Might order my 3 soon, very begrudgingly.

[MXWing]

Except in this case, Tesla is not sold out of base 3's. They could have built them last summer and to this day. They intentionally chose not to build them, and are making much more expensive 3's instead.

I think back to Tesla's apparent state of mind at the time of the Model 3 reveal and Day 1 of reservations, where people could put down $1000. Tesla wanted that money. Tesla NEEDED that money. So Tesla said what they had to say (it's a $35,000 car!!!) to get that money.

I knew I could afford $35K for a car, so I got in line and whipped out the credit card around 10:10 am on 3/31/16. If Tesla had told us all on that day that it would be a $49,000 car, I would have WANTED to reserve one, but probably would not have.

Perhaps we need a Better Call Saul type of lawyer to file a lawsuit on this and make it nice and public. I would not expect to win the lawsuit, but maybe the resulting publicity would wake up Tesla to the fact that they are wrong in this case, and deceiving their reservation holders and investors, no matter why they did it, is not cool.

Tesla took in 400 million from deposits. Their market cap is 55 Billion. Don't flatter yourself that your $1000 or even the sum of all cancellations did anything.

You KNEW since last July 2017 that the $35,000 Model 3 was not coming out "soon". Here we are in March 2018 and the $35,000 Model 3 is not coming out soon. Tesla has always given estimates and have pushed them back via email so people not on TMC was made aware. You continue to "suffer" by your choice.

 

[sreams]

The bottom line is that the base Model 3 is late. Period. What if the Model 3 had been one week late and all Tesla had to offer was the S and X? Would you have cried "bait and switch"? What about one month late? What if the $49K version had been released, and then the $35K version had come 3 days later? Would you have cried "bait and switch" during those 3 days?

Tesla probably cannot afford to build a $35K Model 3 until they are building at least 5K cars per week (which was planned to have happened by the end of 2017). Yes, they are very late, and I'm sure they are very sorry to the complainers for being late. But that doesn't make them criminals.

It is truly unfortunate that the people complaining have no idea that what they are demanding would likely kill the company. Tesla can't do anything for anyone if they don't exist. Stop begging for Tesla's demise.

 

[stopcrazypp]

The bottom line is that the base Model 3 is late. Period. What if the Model 3 had been one week late and all Tesla had to offer was the S and X? Would you have cried "bait and switch"? What about one month late? What if the $49K version had been released, and then the $35K version had come 3 days later? Would you have cried "bait and switch" during those 3 days?

Tesla probably cannot afford to build a $35K Model 3 until they are building at least 5K cars per week (which was planned to have happened by the end of 2017). Yes, they are very late, and I'm sure they are very sorry to the complainers for being late. But that doesn't make them criminals.

It is truly unfortunate that the people complaining have no idea that what they are demanding would likely kill the company. Tesla can't do anything for anyone if they don't exist. Stop begging for Tesla's demise.

You said what I wanted to say. The OP is talking about as if Tesla already cancelled the $35k version. They didn't. That version is coming later.

Tesla had a long precedent of releasing the higher end version before for the base version. I believe many of use predicted that and only the ones with wishful thinking thought they would release the base version first. Tesla also never promised they would release the base version first.

 

[jjh1234]

You currently own a Challenger R/T ... case closed, you have been intentionally punished by Elon

Sold my MS75D and bought a used Charger R/T Max AWD. 90% of the enjoyment at 25% the cost.

 

[RedMS]

Sold my MS75D and bought a used Charger R/T Max AWD. 90% of the enjoyment at 25% the cost.

Care to elaborate your reasoning? Was you decision strictly based on cost?

 

[nvx1977]

I think back to Tesla's apparent state of mind at the time of the Model 3 reveal and Day 1 of reservations, where people could put down $1000. Tesla wanted that money. Tesla NEEDED that money. So Tesla said what they had to say (it's a $35,000 car!!!) to get that money.

Glad you thought back on that day. Cause you should also remember that Musk had no expectation that he'd ultimately get 500k deposits. So I really doubt his intent was to sucker YOU into paying $1k. Companies make you pay a deposit to weed out non-serious buyers. Why do you think Musk only charged 1k instead of the [now former] 5k for Model X? Kinda debunks your greed thesis.

And this whole discussion about bait and switch is a non sequitur. It was stated right from the beginning that there was a progression to reservation priority: employees, owners, west coast to east coast, beefier configuration, and finally, order in line. Nothing Tesla has done so far has violated that progression of priority. The day that Musk states that "Ok sorry everyone, we're no longer going to be offering the base config" is the day someone can rightfully declare bait and switch.

If you think Tesla's mission is horsesh*t, then consider why they even needed to invest a single dime on Model 3 R&D. They could just be a niche luxury player like Porsche and crank out Model S and X forever. There was never a need to even collect a single deposit for Model 3. The S and X is crushing traditional luxury cars in sales already.

 

[sreams]

Sold my MS75D and bought a used Charger R/T Max AWD. 90% of the enjoyment at 25% the cost.

And at least triple the emissions. Congrats!

 

[ChrisH]

Weren’t they originally planning to have the model 3 “$35,000” car for sale in 2019 or 2020?

 

[MXWing]

You said what I wanted to say. The OP is talking about as if Tesla already cancelled the $35k version. They didn't. That version is coming later.

Tesla had a long precedent of releasing the higher end version before for the base version. I believe many of use predicted that and only the ones with wishful thinking thought they would release the base version first. Tesla also never promised they would release the base version first.

$8,000 per minute cash burn
Q42017 EPS of -$4.01

dictates certain strategic decisions have to be made.

 

[snakeopus121]

Care to elaborate your reasoning? Was you decision strictly based on cost?

Better infotainment system may be a factor --- Apple Carplay/Android Auto/voice commands/aux input/etc etc

Blind spot monitoring, 360 backup camera

 

[cwerdna]

Weren’t they originally planning to have the model 3 “$35,000” car for sale in 2019 or 2020?

Don't know. Does someone have a pointer to any original date that Tesla claimed?

I pointed to Elon's tweet at Elon Musk on Twitter.

Tesla: Model 3 Will Be $35,000 Pre-Incentives, Taking Orders In March was from 2 years ago. Judging by the comments, that was probably posted Feb 2016.

Gotta love Tesla's communications style: say or tweet something and let people's imaginations run wild.

edit: A snapshot at Model 3 Reservations FAQ from July 31, 2017 has stuff this (I added some boldfacing):

Which future options will be made available to order, and when?
We are planning to introduce the following options in the coming months:

Fall 2017: White interior option, standard configuration (non-Premium Upgrades)
November 2017: Standard Battery, $35,000 car
Spring 2018: Dual Motor All-Wheel Drive

Additional options will become available over time.

Will there still be a $35,000 Model 3 option?
Yes. Our first production Model 3 vehicles are preconfigured to ensure a smooth production ramp so that we can deliver more cars to more customers at a faster pace. The beginning configuration is a Long Range Battery with rear-wheel drive and premium upgrades, starting at $49,000. These vehicles come with three options for customization: wheel size, exterior color and Autopilot features.

Additional configurations, including the Model 3 with standard equipment for $35,000, will become available as production ramps, which we expect to be in November 2017.

We are shipping our first cars to employees now and expect to begin shipping the Long Range Battery configuration to customers in late October. The Standard Battery configuration will be available very soon thereafter.

 

[nvx1977]

The decision to speed up production (from 500k cars in 2020 to 2018, where 80% of that would be Model 3) was made in May 2016, roughly a month or two after the Model 3 reveal.

Tesla announces new Model 3 production plans, guidance of 500,000 cars/yr by 2018, instead of 2020

 

[John Lamoureux]

Not sure why you're not considering TCO (Total Cost of Ownership) over time. There are, relatively speaking as they sell in minutes/hours, plenty of 3-year-lease-returned CPO AP1 cars, including RWD variants with the now unicorned full-size frunk/microwave and equally unicorned and coveted yacht floor. These cars can sell and have sold as CPOs for $42K-$49K, warranted to 100,000 miles and with supercharging included. Further, an S85 even today will have more range than the base Model 3 you've referenced.

Further yet again, if you do choose to drive any appreciable distances at all, the included supercharging will save you up to $2K-$3K/year over the Model 3. Tangentially, I routinely have a max range of 170 miles or less per full charge if the week is full of short, urban, hilly drives - and that's in temperate La Nina SoCal wx this year. People will be in for a significant shock if they are unaware of this reality *and* are paying either by the kW or especially by the (peak) minute in certain states/regions. Of course, you'll get every bit of available range as advertised, less a modicum of degradation (mine was 3.x% after about 65K miles in an S85 with 99% supercharging), on a relatively flat highway in mild weather at 60mph from supercharger to supercharger.

Point being, unless and until we get full FSD in 2-3 years, we're all just marking time and are going to want to buy a new Tesla in 2021 anyway. So to get from today until then, instead of buying the Model 3 now in a configuration you *clearly* dislike, why not consider a CPO AP1 S85 for less money for more features (an IC - ooh!) *at this time*?

Then when we've got FSD in hand 2-3 years from now, absolutely jump into a base Model 3 or the new CUV based upon a Model 3 or maybe even by then (be still my heart) a full-sized Tesla pickup that will put the F250 and F350 to shame? Just saying.

You'll be dollars ahead both up front, yes, including the tax credit or lack thereof, as well as over time, with a fine car and none of the headaches associated with new car acquisition. Very little downside unless you believe we're getting FSD this year. Some credit unions may still finance used Teslas at the same rate as new, so it's worth checking around to see. And you won't need gap insurance. And you'll have more range than the base Model 3. And more car.

And a slightly sluggish web browser. Hey, it ain't all peaches and cream, yanno.

You've got to be pretty quick to catch a CPO w/AP1 for less than $49K. Trust me, I hit refresh on that page almost as much as I do on my "Manage my Tesla" page...

 

[jjh1234]

Care to elaborate your reasoning? Was you decision strictly based on cost?

- Reliability. Ten trips to the service center totaling 1 month of down time out of 9 months of ownership.
- Insurance Cost. Twice that of my other cars.
- Body Repair Cost. Four times that of normal cars. A one inch scratch caused by a piece rubber cost $800 to fix.
- Overall cost, including depreciation.
- Poor cold weather battery performance.
- Black paint. Sucks to maintain. Shows every little scratch.
- Classic seats. Very uncomfortable.
- Autopilot 2.0. Continues to be underperforming.
- Base audio. Miss the subwoofer.
- Non-Adjustable seat belts
- Crappy windshield washers
- Poor designed cup holders
- No door storage and little center console storage
- No coat hooks
- No lighted vanity mirrors
- No power lift-gate
- Lack of meaningful OTA updates, often more broken than fixed.

 

[jjh1234]

And at least triple the emissions. Congrats!

It's probably cleaner than my other car, a 2015 Dodge Challenger SRT 392. Then again, maybe not. Actually, I only drive these cars a few thousand miles a year anyhow. Most of my driving is done in a company car that I have no control over anyhow.

 

[MXWing]

- Reliability. Ten trips to the service center totaling 1 month of down time out of 9 months of ownership.
- Insurance Cost. Twice that of my other cars.
- Body Repair Cost. Four times that of normal cars. A one inch scratch caused by a piece rubber cost $800 to fix.
- Overall cost, including depreciation.
- Poor cold weather battery performance.
- Black paint. Sucks to maintain. Shows every little scratch.
- Classic seats. Very uncomfortable.
- Autopilot 2.0. Continues to be underperforming.
- Base audio. Miss the subwoofer.
- Non-Adjustable seat belts
- Crappy windshield washers
- Poor designed cup holders
- No door storage and little center console storage
- No coat hooks
- No lighted vanity mirrors
- No power lift-gate
- Lack of meaningful OTA updates, often more broken than fixed.

How much did it go for? I would LOVE to find a Model S owner in California who hates their car that much and would be a motivated seller.

Let me know how the Dodge version of AP performs and the progression of OTA updates.

Some of your critiques are nonsensical. Black paint? Didn't know it was exclusive to Tesla. Poor cold weather battery experience? No problem with the Leaf! No subwoofer? Add one. No power lift-gate? You didn't want that option at time of purchase apparently.

The only thing you get credit for is insurance, body repair and storage. Lack of storage is annoying but I spend more time driving than stocking shelves.

 

[jjh1234]

How much did it go for? I would LOVE to find a Model S owner in California who hates their car that much and would be a motivated seller.

Let me know how the Dodge version of AP performs and the progression of OTA updates.

Some of your critiques are nonsensical. Black paint? Didn't know it was exclusive to Tesla. Poor cold weather battery experience? No problem with the Leaf! No subwoofer? Add one. No power lift-gate? You didn't want that option at time of purchase apparently.

The only thing you get credit for is insurance, body repair and storage. Lack of storage is annoying but I spend more time driving than stocking shelves.

I sold it for $58k to CarSense (like Car MAX). With the demo savings and tax incentives, I had about $67k into it.

Yes, black paint sucks on most cars these days, but I feel like Tesla's paint is quite soft. I had a black Audi A8 and don't remember it getting swirl marks just from drying after a wash.

The range is significantly reduced in the cold. It's a fact. All that battery warming doesn't come for free.

I quit upgrading car audio systems years ago. Plus, god forbid you ever have a warranty issue with the electrical system. I had a simple insurance device plugged into the OBDII port and they blamed it for all the errors the car was throwing. I ended up having to remove it and switch car insurance companies and have the error come back to prove it wasn't the problem.

I was talked into buying a demo model, so never had a chance to configure that way I wanted. Hindsight is now 20/20. Would have bought a red MS100D with PUP.

It actually has adaptive cruise control that works much better than TACC. It doesn't try to rear end every stopped car it comes up on. Updates are via USB and they work just fine.

 

[MXWing]

It actually has adaptive cruise control that works much better than TACC. It doesn't try to rear end every stopped car it comes up on.

The Dodge adaptive cruise control can see a stopped car in the distance and not run into it? Impressive.

 

[privater]

Economics 101: Price is based on demands, not actual cost.

In the sense of Model 3, you might find it's not worthy the `cost` in your mind, but still, it's attracting other buyers willing to pay that much premium to get it sooner than later.

 

[jjh1234]

The Dodge adaptive cruise control can see a stopped car in the distance and not run into it? Impressive.

Tesla can't, disappointing.