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Kickstarter Level 2 charger: $109-$329

Discussion in 'Model S: Battery & Charging' started by SteveW25561, Jun 26, 2013.

  1. SteveW25561

    SteveW25561 Member

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    I just found this Kickstarter campaign for an open source EV charger -- it supplies up to 15 kW / 60A charging. The units range from $109 for a basic kit with no LCD to an assembled premium kit for $329 which includes an LCD screen, charging info, time of day programming, GFI and output protection.

    You still need to add input and output connections, including the J1772 cable, but this seems like a really interesting project.

    What do people think about this?

    Check it out at:
    EMW JuiceBox - an Open Source Level 2 EV Charging Station by Electric Motor Werks (EMW) Kickstarter

    I have no affiliation with them...
     
  2. mckemie

    mckemie Member

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    I'm in for an assembled version. I have had one of their 10kw (now 12kw) chargers for one of my conversions for about a year. I'm using a 30 amp EVSE on my S, previously used on my Leaf. I hope to charge the Tesla with 40 amps from the new EVSE. The attraction of using regular J1772 EVSEs is that I can leave my Tesla supplied cabling in the car. Not have to unpack and pack for every charge. Note that the J1772 cable is likely to cost an additional $250 or so.

    Does anyone know if a twin charger S can be charged with a 70 amp EVSE through the J1772 adapter?
     
  3. Cosmacelf

    Cosmacelf Active Member

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    Yes it can - that's one of the attractions of getting a twin charger - it isn't only for the HPWC.
     
  4. Cosmacelf

    Cosmacelf Active Member

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    I think it's a great idea. Current J1772 chargers strike me as way too expensive for what you get. I hope they succeed.
     
  5. Rifleman

    Rifleman Now owns 2 Model S's!!!

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    I am probably going to get one to have a portable L2 charger for my Volt. I have a few friends with 30 amp outlets in their garages or barns, but allways end up plugged into a 110 outlet due to a lack of a portable l2 charger. If I could put this together for around $200-$300, it would be worth it.
     
  6. PhilBa

    PhilBa Active Member

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    I watched the cheesy video and looked at their stuff. For the most part, this isn't really applicable for a Tesla. Also, I don't see how they are getting more than 40A without hard wiring the charger. There is no consumer grade outlet that is rated for more than 40A continuous. They seem to gloss over this issue. Before springing $$ for this gizmo, I suggest people understand charger options for your car. The Tesla already has a built in charger(s). The UMC that comes with your Tesla is perfectly fine for connecting to an outlet and there are adapters for most plugs out there.
     
  7. mnx

    mnx 2013 P85

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    If I were to get one of these, I'd either hard wire it or put a NEMA 14-60 plug on the end. (good for 48A continuous). Looks like it could be cheaper than a spare UMC.
     
  8. Cosmacelf

    Cosmacelf Active Member

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    Yes, not very applicable to a tesla owner, but would be useful for households that also have another type of EV or for a semi public place like my stables where customers could charge.
     
  9. Blurry_Eyed

    Blurry_Eyed MS Sig #267, MX Sig # 761

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    I applaud the attempt, but if you do things by the book and get the install inspected by the city, the lack of a UL certification might be a potential roadblock.
     
  10. PhilBa

    PhilBa Active Member

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    Actually, that's a huge issue - burn down your house due to a non-UL device and insurance will deny coverage.
     
  11. SteveW25561

    SteveW25561 Member

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    I'm definitely worried about the lack of UL certification, especially in the DIY form.

    I do like the idea of a 15 kW charger -- this approaches the HPWC with a much lower cost, assuming the Model S charges with dual chargers when fed the 60A/15 kW charge from this device.
     
  12. Chris1howell

    Chris1howell Member

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    Based on the picures posted on kickstarter there is no way this device can work safely at 60A. The relays pictured in the advanced kit are rated at 30A continuous, I doubt the screw terminals and other parts could handle it either. Also the traces on the PCB would have to be very thick and wide to support a current of 60A. 24A would be the max for the hardware pictured assuming all parts and the PCB traces are correctly sized.

    The lack of GFCI on the basic units is also not good. NEC requires all EVSEs indoor and out to have GFCI.

    I do support and participate in Open Source hardware and software and DIY EVSEs efforts but only if done safely and following J1772 and the NEC to the greatest extent possible.
     
  13. valerun

    valerun Member

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    EMW here. Thank you guys for your interest in our products.

    Chris - you are absolutely correct that the picture shows 30A relays. This is one of the prototypes we used to test comms / different vehicles etc. The final version will have 60A rated relays and the power connections will be made either off PCB or on the 4-oz PCB - similar to our 12kW EV charging system (see http://www.emotorwerks.com/tech/electronics for more info on that design - that's a complete 2-stage PFC charger - about 10x more complex than the EVSE product we are bringing on).

    Of course, lack of GFCI is not good. BUT per latest NEC code, all outlets in the garages should already have GFCI:
    ----------
    NEC 210.8 Ground-Fault Protection garages
    At dwellings, ground-fault circuit-interrupter (GFCI) protection shall be provided for all receptacle outlets
    -----------
    Therefore, having another GFCI on a pluggable basic version is redundant and not helpful.

    Hope this helps.

    Thanks,
    Valery.
     
  14. arnolddeleon

    arnolddeleon Member

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    I asked them about the relays since I am considering this for 2012 RAV4-EV. They replied to my question about the relays and they also replied to a backer asking the same question:

    EMW JuiceBox - an Open Source Level 2 EV Charging Station by Electric Motor Werks (EMW) Kickstarter

    arnold
     
  15. Madartist

    Madartist Member

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    This Kickstarter project will likely fund by the deadline. I think it's a good alternative to other 3rd party charge stations, particularly since it's portable.
     
  16. mckemie

    mckemie Member

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    In my view, the portability is not the most interesting feature. All EVSEs can be made portable by installing a plug rather than hard wiring. They don't explictedly say, but the "JuiceBox" appears to be weather proof; the cheaper EVSEs are not weather proof. Still, the most attractive feature is the high current capability. Few EVSEs offer more than 30 amps. 30 amps is about 6kw which is not the full capacity of a single charger Model S. A correctly configured "JuiceBox" can supply about 15kw. You, of course, would need the twin charger to charge above 10kw.

    I'm not sure what could be done if you wanted more than 10kw AND portability since I don't know of plugs that will do more than about 40 amps.
     
  17. AmpedRealtor

    AmpedRealtor Active Member

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    As others have stated, this product doesn't apply to a Model S. Your vehicle already comes with either one or two built-in chargers, a cable and adapters to plug into a variety of outlets. I can see why Volt and Leaf owners need this, but the Model S already has everything it needs.
     
  18. mnx

    mnx 2013 P85

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    There is the NEMA 14-60 which will supply 60A (48A continuous)

     
  19. PhilBa

    PhilBa Active Member

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    how common is the NEMA 14-60?
     
  20. mckemie

    mckemie Member

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    If you have the twin charger (I do not. Yet.), the "JuiceBox" should give your Model S about 15kw charging for about $600 vs 20kw for whatever a HWPC(?) costs. Even if you already have a Tesla high power device and only a single charger, you might find the "JuiceBox" attractive for installing at other alternate charging sites.
     

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