Model 3 lifespan?

[Az_Rael]

Thanks for giving me actual information unlike the other dude. I know S has handle issues amongst other things, but how common is it? Is it certain you will run into the issue? I was mainly arguing about the Model 3, where there’s no door handle issues and the screen is different apparently.

Right, the 3 is too new to really tell what issues it may or may not have over time. All this stuff took several years to really show up on the S.

As far as door handles, they have been redesigned by Tesla to be more reliable than the earliest versions, but they do still fail. Early on they were super common failures. We have had 1 go on our 2015, so not too bad (although it was the drivers door, so hugely annoying). If I was buying a used out of warranty S today, I would expect to have to deal with door handles and an MCU at some point. They also have suspension issues (we are dealing with that now), but that doesn’t fall under the “electronics” category. This will be the 2nd time our S will have needed major suspension work if the current issues we are experiencing turn out to be the suspension.

I do worry about the long term reliability of the suspension on my 3. My car has already had a TSB suspension fix (for an unknown reason, they just did it at a service visit) and suspensions aren’t Tesla’s forte based on their other models. So it’s not just electronic things that can be an issue. “Regular” car things may be problematic over time as well.

Remember that every 3 on the road today is an early one. In 5 years, we will have a much better idea about reliability, For now we are all just early adopters.

 

[VT_EE]

Right, the 3 is too new to really tell what issues it may or may not have over time. All this stuff took several years to really show up on the S.

As far as door handles, they have been redesigned by Tesla to be more reliable than the earliest versions, but they do still fail. Early on they were super common failures. We have had 1 go on our 2015, so not too bad (although it was the drivers door, so hugely annoying). If I was buying a used out of warranty S today, I would expect to have to deal with door handles and an MCU at some point. They also have suspension issues (we are dealing with that now), but that doesn’t fall under the “electronics” category. This will be the 2nd time our S will have needed major suspension work if the current issues we are experiencing turn out to be the suspension.

I do worry about the long term reliability of the suspension on my 3. My car has already had a TSB suspension fix (for an unknown reason, they just did it at a service visit) and suspensions aren’t Tesla’s forte based on their other models. So it’s not just electronic things that can be an issue. “Regular” car things may be problematic over time as well.

Remember that every 3 on the road today is an early one. In 5 years, we will have a much better idea about reliability, For now we are all just early adopters.

The same could be said of any new model from any manufacturer. The 3 has been out for two years now and so far so good minus some initial issues related to the early-on assembly process.

 

[YusufT]

Keywords: emmc, tesla

Replacing eMMC in MCU

Tesla MCUs contain an eMMC (memory chip) that commonly fails after heavy write cycles. When this occurs, you will get a blank screen on your CID.
​

A Single Component Can Brick Older Teslas and Tesla Won’t Fix It

This rogue Tesla enthusiast helps keep unsupported cars on the road - Roadshow

Thanks for the sources. I read on one of them that Tesla won’t service the part, is this still true? Is this an ingoing issue with Tesla because it seems we’re all doomed to run into this issue if it’s true.

Right, the 3 is too new to really tell what issues it may or may not have over time. All this stuff took several years to really show up on the S.

As far as door handles, they have been redesigned by Tesla to be more reliable than the earliest versions, but they do still fail. Early on they were super common failures. We have had 1 go on our 2015, so not too bad (although it was the drivers door, so hugely annoying). If I was buying a used out of warranty S today, I would expect to have to deal with door handles and an MCU at some point. They also have suspension issues (we are dealing with that now), but that doesn’t fall under the “electronics” category. This will be the 2nd time our S will have needed major suspension work if the current issues we are experiencing turn out to be the suspension.

I do worry about the long term reliability of the suspension on my 3. My car has already had a TSB suspension fix (for an unknown reason, they just did it at a service visit) and suspensions aren’t Tesla’s forte based on their other models. So it’s not just electronic things that can be an issue. “Regular” car things may be problematic over time as well.

Remember that every 3 on the road today is an early one. In 5 years, we will have a much better idea about reliability, For now we are all just early adopters.

Yup my main argument was against his point of how Model 3 electronics are bound to all break and need replacing out of warranty. I said this is not true and he just kept insulting me. I know S has issues but the 3 is new and has different screen than the other models. The only thing it seems to have right now is an MCU SSD issue judging off the other models.

I know the car will have problems as any other car, but to say all Model 3’s will have electronic issues is a huge lie. That was my point.

Thanks for your input though.

 

[StealthP3D]

I think the sluggishness of the UI will start to show its ugly head sooner than the car will wear down to a problematic point.

I had a was given a 2014 Model S as a loner last week and was highly annoyed with its laggy UI and poor screen in comparison. (Not to mention the dash, control stick and throwback feel to a modern sedan)

No, the car is designed to not get laggy, it should perform the same in 15 years. The Model S was somewhat laggy when new - it came with a slower processor and graphics processor. I imagine they fixed the lagginess in the most recent Models. But cars are designed to not get clogged up like a laptop computer might.

The Model 3 UI is super responsive and it should stay that way.

 

[Knightshade]

You have exposed yourself as an internet only expert, do yourself a favor and stop, you look silly.
If you have never heard of the hardware/SSD issues on Model 3's, you are a noob.

I hate spoon feeding internet only experts like you, but here is a primer for you, this will be my last reply to you, you are not worth my time.

Uh... that's an issue with MCU1.

Which Tesla stopped using a while ago, and never used on a single Model 3.

Your own video, that you apparently didn't actually watch, points this out about 2 minutes in.

At 2:55 they show you the actual Model 3 setup that isn't the same.

Anyway at 8:40 into the video you didn't really watch they get to the SSD (eMMC) issue.

Further, at about 10:55 of the video you didn't really watch, Rich asks if the Model 3 computer has the same problem or not

The guy explains MCU2 has a much larger eMMC card... (8 times larger from what I can find) to deal with this issue.

The video mentions MCU1 card fails after about 4 years.

Meaning MCU2 would be good for about 32 years (it's slightly more complex than that- my second link below goes into it a bit, but suffice to say MCU2 should be good on this issue for decades).


See here
green on Twitter

and

Tesla hacker highlights Major issue : RealTesla

this is no longer a big concern on MCu2 cars and was never a big concern on model3s because they use bigger EMMCs (64G, vs 8G on mcu1)

(poster is a very well known Tesla hacker- the guy who has provided a lot of the data on what AP "sees" for example).

So, no, I have not heard of the "hardware/SDD issues on Model 3"

And neither have you.

Because they only exist in your imagination.

The actual issue is on MCU1 cars- which the Model 3 isn't one of (and neither is the S/X anymore.

Noob indeed.

 

[DJVoorhees]

You have exposed yourself as an internet only expert, do yourself a favor and stop, you look silly.
If you have never heard of the hardware/SSD issues on Model S's, you are a noob.

I hate spoon feeding internet only experts like you, but here is a primer for you, this will be my last reply to you, you are not worth my time.

Crap - just noticed I said Model 3 and not S, oh well.

 

[Maven]

No, the car is designed to not get laggy, it should perform the same in 15 years. The Model S was somewhat laggy when new - it came with a slower processor and graphics processor. I imagine they fixed the lagginess in the most recent Models. But cars are designed to not get clogged up like a laptop computer might.

The Model 3 UI is super responsive and it should stay that way.

This is exactly what I hope will happen with my 3.

All I had to go on was the experience I had with the 2014 Model S loaner that was issued to me.

Either way, I am happy to be an owner.

 

[StealthP3D]

Crap - just noticed I said Model 3 and not S, oh well.

Maybe you just noticed this is a Model 3 thread too?

 

[DJVoorhees]

Maybe you just noticed this is a Model 3 thread too?

Cry harder.

 

[OCR1]

Tough crowd.

 

[alexGS]

Tough crowd.

Yes, I’m feeling rather sorry for the OP now, who has worthy aims of reducing consumerism and waste. I wish him the best of luck with his Model 3, regardless of what bets a bunch of us might place either way. The reality is that we don’t know the correct answer to his question yet.

-Alex

 

[japhule]

I don't think it's right to compare these cars with how we compare laptops/computers as they get old. Computers get slow over the years due to changes in software that require more resources. Tesla (and cars in general) are vehicles that get you from one place to another. The roads we drive on aren't changing... Not anywhere near the pace of software/content that we consume on computers. People still buy used cars that are 10+ years old today. People will buy old used tesla model 3s 10 years from now, and they'll probably sell better than an ICE car from the same year then also.

 

[Jim R]

For me there are 2 attractions in EV's
1. Low cost travel. (charging is cheaper than buying fuel)
2. Few parts to replace. (No radiator, fuel pump, tranny, emission control equipment - you get the idea.)

Item 2 is the big one and should make long term ownership more attractive than ICE cars. Love my Mercedes, but I don't love the $1150 I paid to replace one of the 2 NOx sensors. Other repairs as the car ages will also be expensive. Add up all the potential repairs over a 10 year period and compare with Tesla.

If Tesla ever does ads, they might say: "Lifetime replacement of (insert list of parts they don't have, like I mention in point #2)"

 

[David_Cary]

My 2 cents.
I have been on this forum for awhile. I have a 2015 S with 75k miles. I live in NC and park in the sun quite a bit - we all know heat is hard on electronics.
I have every single one of my original electronics. My screen is not yellow on the edges. I have my 4 original door handles.
There is not a huge epidemic of replaced MCU's or flash problems. There are some but not a huge epidemic.
As we all know, when people have issues they yell the loudest. That does not make it a scientific survey - far from it.
The Model 3 is a volume car. If there is a flash problem that shows itself in 5 years, there will be an aftermarket fix. It will be reasonably cheap. I suspect there will be an S replacement MCU that is faster, aftermarket and reasonably priced.
Less heat and vibration in the drivetrain will make EV's longer lasting in general.
Look - these things have computers but they are not computers on wheels. They are a big battery and a driveunit on wheels with a battery cooling system and a suspension. They have a steering system. A climate control system.
I know the "computers on wheels" thing is repeated over and over again but it isn't true. Every new car has sensors and computers. It represents a small portion of the capital cost of the car.

 

[Petermcg]

As OCR1 said, the M3 is a computer on wheels. What I think may become an issue as our cars get really old is that Tesla will stop supporting the software. Microsoft, Apple, Oracle, etc. all stop bug fixes and updates to their oldest software releases. It may be that a new network standard will come out that is incompatible with our current software and and at point we will lose internet access. You can easily see how this could be the same with music or video formats.

Having said that, this car is still light years better in every way than an ICE car. My previous car was a 13 year old Lexus with 240,000 miles on it. I intend to keep my M3 for at least as long.

 

[VT_EE]

They should stop supporting the software at some point, but that won’t stop the car from continuing to be a functional vehicle. No different than any other manufacturer once the support ceases.

 

[OzVic]

Uh... that's an issue with MCU1.

The video mentions MCU1 card fails after about 4 years.

Due to excessive (and pointless according to the gent) Linux kernel logging.

When that fellow replaces the eMMC he also roots / turns down the logging.

Wonder if Tesla after seeing the video have sent out an update which turns down the logging thereby extending the life of the eMMC RAM? Especially considering they're 100% guaranteed to fail eventually if it remains the same.

 

[Dan Detweiler]

One thing to keep in mind in all this...

The Model 3 you will take delivery of soon is NOT the same as a Model 3 that came out in the first 6 months of production. Unlike legacy manufacturers, Tesla is constantly improving their cars, not just once per model year. Even if you had reliability data from early cars they may or may not be relevant to your car.

My advice...buy the car...
Drive the car...
Enjoy the car...
Sell the car when needed.

It's really that simple. Nobody here has a crystal ball. Good luck! I hope you enjoy your car as much as I am enjoying mine!

Dan

 

[Stanwood Steve]

I know I'm probably the exception, but I still own and drive the Toyota 4WD truck that I purchased new in 1981. Granted, it has 418,000 miles on it and I did have a new engine put in it at 410,000 miles, but I may eventually get rid of it for an electric version. I love my Model 3P+ and plan to keep it a very long time - if the range drops significantly over the next ten or fifteen years, it will become my "drive around town" car and I'll have a newer EV to use for longer range trips, as needed. I've a firm believer in using what I have as long as possible before replacing - it's better for the planet and my wallet.

 

[OCR1]

I’m all for saving the planet but whether I drive my Model 3 for the next 25 years or I drive it five years and then sell it to someone else who drives it for its remaining useful life I’m not sure how the planet would be any worse off. By keeping it for 25 years I’m preventing someone else from being able to enjoy it and possibly forcing them to have to buy a new one by making my used one unavailable.

It’s not like these vehicles are going to a big junkyard if we sell them in five years. They are just going from someone who wants the latest and greatest to someone who wants to buy the car after it’s been heavily depreciated and perhaps represents a better buy to them.