I mentioned this in another thread, but will repeat here. Last night I was Supercharging at Harris Ranch, when a "Release Candidate" Cybertruck rolled in. It was incredible watching dozens of folks jump out of their cars, especially the kids, run over and check it out. Lots of photos and selfies were taken! Whether you like the post apocalypse styling or not, it is going to be a big hit.
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Launch is Imminent
- Thread starter T3SLAROD
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I mentioned this in another thread, but will repeat here. Last night I was Supercharging at Harris Ranch, when a "Release Candidate" Cybertruck rolled in. It was incredible watching dozens of folks jump out of their cars, especially the kids, run over and check it out. Lots of photos and selfies were taken! Whether you like the post apocalypse styling or not, it is going to be a big hit.
The concept you are looking for is called "Design for Repairability". Its a very old concept that may cost automakers more upfront in designing vehicles for ease of maintenance and collision repairs during ownership cycle. This costs OEM upfront, but saves owners money down the road:
Designing for Optimum Damageability, Repairability and InsurabilityHow Repair Costs Relate to insurance Costs on JSTOR
Jack A. Ribbens, Designing for Optimum Damageability, Repairability and InsurabilityHow Repair Costs Relate to insurance Costs, SAE Transactions, Vol. 103, Section 6: JOURNAL OF PASSENGER CARS (1994), pp. 1380-1396
www.jstor.org
Some OEMs do it better than others.
Tesla, arguably, does the worst job of them all in this category. As witnessed by the frequency of vehicles getting totaled from relatively minor accidents, and the resulting insurance rate premiums we pay on our EVs.
Mega-castings will push this trend further in the wrong direction.
As you consolidate individual components into larger aluminum mega-castings, and damage to those castings is likely to become terminal to the vehicle.
Currently, any damage to the battery tray in a Tesla totals the chassis. Mega-castings in the front and rear of the car (or a truck) will likely extend the same treatment to the larger proportion of the vehicle.
Mega-castings may make manufacturing cheaper, at the expense of subsequent inability to repair the damage down the road.
It is an unfortunate trade-off.
a
strider
Active Member
As we have been saying literally for years, both Tesla themselves and these EV "influencers" do not know the first thing about trucks. Sure, some people tow a small travel trailer behind their X or Y, but they have no idea how nice ICE trucks have become in the last several years. My brother in law has a pretty new F250 Lariat (so far from the top of the line trim) and that thing is nicer inside than my MXP. Sure, the screen isn't as large but it's much more luxurious/comfortable than my MXP. These people still think that today's trucks are the same as they were in the 80's. Newsflash - Tesla cannot make an interior as nice as a new Ram Limited. Tesla's backup Assist will be years behind what's offered on ICE trucks today. And on it goes.
Will the drivetrain be better than everyone else's? No question. So far their drivetrains are so compelling they make up for the gaps in rest of the experience. How long that continues is anyone's guess.
Been saying this for a while now. They will deliver 10 trucks to insiders before the end of the year and will slowly ramp from there.
Also, these delays are a GOOD thing. It means they care to get as much right as they can before they ship. No matter how antsy you are right now, you would MUCH rather wait 6 months for delivery than to get a truck now that breaks and sits waiting for Tesla to figure out what's wrong, redesign parts, etc. all while you're making payments and paying for insurance while (if you're lucky) driving a clapped out loaner Model 3.
strider
Active Member
I think the delay is caused by a whole bunch of little things. The CT is doing a lot of new things for Tesla. 48/800V architecture, stainless steel, 4-wheel steering, tailgates and bed covers, different glass, and on and on and on. Lots of little things add up to long delays. But as I said above. Be patient - you will get a better vehicle as a result.
Plus some big things, like finishing the manufacturing line and new castings.
And 4680 production lines + material lines.
While clearly, in your mind (or at least your writing), Tesla can do no good, I'll submit that this started with the design of cars with crumple zones, where the car's structure fails under control on impact to allow more gradual decelerations all around.
This tends to save the occupants at the expense of the vehicle. Insurance companies, of course, hate it since:
a) it makes it much more expensive to repair the car or leads to totaling it more often
b) more occupants survive, often leading to expensive medical treatments - instead of just dying.
My nieces and nephews still have a father after his Model Y was t-boned by a mini-van going about 70 mph.
I'm not sure about you but I kind of like the way Tesla made that tradeoff.
The infection of tort lawyers chasing ambulances has also had a major impact. It is a lot safer to total a vehicle and avoid the risk of being held liable for putting an unsafe vehicle back on the road should occupants be injured in subsequent accidents. Insurance companies can replace a lot of automobiles for the cost of a major injury or, worse, major injury lawsuit.
the repairs to the battering ram exoskeleton, will be costly. Have they perfected the bullet proof windows?
Was it under its own power or on a truck?
I contemplated turning around and following it to its next stop but figured it wouldn't be until Harris Ranch or even farther and I had was traveling east and south.
In a year or so, these things will be everywhere so it's just a short-term issue.
henderrj
Active Member
Oh, I'm thinking they might know the first thing. Maybe even two or three things! But you're probably right, they never even thought of going out and driving a new truck when they were designing theirs. I mean, why would anybody want to do that?
Under its own power. Slow rolled by all of us that were charging, backed into one of the stalls and hooked up. Three occupants. Had the big "RC" decals on it.
Good call. Maybe around 7:30 PM. So could be one of the ones you saw? I didn't see which direction the Cybertruck came from. He just drove by me as I was charging and eating some dinner. (Harris Express BBQ ran out of brisket two people ahead of me in line. And were out of burnt ends too. Drat.) I left the SC about 8 PM and the Cybertruck was still charging.
The people who were driving/riding in it didn't seem very interested in PR. They just walked away - leaving us to gawk at its awesomeness.
Didn't see any trailer. I just assume they were driving it up I-5.
That's likely the MO. If they hung around, they'd be barraged with a lot of questions that Tesla probably doesn't want to answer. Better to tease and let the crowd (like us) speculate for better buzz.
FWIW, IIRC, the CT was the last vehicle on the trailer so it probably could have been removed without disturbing the rest of the vehicles on it.
Pull off interstate out of sight, offload CT, drive to Supercharger, disappear.
On the other hand, it could have been a dedicated drive of that CT.
I don't recall seeing any RC markings but I was in traffic and it was going the other way so I couldn't look too carefully (I don't trust AP that much).
Conjecture in absence of evidence?
Hint - any time one's argument includes "always", "never", or "no good", it requires extraordinary evidence to substantiate it. On the internet, it always always (see what I did there?) is accompanied by insufficient evidence.
For the record, I am in favor of Tesla (and other EVs) making best cars possible for the benefit of the owners, and reducing total cost of ownership for the owners. Then delivering highest possible customer service to the owners throughout the ownership cycle.
When they fall short of those guys, I don't shy to call them out.
I care not for the companies that make those EVs, or their stock price, or their hype.
Or, crumple zones prevent severe accidents, and lower extreme medical bills?
Either way, the argument is not whether crumple zones are good or bad for your insurance rates.
But rather, does Tesla engineer its cars to make them easily repairable as other automakers.
If that were the case, the cost of insurance an average Tesla would be comparable to insurance a comparably priced car (Audi, BMW, Mercedes, etc.). Which, unfortunately, it is not. Not by a long shot!
This begins to sound too much like a conspiracy theory.
True story - my wife got t-boned by a car full of high-schoolers speeding through a stop sign in their parents SUV.
Multiple air-bags blew, her car at that time (3-series bimmer) go spun around more times than she remembered, until wheel hit a curb. She walked away, though had upper body and leg muscle pains for a week. The idiots even attempted to claim that they had a right of way even though they blew past the stop sign at (estimated) 2x the speed limit. Their insurance sued ours, ours counter-sued theirs. Depositions and court cases dragged out for another 2 years.
I was sure the bimmer was totaled, but the car was engineered and build right. It got repaired under 2 weeks after insurance gave the go-ahead (to my amazement). Car drove straight and better than new after the repairs, partly because front suspension got replaced on both sides. We sold it within a year for other reasons.
Bottom line - there does not need to be a trade-off between quality engineering and design for reparability vs. safety!
I don't believe the above is true, at all.
Do you have any evidence to back-up that dubious claim?
a
TessP100D
Active Member
This whole "built right" argument usually seems to refer to a shifting time somewhere in the past that was somehow "better".
20 years ago the cars that were "built right" were the ones built in the 60's, you know "when they knew how to build them properly" with big heavy panels that you could beat back into shape and easy to maintain carburetors, none of this new fangled, impossible to maintain fuel injection junk.
Of course the simple tank-like construction gave the feeling of invulnerability - until you hit something at speed and the engine suddenly appeared in the passenger compartment.
Manufacturers have learned through painful experience that building using lots of different parts decreases reliability, every additional connection adds a failure point and a system with cascading potential failure points gets less and less reliable and makes it more and more expensive to build.
I think my favorite is the old style indicators, that used miles of wiring to connect all the indicator lights to a central relay that clicked away in the dash - and a blown bulb made the whole thing malfunction
20 years ago the cars that were "built right" were the ones built in the 60's, you know "when they knew how to build them properly" with big heavy panels that you could beat back into shape and easy to maintain carburetors, none of this new fangled, impossible to maintain fuel injection junk.
Of course the simple tank-like construction gave the feeling of invulnerability - until you hit something at speed and the engine suddenly appeared in the passenger compartment.
Manufacturers have learned through painful experience that building using lots of different parts decreases reliability, every additional connection adds a failure point and a system with cascading potential failure points gets less and less reliable and makes it more and more expensive to build.
I think my favorite is the old style indicators, that used miles of wiring to connect all the indicator lights to a central relay that clicked away in the dash - and a blown bulb made the whole thing malfunction
Not your question, but that's not a luggage rack, it's 4 wheel traction recovery things that were in the vault.
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