Looks like Tesla brought back the standard range Model S and X!

[Tiger]

Some speculate that if these contained 4680 with lower capacity, they could soon become eligible for rebates:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1691273525460439040

 

[Tiger]

If it’s the same weight then it’s likely the same battery which means you can charge to 100%. The standard range is actually a great deal. Blazing fast charging to 100% at Superchargers and basically the same daily range as the long range at the recommended 80%. 300+ miles of range would be more than enough for me. I’m fine with 200 currently.

It actually puts Lucid in perspective, now Lucid looks like a bargain, unless Tesla becomes eligible for the incentives:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1691299857137586177

 

[EVMeister]

It actually puts Lucid in perspective, now Lucid looks like a bargain, unless Tesla becomes eligible for the incentives:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1691299857137586177

Consumers should be concerned about getting that Lucid serviced in the years to come, as the company may well cease to exist in the not too distant future.

 

[SageBrush]

There’s a post on twitter (x) with A statement from Tesla that it is software limited and there are no plans to offer an upgrade.

I'm a big fan of these software limited cars because they ~ match the more expensive versions is most supercharging scenarios.

 

[Zuikkis]

What's interesting they quote slower 0-60mph for Standard Range.. So if it's just software limited they are limiting the power as well. Or is it fitted with different motors?

 

[DBV1]

Consumers should be concerned about getting that Lucid serviced in the years to come, as the company may well cease to exist in the not too distant future.

I doubt that will happen and if it was close someone would buy the company. I love my Model S LR, but Lucid Pure is a no brainer compared to this new range reduced Model S. I think it is embarrassing Tesla even introduced it and cheapens the Model S line. Just lower the price of the Model S LR, which was close to this price end of last quarter.

If anything improve on the existing Model S and offer a higher range car. Such a weird move with no innovation.

Even if you don’t like Lucid, BMW i5 and Audi A6 will be coming out and both those manufactures under estimate range. If similar price to this range reduced Model S those will be no brainer too.

 

[henderrj]

Yeah, seems to me that the reason to say "we don't have plans to unlock the additional range" is to ensure that people considering purchasing an LR don't drop to an SR.

Sure, the extra range is locked, but Tesla is still including it. It's $10k worth of hardware that Tesla is handing out for free... and it's entirely unusable.

I don't like pricing games, and would feel better if Tesla stated right upfront that owners can unlock the additional range but for more than what it would cost to purchase the LR to begin with. Perhaps $12k to buy back that additional range down the road.

It might be that you are missing my point. I'm saying that I don't think it's a software limited vehicle, or at least not likely so. Some statement by a guy who's been right sometimes and wrong sometimes does not constitute proof.

The point is, Tesla does make a 90 kilowatt hour battery now that they are using as warranty and out of warranty replacement for 85s and 90s, so why wouldn't they use it for a new lower range model S and x? That seems to make much more sense to me than using a software limited battery. Since they're already making 90's, indeed may have designed it specifically for this purpose, not for the purpose of replacing warranty 85's and 90s, why wouldn't they offer this option?

 

[Destiny1701]

It might be that you are missing my point. I'm saying that I don't think it's a software limited vehicle, or at least not likely so. Some statement by a guy who's been right sometimes and wrong sometimes does not constitute proof.

The point is, Tesla does make a 90 kilowatt hour battery now that they are using as warranty and out of warranty replacement for 85s and 90s, so why wouldn't they use it for a new lower range model S and x? That seems to make much more sense to me than using a software limited battery. Since they're already making 90's, indeed may have designed it specifically for this purpose, not for the purpose of replacing warranty 85's and 90s, why wouldn't they offer this option?

Logical. But then if weights are identical?
Would denote same battery and same motors no?

Tesla did this back in 2017 with the 100D models. At the time power was software locked and they offered an unlock Vs newer 2018 100D’s that came shipped with the newer specs. So in essence Tesla shipped out a locked car, never told anyone and eventually down the road announced an unlock. We have no idea here if this is similar.

 

[Zuikkis]

Logical. But then if weights are identical?

Weights might be close to identical.

The new Plaid/LR battery has a new design, it consists of only five modules. Old 100kWh pack was 16 modules, and this 90kWh pack has 14 modules.

It is known that Plaid/LR pack is lighter than the old 100kWh pack, and obviously 90kWh is lighter than 100kWh.. But I don't know the exact numbers.

 

[BPeter]

It might be that you are missing my point. I'm saying that I don't think it's a software limited vehicle, or at least not likely so. Some statement by a guy who's been right sometimes and wrong sometimes does not constitute proof.

The point is, Tesla does make a 90 kilowatt hour battery now that they are using as warranty and out of warranty replacement for 85s and 90s, so why wouldn't they use it for a new lower range model S and x? That seems to make much more sense to me than using a software limited battery. Since they're already making 90's, indeed may have designed it specifically for this purpose, not for the purpose of replacing warranty 85's and 90s, why wouldn't they offer this option?

The Palladium isn't compatible with the old style batteries which those 90kWh batteries are.

 

[beatle]

I can't see them putting in heavy battery modules and then effectively turning them into expensive ballast by software limiting them. More likely they're just using fewer modules in the pack for less capacity. Fewer modules will mean less ability to deliver current and less power, which shows up in the lower performance figure vs. the LR.

 

[E90alex]

I can't see them putting in heavy battery modules and then effectively turning them into expensive ballast by software limiting them. More likely they're just using fewer modules in the pack for less capacity. Fewer modules will mean less ability to deliver current and less power, which shows up in the lower performance figure vs. the LR.

It might actually cost more money to have a separate pack for possibly a lower volume trim level.

There’s a lot of hidden cost involved in manufacturing and storage logistics to have a different battery pack in the mix both for new cars and in the parts distribution for repairs and replacements for years to come.

A software limit is essentially free with zero changes needed in parts or manufacturing. They can just as easily limit power output as well in software just to provide a bigger difference vs the long range.

 

[CapeOne]

I'm a bit baffled by the Model S SR addition....who is it for? If you can swing ~80k on a new car....why wouldn't you go for the "long range" Model S with 400+ mi range...sure 10k cheaper is nice but also you're way down on range at 320mi.

For some customers, 320 miles range is more than adequate for their needs and if they can save $10k in the process it's worth it to them. The fact that they will presumably be able to "unlock" the battery later (at a cost, of course) if their needs change is a plus too.

 

[Destiny1701]

Never believe EM. If tesla says we won’t be offering a software unlock…take it with a grain of salt. Tesla is notorious for backpedaling or stating and acting contrary.

Could be a revenue/sales driven decision Ie.

1. Drive up S sales with a cheaper model
2. When sales dip again, offer software unlock for $$.
3. Higher sales means more purchase EAP, FSD.

Profit margins may be slightly less to start , but they meet sales targets and production numbers.

At this time, we know nothing other than there are today 3 versions of MS. Not knew.
60D, 75D, 100D, P100D. At one point there were 4 offerings.

Tomorrow there could be an LR+ with 475miles.

 

[MarcG]

I’m curious why delivery times are different between standard and long range (non-Plaid) models if they’re identical hardware?

Given the specs and identical weights, I agree they are most likely the same car, just software-locked for the standard range. But it is indeed curious delivery is longer for the new standard range.

Perhaps they need time to figure out the software lock?

 

[beatle]

It might actually cost more money to have a separate pack for possibly a lower volume trim level.

There’s a lot of hidden cost involved in manufacturing and storage logistics to have a different battery pack in the mix both for new cars and in the parts distribution for repairs and replacements for years to come.

A software limit is essentially free with zero changes needed in parts or manufacturing. They can just as easily limit power output as well in software just to provide a bigger difference vs the long range.

I know about customization having associated costs, but batteries are very pricey and already modular. It would have to be a very big savings to standardize. I guess we'll find out when someone does a teardown or at least weighs the cars.

 

[Tiger]

Never believe EM. If tesla says we won’t be offering a software unlock…take it with a grain of salt. Tesla is notorious for backpedaling or stating and acting contrary.

Could be a revenue/sales driven decision Ie.

1. Drive up S sales with a cheaper model
2. When sales dip again, offer software unlock for $$.
3. Higher sales means more purchase EAP, FSD.

Profit margins may be slightly less to start , but they meet sales targets and production numbers.

At this time, we know nothing other than there are today 3 versions of MS. Not knew.
60D, 75D, 100D, P100D. At one point there were 4 offerings.

Tomorrow there could be an LR+ with 475miles.

This is actually interesting... I'm interested in buying range up front, but if I already had a lower mileage car, I wouldn't pay thousands of usd to unlock more range. Strange.

 

[E90alex]

This is actually interesting... I'm interested in buying range up front, but if I already had a lower mileage car, I wouldn't pay thousands of usd to unlock more range. Strange.

People will usually buy more range than they truly need up front if they can afford it. But if you already have a lower range car that works for your use case then there’s no reason to unlock more range that you won’t use.

 

[Tiger]

People will usually buy more range than they truly need up front if they can afford it. But if you already have a lower range car that works for your use case then there’s no reason to unlock more range that you won’t use.

I could use it on a trip-basis. For example pay double for supercharging to charge it to 130% on a trip. Once in a full moon.

 

[Zuikkis]

It could have a Plaid battery pack with one module removed. Then it's 88p so about 360V and 80kWh.

4/5 matches exactly the advertised 320/400 miles range.