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Model S range and interior update imminent?
- Thread starter Thorbjorn
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Tic-tac-toe
Member
My body shop guy prefers the S to the 3. According to him, the 3 is much easier to wrap because it is much easier to take apart: the model 3 has 1 bolt to undo while the S has10 and better thought out: Just a more substantial vehicle.
My bad. I didn't realize that was gone. What do people do if they want a roof rack?
The leaked photos of the refreshed interior showed a slimmed down instrument cluster that was just a bump on the slimmed down dash and a landscape center screen.
Carl_Drogo
Member
Whether people agree or not, I think for most Model owners the interior is not the reason they're buying the car. They like that it's electric, that you can charge at home, the gorgeous exterior, the spacious interior, the massive storage, the instant torque, over-the-air updates, big MCU, etc.
Personally, I like the Model S interior. But even if other cars in its class have a better interior it wouldn't be a deal breaker for me if I was buying at that price point (I'm looking at a Model 3). I'd still go for the Model S. I'm preaching to the choir here, though.
When Mercedes, Audi, etc. come out with a comparable electric car to the Model S then Tesla might need to step up its interior game a little bit. But at the moment it's not really an issue affecting their sales, IMHO. It may not be quite as nice as some higher end cars, but it's nice enough.
@RobStark: what's there to disagree about?
The pricing I quoted is a fact, there is nothing one can disagree about factual truth (unless one is Donald Trump of course).
And that the Model S interior (i.e. build/material quality and refinement) is not on par with what one can expect on a 100K USD car is also beyond doubt. Especially as Tesla themselves prove with the Model 3 that they can do better - and for a much cheaper price as well.
Unless one is a fan of oversized vehicles, the Model S doesn't hold a candle to the Model 3 overall.
See, you're propagating the bullshit. The materials in the Model S are identical to an E class. Same buttons, wood, shifters. The leather that used to be available (Nappa) was way better than the standard E class stiff cheap leather, and the Model S comes standard with a plether lined Dash, doors, and arm rests (the E class does not) and also has an Alcantara lined roof (I'm not sure that's even available on non AMG Mercedes). If you want to spring for a designo Mercedes interior at $20k, sure, materials are then a match, with arguably better seats, but you're stuck with the shitty Mercedes infotainment system, which feels like it's from 2005 and a terrible excuse for a panoramic roof, which looks like one on the outside, but on the inside it's just a standard sunroof and a tiny sunroof above the rear seats.
There are renderings. Wouldn’t call them leaked (or photos) as they were released by Tesla I believe
whitex
Well-Known Member
So worst case, Tesla will just display what normally would show up in the cluster on top of the portrait screen, and a scaled down version of landscape screen on the bottom and we'll all be expected to cheer because it allows them unify their software.
Bitter about v9 you ask? Ah, yes. Any other changes to date might have been annoying but eventually you get used to it. V9 keeps annoying me every time I drive.
I don't know if it was leaked or released by Tesla, but I don't believe Tesla ever acknowledged them:
https://electrek.co/2018/07/30/tesla-model-s-x-interior-refresh-exclusive-first-look/
AustinPowers
Total Smeghead
It's not at all about "Baroque". I sat in a recently delivered 2018 Model S just two weeks ago. To my eyes there was zero improvement over the 2016 one I drove back then - or the 2017 model my colleague has. Probably slightly better than the 2013 one I drove five years ago, yet still no match for the competition in the 100K USD segment. Remember, that's the starting price of the Model S over here!
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AustinPowers
Total Smeghead
If you say so.
I have driven several Model S's over the years, and by now have seen so many Model 3 review videos that it feels as if I have spent quite a bit of time in that model even though I have not yet had the chance to see one in person.
Otoh, if all goes according to plan, I will be one of the first in Germany to get my own Model 3 (according to the recent announcement delivery should occur somewhere in the February-March timeframe). Until then I will reserve final judgement, but from what I could gather up to now I stand by my statement - meaning that the Model 3 seems to be superior to the Model S in so many ways that are relevant to the interested car buyer over here.
I compared the Model S to the 5-series and the E-Class late last year when I was looking to get my 2nd S. I much prefer the Tesla interior to the BMW and MB interiors. The material quality is much nicer on the Tesla. The open pore ash wood looks and feels tremendous compared to the plasticy stuff in the Germans. The alcantrana headliner is wonderful. The Nappa Leather on the Germans are on par with the seat covering in the Tesla, but the base Dakota leather is crap. In addition the leather in my old BMWs never held up well, while the Tesla upholstery still looks brand new!
The design of the Tesla is just so much more sleek and modern looking. The BMW interior was just a mess of crap with buttons everywhere and everything else just sprinkled around wherever they seemed to be able to find room. The MB was just ridiculous overly ornate. Its like it was trying way to hard to impress with those silly laser cut speaker grilles.
Seems you were just ahead of your time! LOL.
Tesla bought it back already:Tesla brings back all recently removed options as ‘off-the-menu items’
skitown
Member
If you like the car in your avatar, you will likely prefer the Model 3 due to it's size and driving dynamics. I've owned two BMW 3's over the years and even worked in a high end German car repair shop. I like that size car too. But I recognize this comes down to a person's use case and personal preference. It definitely doesn't mean "Unless one is a fan of oversized vehicles, the Model S doesn't hold a candle to the Model 3 overall" as you stated. I stand by that.
AustinPowers
Total Smeghead
For a start, yes, I do like the car in my avatar, as it is my own current car
And you are correct, even though I really like the Model S per se, it is just too large for comfort, at least under European circumstances. It doesn't feel that large when you drive it on normal roads, but as soon as you enter a parking garage or normal inner city or inner town road, or try looking for a parking space, it's enormous size becomes terrifyingly obvious again. Plus, handling is simply not as sharp as for example that of a 3-series - nor does it need to be, it is simply made for a different use case, like you suggest.
What I meant was that the Model 3 seems like a more well rounded vehicle. The interior is more thought out, better equipped for everyday use, and for European roads it is simply the better choice. Add to that the far cheaper price, and you have a certain winner.
And you are correct, even though I really like the Model S per se, it is just too large for comfort, at least under European circumstances. It doesn't feel that large when you drive it on normal roads, but as soon as you enter a parking garage or normal inner city or inner town road, or try looking for a parking space, it's enormous size becomes terrifyingly obvious again. Plus, handling is simply not as sharp as for example that of a 3-series - nor does it need to be, it is simply made for a different use case, like you suggest.
What I meant was that the Model 3 seems like a more well rounded vehicle. The interior is more thought out, better equipped for everyday use, and for European roads it is simply the better choice. Add to that the far cheaper price, and you have a certain winner.
Even in the western US where cities are much younger and the roads usually on the wide side, you get into the older residential neighborhoods with a large car like the S and things get tight. Around here pickups and SUVs are common in suburbs, but go into Portland and the cars suddenly get a lot smaller.
I notice a split in opinion based on where someone is coming from. My last car before my S cost $22K new and the S is ultra luxurious by comparison (though the other car had more comfortable seats IMO). My car before that was even more spartan.
When you're buying a Tesla, you're paying a premium for the electric power train (mostly the batteries) and the interior is not going to match other cars that sell new at the same price. But the Model S's domination of the $100K sedan market shows there are lots of people who can afford a $100K car, but are not interested in an ICE over $100K. The ultra creature comfort cars have a limited market not so much because of price, but because of demand.
A poll done a few years ago showed the majority of Model S owners had never owned a car worth more than $60K. When I got may S I told them they didn't want my old Buick in trade in, it was a 92 that coast $22K when I bought it new. I speculated my car was probably the lowest value car anyone had traded up from and the delivery specialist said she had dealt with someone coming from a 1987 Corolla.
The refresh S/X interior may have fewer physical controls than the current one. That seems to be the way they're heading. I hope they drop the price to make the car less of a jump from the 3.
I notice a split in opinion based on where someone is coming from. My last car before my S cost $22K new and the S is ultra luxurious by comparison (though the other car had more comfortable seats IMO). My car before that was even more spartan.
When you're buying a Tesla, you're paying a premium for the electric power train (mostly the batteries) and the interior is not going to match other cars that sell new at the same price. But the Model S's domination of the $100K sedan market shows there are lots of people who can afford a $100K car, but are not interested in an ICE over $100K. The ultra creature comfort cars have a limited market not so much because of price, but because of demand.
A poll done a few years ago showed the majority of Model S owners had never owned a car worth more than $60K. When I got may S I told them they didn't want my old Buick in trade in, it was a 92 that coast $22K when I bought it new. I speculated my car was probably the lowest value car anyone had traded up from and the delivery specialist said she had dealt with someone coming from a 1987 Corolla.
The refresh S/X interior may have fewer physical controls than the current one. That seems to be the way they're heading. I hope they drop the price to make the car less of a jump from the 3.
I have a different perspective on this. I leased one of the first model S in town. I had 2 friends drive it, love it, and lease one too.
Fast forward 3 years. I have now a P3D- (sadly confiscated by my wife
), my first Tesla convert has a P3D+, and my second friend just took a test drive in our 3 (he is considering it at the end of his lease). So that makes 2 (possibly 3) former S owners who switched to model 3.He then then asked me if I would order a new model S when my current car (Merc E coupe) comes of lease. I said yes, if the overall quality is upgraded significantly. He did not get it, so we jumped into the Merc after the P3D drive. He then said "I see what you mean".
Point is that the incremental value of current model S over model 3 is simply not justified - at least not to me. The reason the 100-150k luxury market got cannibalized by model S / model X is that there is no Tesla competitor (despite all the talk of "Tesla killers"). Tesla though does have a Tesla model S killer - the Tesla model 3. Unless model S gets a significant upgrade in quality / design, I doubt sustained sales are feasible long term, and I would imagine others will do the same as I did.
So for replacing my second car, I am waiting for the updated Tesla - with a deposit on the Taycan for backup.
FlatSix911
Porsche 918 Hybrid
Tesla appears to be doubling down with the minimalist design trend for the next refresh...and more geared toward autonomous driving.
"Electrek obtained some concept images of the new interior design that Tesla is planning to bring to production next year. To be clear, those images are of the currently planned design refresh, which is still a year from production. The final design could change, but we think it is representative of Tesla’s plan for now"
Joe F
Disruption is hard.
Recently climbed Mt. Washington in my S. Didn't feel as if it were too big to me. May have been different if I could see more than 30 feet due to heavy cloud cover and 50+ MPH winds. Highly recommended to test your spouse and their willingness to trust your driving ability. Or, they can just keep their eyes closed as my wife did. Fun times.
I have used my S to transport large items from Home Depot and other big box stores, and furniture pieces on a whim that I could never get into a M3. Loading a ton of luggage for extended road trips, IMHO, would not be easily done in a M3 either. Maybe not as comfortable either on weeks long road trips as well.
I guess it comes down to what you're used to driving, and as the roads here are not so narrow except for some inner city locations, I'd not feel comfortable in a smaller car, especially when I have 5 people total at times.
Having said that, the M3P looks very compelling, but, the 2020 Roadster even more so.
I have used my S to transport large items from Home Depot and other big box stores, and furniture pieces on a whim that I could never get into a M3. Loading a ton of luggage for extended road trips, IMHO, would not be easily done in a M3 either. Maybe not as comfortable either on weeks long road trips as well.
I guess it comes down to what you're used to driving, and as the roads here are not so narrow except for some inner city locations, I'd not feel comfortable in a smaller car, especially when I have 5 people total at times.
Having said that, the M3P looks very compelling, but, the 2020 Roadster even more so.
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