla clearly lags other companies.

Trying to find the area around the screen in a hurry and without looking is almost impossible. It isn't just a simple swipe up or down anywhere on the left side of the screen. You have to start at a certain point (at least on my screen) and make sure your finger moves far enough, up or down, to engage the appropriate "gear". This is a total cluster of an implementation. Lucky you for those who have a perfect environment and never have to reverse quickly or make a lot of 3 point turns. Turns requiring more than about 90° of turning input aren't very comfortable as a result of the yoke.

I have to say I enjoy driving my 3 a lot more every day because of how adversely the yoke and elimination of stalks impact me. The implementation of the yoke adds a lot more friction to the driving experience for me than any supposed benefits it provides. If there is ever a factory supported retrofit option I'll toss the yoke in a second. This is about my only area of buyer's remorse with the car. I don't care that I don't have the newer lights, or tilting screen. While I am more accustomed to the yoke every day, at the same time every time I drive the 3 it reminds me again of how much I dislike the yoke/lack of stalks.

Add variable ratio to the steering, better control design and gear selection, I would live happily living with the yoke. Tesla totally choked on the implementation of the yoke.
 
I have a Model S and a Model 3P.
Everytime I get in the Model 3 I'm frustrated. Dumfounded at the decisions tesla made. AutoPilot on the Model S is on the left, on the Model 3, it is on the right. There are more differences that stump you for a few miles. Minimalism by using the Drive Train stock for autopilot when driving is lazy manufacturing and dangerous for first time drivers. I'd rather have a dedicated cruise/autopilot stock on the left. I hate the turn signals system and the "light touch". I want to click down for left, click and hold up for right. I find myself accidentally leaving a turn signal on like driver newbie. Kinda like TP stuck on the shoe at a school dance. Thanks Tesla. I also don't like the small wheel on the Model 3. However! the Model 3p is the best performance sports sedan ever! Aside from those things, it is such a blast to drive. I think they just cut too many corners on the haptic feedback stalk and physical buttons on the 3. My wife still doesn't know how to open the glove compartment after two years of driving it! lol.
 
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In our Model Y, when I change lanes I frequently end up in a game of right blinker - left blinker - right blinker
This isn’t a problem with stalks. My Jeep’s turn signal has the soft and hard activation. But when you move it to the second position, it physically stays there while the blinker is on. To cancel it, you move it back to the middle position.

Tesla just has their dumb engineers working on the interior.
 
This isn’t a problem with stalks. My Jeep’s turn signal has the soft and hard activation. But when you move it to the second position, it physically stays there while the blinker is on. To cancel it, you move it back to the middle position.

Tesla just has their dumb engineers working on the interior.

To stop it from blinking you can actually push it half way down or up, or push it all the way up in the opposite direction. Again, not that tough and pushing it half way up in the opposite direction seems pretty intuitive to me.
 
You don't need to quote yourself. I read your post and you're wrong. There's tons of existing research showing that modes are bad. Pressing the left stick halfway can either turn the blinker on temporarily, or cancel the current blinker. The same physical action is overloaded to perform different tasks, with no haptic feedback indicating which.

The same thing with the right lever. Pressing down can put the car in drive, or engage cruise control, or my favorite, do nothing because the car was still rolling backwards a little too fast and it decided to just stay in reverse. It's awesome when you hit the accelerator expecting to go forward and the car accelerates in reverse.
 
You don't need to quote yourself. I read your post and you're wrong. There's tons of existing research showing that modes are bad. Pressing the left stick halfway can either turn the blinker on temporarily, or cancel the current blinker. The same physical action is overloaded to perform different tasks, with no haptic feedback indicating which.

The same thing with the right lever. Pressing down can put the car in drive, or engage cruise control, or my favorite, do nothing because the car was still rolling backwards a little too fast and it decided to just stay in reverse. It's awesome when you hit the accelerator expecting to go forward and the car accelerates in reverse.
Nope. Not wrong - I just checked again and what I wrote is correct. On our 11 year old odyssey you press the stalk half way down and it blinks once. If you press it further down it stays on until you've completed the turn or you push it up to turn it off. Just like the Tesla. Whether the stalk physically remains in the down position or not is really of no consequence.

As for the right stalk, it controls the gear and cruise control. You say you've had the car remain in reverse because it was rolling too fast? First, how fast are you backing out, second did you not bother to listen to the warning chime that alerts you to the fact that it didn't switch gears? (I just tried this to verify and you have to have reasonable speed for it not to switch.) It's the same chime you get if you forget to put your foot on the brake before shifting into gear.

Edit: I had an Audi A4 with electronic transmission prior to this and while the gear shifter was on the center console it behaved in exactly the same way - if you tried to shift into drive or reverse and you were going too fast it would beep to let you know it couldn't change gears.

Honestly, I've never had an issue with any of these and have a hard time understanding why they should be that difficult for anyone. Teslas aren't perfect, but these are pretty much non-issues.
 
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I have a Model S and a Model 3P.
Everytime I get in the Model 3 I'm frustrated. Dumfounded at the decisions tesla made. AutoPilot on the Model S is on the left, on the Model 3, it is on the right. ...
Glad Tesla has solved it. The new S/X doesn't have any stalks, so nothing to get confused about going between other vehicles. My guess is within 2 years all Tesla models will eliminate the stalks. Saves money and confusion. Seems every manufacturer goes a different way with stalks, and often even the same brand uses different designs across models and years. Just the way it's been. Agree it is far from ideal for any brand, but I like Tesla's new stalkless design.
 
Glad Tesla has solved it. The new S/X doesn't have any stalks, so nothing to get confused about going between other vehicles. My guess is within 2 years all Tesla models will eliminate the stalks. Saves money and confusion. Seems every manufacturer goes a different way with stalks, and often even the same brand uses different designs across models and years. Just the way it's been. Agree it is far from ideal for any brand, but I like Tesla's new stalkless design.
Hope not or my next tesla will be a kia
 

DayTrippin

Active Member
Supporting Member
Apr 30, 2021
1,528
1,772
Park Cities, TX
It wouldn't be terrible getting rid of the stalks IF they had actually put some thought into it. The gearshift design is completely stupid and a safety hazard.

If you have been driving for more than a year, I'd bet there has been at least one time you've had to hurry a gear change from either forward or reverse or vice versa. Trying doing that quickly in the S without taking your eyes off the road and you'll see what a frickin' stupid design it is.

Let's count the ways the gear shifting is stupid (abbreviated list):
  • Have to take your eyes off the road to execute
  • Have to be very precise where you initiate the command
  • Have to move your finger a long way to execute
  • No tactile feedback, not really sure if you engaged the gear without looking at the screen
  • Not easy to execute if you have to turn the wheel
  • Seems less responsive when the temps in the car are cold
  • Backup method is very kludgy (on the console). Heaven help you if you don't know the trick of tapping both wheel buttons to get it console shifter to illuminate. You could fumble around for a long time to get them to activate by touch
  • The auto direction is clueless a lot of the time. See photo below. This was the direction it chose to go based on the circumstance

IMG_3650.jpg


As is obvious to see, going forward is not an option. Didn't stop the car from choosing it. Just 30 minutes earlier I had an even more obvious one and it still wanted me to drive forward. As you can see, the red line is the object in close proximity and it still wants to go forward. Obviously the ultrasonic sensors aren't an input for the auto direction selection. Appears they aren't but should be.

This should be added to Tesla's greatest hits of what they clearly get wrong. The broke something that didn't need to be fixed. What benefit did we get from it?
 
It wouldn't be terrible getting rid of the stalks IF they had actually put some thought into it. The gearshift design is completely stupid and a safety hazard.

If you have been driving for more than a year, I'd bet there has been at least one time you've had to hurry a gear change from either forward or reverse or vice versa. Trying doing that quickly in the S without taking your eyes off the road and you'll see what a frickin' stupid design it is.

Let's count the ways the gear shifting is stupid (abbreviated list):
  • Have to take your eyes off the road to execute
  • Have to be very precise where you initiate the command
  • Have to move your finger a long way to execute
  • No tactile feedback, not really sure if you engaged the gear without looking at the screen
  • Not easy to execute if you have to turn the wheel
  • Seems less responsive when the temps in the car are cold
  • Backup method is very kludgy (on the console). Heaven help you if you don't know the trick of tapping both wheel buttons to get it console shifter to illuminate. You could fumble around for a long time to get them to activate by touch
  • The auto direction is clueless a lot of the time. See photo below. This was the direction it chose to go based on the circumstance

View attachment 806346

As is obvious to see, going forward is not an option. Didn't stop the car from choosing it. Just 30 minutes earlier I had an even more obvious one and it still wanted me to drive forward. As you can see, the red line is the object in close proximity and it still wants to go forward. Obviously the ultrasonic sensors aren't an input for the auto direction selection. Appears they aren't but should be.

This should be added to Tesla's greatest hits of what they clearly get wrong. The broke something that didn't need to be fixed. What benefit did we get from it?
The current stalks in the 3 are fine they could use a knob that spins on the end to increase the wiper speed.
 
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strider

Active Member
Oct 20, 2010
4,068
1,896
NE Oklahoma
Well, I just wanted to come over here and stir the pot. I drove my Refresh X for 9 days before my Hansshow wheel arrived. The Yoke is a joke. It provides ZERO benefit (I have never had an issue seeing the IC in our pre-Refresh MSs nor do I have an issue now with the Hansshow wheel) while making you adapt to it. I have been on the Refresh threads for months while waiting on my car and nearly everyone talks about how they "got used to it." You shouldn't have to "get used to" a primary control. It should just let you control the car. Numerous times I would go to grab the wheel and nothing was there. When making a turn I like to let the wheel slide in my hand as it is centering. I can very precisely control the speed of this by squeezing or relaxing my grip. Further, my hand is on the wheel if I need to make a steering input. With the yoke this is not possible. I ended up with my arms crossed or driving with one arm extended multiple times.

The simple choice would be to do what Lexus is doing and make it an option. We do have that cryptic screenshot from the config tool that shows a Wheel option for the S/X but it's been months and no option is in sight.

I can tell you there is a very strong cognitive bias to be happy with something for which you have just paid a ton of money. Also, humans are quite adaptable creatures - it is why we have moved up to the top of the animal kingdom. So we can certainly "make it work." But for me, the last thing I want to think about is how to steer my car. Thankfully, the aftermarket has given me an option. Am I happy about spending an extra $1,600 on my car? No, but I knew I was going to make this mod before I ordered my car so I view it as part of the price.
 
It's funny (or not) that 4 to 1 owner reviews of the Yoke are positive, yet 1 in 4 of unbiased reviews are negative. I guess when you own it, at over $100K, it better be good! Just funny how perception changes based on the interest in the vehicle. Have driven the yoke several times. If I were to buy one, absolutely would be changing it to one of the after market options for a full wheel. I use the top half of the wheel almost exclusively in my most comfortable driving position.
So if 25% still buy a Tesla with the joke despite they don't like it, than could be 75% or even more of Tesla top luxury car demand to be vanished because of the joke ... I'd met and heard a lot from people they gave up Model S purchase because of the joke (it's literally a dangerous joke for me).

Just imagine the Model X demand without the joke and falcon! It could be 10 times higher.
 

DayTrippin

Active Member
Supporting Member
Apr 30, 2021
1,528
1,772
Park Cities, TX
So if 25% still buy a Tesla with the joke despite they don't like it, than could be 75% or even more of Tesla top luxury car demand to be vanished because of the joke ... I'd met and heard a lot from people they gave up Model S purchase because of the joke (it's literally a dangerous joke for me).

Just imagine the Model X demand without the joke and falcon! It could be 10 times higher.
While I disagree with the actual %'s, I do agree with the thought. In retrospect, I probably would have pushed off my order until a wheel was available.

As for the falcon wing doors, that 100% kept me from even thinking about ordering one.

I strongly believe the yoke will repel more people than it will attract in its current state. I am giving up and going to order a Hansshow wheel and hope a solution will appear to get the stalks back that is supported by Tesla at some point.
 

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