Model 3 Supercharging Capable Discussion

[KJD]

Looks like this is where we're heading at least for the Model 3 (and possible future Models S/X customers who have not already been promised "Free for the life of the car" by Tesla) and I think it's a really good thing.

Tesla Model 3 'Supercharger Credits' discovered on 'MyTesla' page

It would be nice to see the details on how this will work, but I agree that long term something like this needs to be done.

 

[Garlan Garner]

Looks like this is where we're heading at least for the Model 3 (and possible future Models S/X customers who have not already been promised "Free for the life of the car" by Tesla) and I think it's a really good thing.

Tesla Model 3 'Supercharger Credits' discovered on 'MyTesla' page

Yes, I agree - I love it.

 

[Garlan Garner]

I think the reason for this is that all of the losses/expenses are included in the price of getting a gallon of gas in your car. i.e. you pay for a gallon you get a gallon of usable gas. In an EV you pay for a kWh but you only get ~0.85 kWh of usable energy stored in your car. So including the losses for the cost of driving does make sense. In fact you are using/paying for that extra 15%, it just isn't stored in the car.

And you aren't "spilling electrons on the floor" you are likely heating the air around your car and wiring.

Maybe they need two numbers total Wh needed per mile, and Wh per mile from the battery.

That's kinda true.
Although you get a gallon of gas for a paid gallon of gas.....the gas is highly inefficient in that the heat from the engine is a tremendous loss in mileage.

If you are going to compare an ICE energy to an EV energy.....you must do so from beginning to end. EV is tremendously more economical.

 

[Garlan Garner]

It most likely won't be a flat fee. The 3rd party stations will charge for usage, either by the minute, or directly by the kWh.

60kWh * 0.12/kWh = $7.20 wholesale cost, at average U.S. pricing.

Change $0.12 to whatever the utility charges locally, then multiply by 2x/3x/4x, and that's roughly what an unattended 3rd party charger will cost the consumer. Install a few stations outside your highway restaurant/convenience store and when millions of EVs are motoring down the highway the money will roll in (and your restaurant/store will obviously benefit as well).

Everyone was saying the same thing about the current Tesla SC charging structure.

They were saying that Tesla couldn't survive with a flat fee. Really? Seems to be working out just fine.

 

[dhanson865]

I'm still going to guess that Model S/X and Model 3 above $50,000 or so will have free supercharging rolled in or have a large prepaid credit/allowed kWh and the people with cheaper Model 3 under $45,000 will be paying per use with little or no allowed kWh credit.

 

[Garlan Garner]

I'm still going to guess that Model S/X and Model 3 above $50,000 or so will have free supercharging rolled in or have a large prepaid credit/allowed kWh and the people with cheaper Model 3 under $45,000 will be paying per use with little or no allowed kWh credit.

I like your thinking. I agree.

 

[ModelNforNerd]

Seeing as this code shows up on pages for all 3 types of vehicles (or is it just on all MyTesla pages), it's unclear what it will mean for us, if anything.

remember when someone found numbers they thought were tied into our reservation spot in the queue, and Tesla quickly yanked that code from the site? that was fun.

I imagine this code will disappear soon, too, until such time as Tesla decides it means something.

 

[jkk_]

Seeing as this code shows up on pages for all 3 types of vehicles (or is it just on all MyTesla pages), it's unclear what it will mean for us, if anything.

This. And we are also over a year from launch (sure, some might be more optimistic) so it seems weird that something specific for model 3 would be added already.

 

[KeRaSh]

I like the possibility for pre-paid / pay as you go supercharging as an option in addition to free for life supercharging. Depending on the lifetime option costs I might still opt for that but I rarely go on road trips so it would be more of a backup plan. If I'd opt for prepaid kWh I'd probably break even with a prepaid option after 20 or more years... Not sure that would be worth it and if both options are available I could still go for the aftermarket lifetime option anyways.
If prepaid is available it would be cool if every Model 3 came with a free amount of Supercharger kWh to let new owners experience the convenience for free at the beginning.

 

[ModelNforNerd]

What I'm almost certain is happening these days:


Tesla knows we are a rabid fan base, and any inkling of Tesla news is broken down a million different ways within an hour of it coming out.

Let's face it, we know some Tesla people lurk on these boards....

We are a free focus group for them.

"Wanna know how a new pay per kWh feature would test with our demographic, without actually implementing a pilot program? Throw out some hints of code on the MyTesla pages and we'll collect feedback from the forums."

 

[SureValla]

Tesla announces Supercharger openings in Montreal/Magog, Quebec. Upstate NY also seeing love

They are rolling out......Keep being patient and there will be plenty of SC's everywhere.

Now to get the other SC (service centers) going....

 

[Neohippy]

I would prefer pay per use. I can charge at home and work if needed. I rarely take trips long enough that I would need a supercharger. It would be hard for me to pay 2k upfront for something I rarely would use.

 

[ModelNforNerd]

I would prefer pay per use. I can charge at home and work if needed. I rarely take trips long enough that I would need a supercharger. It would be hard for me to pay 2k upfront for something I rarely would use.

I get that. My personal choice would to just not have to worry about it if I buy the bigger battery. My current driving habits make PPU the way to go, but honestly if I had SC'ing baked into the price of the larger battery, I'd probably be more prone to stuff the wife and dogs in the car and go exploring, which is sort of what Elon wants us to do.

If he wanted us to have EVs with tiny little batteries that could only go 80 miles on a charge, he'd have just helped Nissan with their Leaf design.


:::ZING!!!:::

 

[ummgood]

Here is the way I look at it. I am a huge proponent of packages but at the same time if they are figuring the cost of lifetime supercharger is $1200 (my guess) and they increase the large battery cost by that much for lifetime supercharger access I would prefer to just have them discount the large battery or whatever they are going to attach the free lifetime charging too.

If you are one that likes the idea of lifetime charging you can pay the $1200 or $2000 (whatever they want to charge) because they discounted the large battery by that much and you only pay the profit increase. So instead of the large battery being 10k more if it is 9k more without supercharger than to me that is the way I would rather go.

Then I can buy $200 worth of credits at the beginning. I honestly think I might use the super chargers for long trips maybe every other year and occasionally when I need to run to my in-laws by myself (we usually take my wife's Odyssey). I think that $200 worth of credits would last me maybe a couple years.

I do hope they have the complete pricing available when we order. I hope the costs of supercharging with credits (if that is an option) is fully spelled out before I buy the car. I do have to take the risk that the credits will increase over time but hopefully I'll be ahead compared to the price of the option PLUS interest.

 

[ModelNforNerd]

Here is the way I look at it. I am a huge proponent of packages but at the same time if they are figuring the cost of lifetime supercharger is $1200 (my guess) and they increase the large battery cost by that much for lifetime supercharger access I would prefer to just have them discount the large battery or whatever they are going to attach the free lifetime charging too.

If you are one that likes the idea of lifetime charging you can pay the $1200 or $2000 (whatever they want to charge) because they discounted the large battery by that much and you only pay the profit increase. So instead of the large battery being 10k more if it is 9k more without supercharger than to me that is the way I would rather go.

Then I can buy $200 worth of credits at the beginning. I honestly think I might use the super chargers for long trips maybe every other year and occasionally when I need to run to my in-laws by myself (we usually take my wife's Odyssey). I think that $200 worth of credits would last me maybe a couple years.

I do hope they have the complete pricing available when we order. I hope the costs of supercharging with credits (if that is an option) is fully spelled out before I buy the car. I do have to take the risk that the credits will increase over time but hopefully I'll be ahead compared to the price of the option PLUS interest.

My only concern, and I KNOW Elon is smart enough to have already thought of this.....

the per KwH price they charge absolutely has to be cheaper than an equivalent amount of gas.

For many people, that's part of the selling point of an EV. Without that, why not just stay in an ICE?

 

[cronosx]

For many people, that's part of the selling point of an EV. Without that, why not just stay in an ICE?

Because you charge at home and not at the supercharger, that's why

 

[ModelNforNerd]

Because you charge at home and not at the supercharger, that's why

I see you don't have many posts, and are new here....so....

I completely understand that part. I was talking about long distance travel, ya know....when you're NOT home, and are at the mercy of Tesla's Supercharging placement.

If the per kWh price that TESLA CHARGES is higher than an equivalent amount of gas, why bother?


Besides, before we get too deep here, let's remember that in the US, Tesla would have to jump through a LOT of regulatory hoops to be allowed to sell you electricity in many states.

So there's a good chance whatever they're planning is years out, or going to morph into something else entirely before going live.

 

[dsvick]

What I'm almost certain is happening these days:


Tesla knows we are a rabid fan base, and any inkling of Tesla news is broken down a million different ways within an hour of it coming out.

Let's face it, we know some Tesla people lurk on these boards....

We are a free focus group for them.

"Wanna know how a new pay per kWh feature would test with our demographic, without actually implementing a pilot program? Throw out some hints of code on the MyTesla pages and we'll collect feedback from the forums."

I agree! Unless someone wants there CC stored in order to buy swag more easily there is no reason for them to have put this on the site at this time. Also, there is no way this was released without them knowing that within hours someone would have looked at the source code and seen what was there. Now we can all debate it and they can judge reactions, and even glean a few ideas.

Although, these forums are a small subgroup of the people that have reserved, and we're probably not even representative of the majority either.

 

[dsvick]

I do hope they have the complete pricing available when we order. I hope the costs of supercharging with credits (if that is an option) is fully spelled out before I buy the car. I do have to take the risk that the credits will increase over time but hopefully I'll be ahead compared to the price of the option PLUS interest.

I would think that the cost of the credits would almost have to increase over time as the Tesla's costs increase. Also, I wonder if there will be different pricing for different regions where the cost of electricity is higher. In that case the plan may be to let you load your account with a certain amount and then just deduct from it as you use different super chargers. That might be more overhead for them but would let them price access more fairly so that someone in an area with inexpensive electicity isn't paying some price that is averaged alonged with much higher rates.

 

[ModelNforNerd]

I would think that the cost of the credits would almost have to increase over time as the Tesla's costs increase. Also, I wonder if there will be different pricing for different regions where the cost of electricity is higher. In that case the plan may be to let you load your account with a certain amount and then just deduct from it as you use different super chargers. That might be more overhead for them but would let them price access more fairly so that someone in an area with inexpensive electicity isn't paying some price that is averaged alonged with much higher rates.

Tesla can't sell you electricity in many places in the US. Solar City can, but only if it's THEIR electricity to sell, ie solar canopies. So really, at this point, they just snuck some code onto the site to stir us up and gauge reactions.