IDLE Fees questions

[Mayhem]

So idle fees are figured based on the fullness of the SC.

Is that when I start to charge or when the charge is finished?

Let's say I pull up to SC with 8 stalls. Only 1 other Tesla there. I've got 45 min until done so I go eat. Dinner takes a bit longer and I don't get back until 60 min has elapsed. When I get back to the SC, 5 of the stalls are full. Did I just get charged for 15min idle and not know it?

What about the reverse? While eating, I'm freaking out about being late as I'm getting close to full on the app and the SC was 5/8 full when I plugged in. I ask for check early and run out leaving cash on the table only to get to the SC and find out everyone else has done and left. I rushed out and panicked for nothing.

Guess what I really want to know is will I know for sure via the app when I'm going to get charged an idle fee so I can know how urgently to get going if I'm not physically waiting in the car.

It would be nice if while SC'ing the app displayed the current occupied/available stalls. Or is there some other way it lets you know?

 

[KJD]

Sounds like you are making a mountain out of a mole hill aren't you ?

Is it really that hard to move your car when it's done ?

 

[EVSteve]

This is why the supercharger availability should be visible on the mobile app.

Iirc idle feels accumulate if all stalls are full and your vehicle is not drawing power. If a stall opens up the idle fee pauses.

 

[Mayhem]

Sounds like you are making a mountain out of a mole hill aren't you ?

Is it really that hard to move your car when it's done ?

Not making a big deal of this. Totally not hard to move car when done. The app dings and tells me my charge is done. I go to car. Not looking to park there.

I just don't want rush if not needed to, or be hit with an idle fee if I'm not expecting it. That's all.

 

[zanary]

I think the short answer is. When you're done charging, if it's more than 50% occupied then it's $1/minute after the 5 minute grace period with a forfeit of the 5 minute grace period at the 6 minute mark, otherwise it's the $0.40/minute after there 5 minute grace period with a forfeit of the 5 minutes grace period at the 6 minute mark.

And yes, there is no way of knowing how busy the charging stations are at the competition of charging.

The goal is for you to not guess how busy it is to delay when you vacate the charging spot, but to encourage proper charging etiquette by moving your Tesla when charging is done regardless of how busy the station is or how inconvenience it is for you to walk over to your Tesla and move it.

There will always be situations where you can't make it over within the 5 minutes, and that's OK. Those situations come with a monetary penalty and unfortunately that is the reality of things.

... as someone said on TMC... you gotta pay to play

 

[SageBrush]

I also think this is much ado about nothing, but people could set the car to charge up to something less than 100% and when completed ask for a few more percent.

Say, 80% up to 85%

 

[ewoodrick]

I think the short answer is. When you're done charging, if it's more than 50% occupied then it's $1/minute after the 5 minute grace period with a forfeit of the 5 minute grace period at the 6 minute mark, otherwise it's the $0.40/minute after there 5 minute grace period with a forfeit of the 5 minutes grace period at the 6 minute mark.

And yes, there is no way of knowing how busy the charging stations are at the competition of charging.

The goal is for you to not guess how busy it is to delay when you vacate the charging spot, but to encourage proper charging etiquette by moving your Tesla when charging is done regardless of how busy the station is or how inconvenience it is for you to walk over to your Tesla and move it.

There will always be situations where you can't make it over within the 5 minutes, and that's OK. Those situations come with a monetary penalty and unfortunately that is the reality of things.

... as someone said on TMC... you gotta pay to play

I'll second this one. The reason why we have the nag is because people take things to the limit. It you are at ANY Supercharger and the car is full, please move it. Also remember that the Supercharger maps sometimes show some sites as occupied, when they aren't. So there are probably sites that will show 50% when no one is there.

Just move the car!!! Be polite to others that need to charge.

 

[Mayhem]

It's funny when you ask a question about idle fees and all you get is soapboxers telling you how you should behave, when you don't actually disagree with their point of view. Sheesh. Is everyone looking to argue something or trying to lecture someone? Answer my questions or simply move on.... please. @ewoodrick , @zanary

I've seen the a-holes at SC's ruining it for folks and my goal is not to game the system. My goal is how to be best informed on how to react when my charge is done. And to that point, I think the app needs the bars (% occupied like in the nav) so you know if idle fees would be applicable or not.

 

[SageBrush]

My goal is how to be best informed on how to react when my charge is done. And to that point, I think the app needs the bars (% occupied like in the nav) so you know if idle fees would be applicable or not.

The occupied slots data is not accurate. But even if it was, once occupancy approaches 50% an idler is increasing the likelihood of dropping the charge rate for someone else. So good advice is still: plan to not idle.

I take it further and only charge what I need to get to a destination charger (e.g. home) or the next Supercharger if on a trip. My behavior has a few reasons but they obviate any concern or interest over idling charges.

---
I'm curious: what is your charge percent setting, and why ?
Do you charge opportunistically (meaning because it is available, unrelated to immediate need) ?

 

[Mayhem]

I'm curious: what is your charge percent setting, and why ?

My 'Home' %age is 90%. I have 2 HPWC in my garage. When road-tripping I do like you -- just enough to get to the next station (plus a ~30mi buffer for unexpected rerouting of traffic, etc)... Unless I'm stopping to eat while SC'ing. Then I put it up to 90% again to give me time to eat without fretting about getting charged a fee (hence my question). I have in the past done the trick of bumping to 92, 94%, etc if I can't break away from the meal right away ("Geez, where's the waitress with my check!?!") -- but that has been quite rare. Usually I stick to fast food so I can leave right away whenever the app tells me its done or I'm finished eating.

 

[SageBrush]

Usually I stick to fast food so I can leave right away whenever the app tells me its done or I'm finished eating.

Then you are a more considerate person than me. I would not make that sacrifice.
I would however just walk out to the car and move it when I had enough charge, +/- a few minutes for my convenience. One additional advantage of not charging to a high SoC is a more dependable charge rate. I pretty much know how long the charge time will be without relying on the app. Not foolproof of course due to possible sharing.

 

[Graffi]

So far I have gotten the "Charging Complete" message only once. When traveling I set the charge limit to 90% as I usually only charge enough to get to the next Supercharger plus 10-20% for reserve, depending on what is ahead. In this case I just changed the charging level to 100% and we finished our meal, walked back and unplugged prior to completion. I think is was around 95%. In either case, we had more than enough time to get back without rushing or leaving our meal uneaten.

If you go to a restaurant that took way to long to get your food, then just let the wait staff know you will be back soon, then go move your car while it continues to charge (per above).

Oh, and to answer the OP's question, it is my understanding that you are charged the idle fee if it is plugged in while the Supercharger station is greater than 50% in use, so that would be at the time you are sitting idle while being plugged in, not how full it is when you arrive.

 

[Mayhem]

Then you are a more considerate person than me. I would not make that sacrifice.
I would however just walk out to the car and move it when I had enough charge, +/- a few minutes for my convenience. One additional advantage of not charging to a high SoC is a more dependable charge rate. I pretty much know how long the charge time will be without relying on the app. Not foolproof of course due to possible sharing.

Well, not really a sacrifice... I kinda like quite a few FF places (where's my CHICK-FIL-A and TACO BELL peeps!), lol.

 

[LMichel]

I received this notice for the first time over the weekend. Idle fee of what would have been 9 minutes worth - Except that this is a test/grace period while they work out the details. AND except that the SC was less than 50%. Still, was a pretty strong warning.
You guys in California have a whole different view of SC crowding than many of us in the Northeast. The SCs I mainly use (Rochester, NY and Binghampton, NY) have NEVER been anywhere near half full. In fact, it's rare that I even see another Tesla there!
Given the fact that SC saturation is not an issue out here; I'm NOT running out to my car to move it, just so there can be 10 empty spaces instead of nine!
On the other hand; I've charged in Paramus NJ, which is always crowded during the day. At this location, I think I would stay right with my car or just go get take out and bring it back.
Common sense...

Lastly, what do you think of starting the idle fee (regardless of occupancy) if you are using the nose-in charger? Not absolutely sure that Tesla can identify the nose-in charger at each SC though...

 

[ljbad4life]

I received this notice for the first time over the weekend. Idle fee of what would have been 9 minutes worth - Except that this is a test/grace period while they work out the details. AND except that the SC was less than 50%. Still, was a pretty strong warning.
You guys in California have a whole different view of SC crowding than many of us in the Northeast. The SCs I mainly use (Rochester, NY and Binghampton, NY) have NEVER been anywhere near half full. In fact, it's rare that I even see another Tesla there!
Given the fact that SC saturation is not an issue out here; I'm NOT running out to my car to move it, just so there can be 10 empty spaces instead of nine!
On the other hand; I've charged in Paramus NJ, which is always crowded during the day. At this location, I think I would stay right with my car or just go get take out and bring it back.
Common sense...

Lastly, what do you think of starting the idle fee (regardless of occupancy) if you are using the nose-in charger? Not absolutely sure that Tesla can identify the nose-in charger at each SC though...

I've made it to the car before the five minutes were up (That only happened once). My phone was on silent and I didn't see the notification pop up while at a restaurant at the Egg Harbor supercharger . The service was unbearably slow. I quietly told the waiter that I had to move my car and was back in 2 minutes. Would it have sucked to have been charged an idle fee (the supercharger was completely empty)? Yes, but it's only a buck. I can see people really abusing the superchargers that are located near shopping centers/malls/outlets during holiday shopping times to find convenient parking spots or charge while they go shopping for hours. I learned my lesson to keep my phone on vibrate or sound turned on when I'm traveling.

I've charged in Paramus, NJ and now I make sure to skip it on my travels (I can charge faster at a non packed supercharger).

 

[Mayhem]

Wouldn't it be great if the app notification went something like "Charging completed. Based on current occupancy idle fees are not being assessed at this time" or if it is over half saying "Charge completed. Based on current occupancy idle fees will be assessed if car is not moved in 5 min." ???

Or a separate notification if/when idle fees would be assessed... " Supercharger station is now over 50% full. Idle fees will begin accruing if car is not moved within 5 min."

 

[LMichel]

Yes,
That's exactly what I want.
Just let me know that occupancy just reached 50% and I'll run right out to my car and move it.
Based on the occupancy of SCs I use, I wouldn't expect to see such a notification for years.

 

[Graffi]

The above sounds nice, but the point has always been that these spots are not for parking, but charging only. And for most of us, the amount of charge should ALMOST NEVER be to 100%.

Therefore NEVER pull in and plug in unless you are able to move the car once you get the charge you need. Even if you are the only car there you should just plan to move the car when you get the charge you need. To do otherwise defeats the purpose of these spots. just my feeling on the matter.

 

[LMichel]

Yeah... I'm gonna drop what I'm doing and schlep out across the frozen tundra of the mall parking lot just because my car hit 100 percent and is the only one sitting there. Dream on San Diego!

 

[Graffi]

Yeah... I'm gonna drop what I'm doing and schlep out across the frozen tundra of the mall parking lot just because my car hit 100 percent and is the only one sitting there. Dream on San Diego!

Then do not plan to stay in the mall for hours. Plan to stay for the length of time you need to charge. This way you are going back to the car, not to move it, but to continue your journey.