Musk said all cars would get HW 3.0, according to InsideEVs Article

[qdeathstar]

And you can also add a few thousands if you don't have AP. That's a lot of money for what it is...

Don’t be sad! If it’s not worth it to you, you donot need to worry about it either way...

 

[Knightshade]

Sucks that I paid premium for the car in 2018. It’s more expensive back then. Then it is now even after rebates

People keep claiming this (often the same people in fact...), then when you run the math it keeps turning out not to be true.

Specifically thanks to the rebates.

For example in 2018 my blue LR AWD with FSD was $63,000 including destination, then $7500 fed rebate, so $55,500 net.

Same car today at tesla.com is $59,990 plus $1200 destination, so $61,190

$5690 more expensive today than when I bought in 2018.

 

[duanra]

Don’t be sad! If it’s not worth it to you, you donot need to worry about it either way...

I would have liked to try it, but not at this price. But in any case, i am not sad. I am happy i didn't spend all this cash.

 

[ebmcs03]

People keep claiming this (often the same people in fact...), then when you run the math it keeps turning out not to be true.

Specifically thanks to the rebates.

For example in 2018 my blue LR AWD with FSD was $63,000 including destination, then $7500 fed rebate, so $55,500 net.

Same car today at tesla.com is $59,990 plus $1200 destination, so $61,190

$5690 more expensive today than when I bought in 2018.

Not my scenario. it has been a rip off for me.

No option to buy AWD at the time for me. Long range RWD was $55k with EAP and $61k out the door, after fed rebate $53,500 ish. Today I can get one for $48k and $54k out the door.

And today it has AP standard. And more range. And an additional motor. And HW3 standard. So when I was told in 2018 my car can be self driven. It can’t. Not for another $1500 hardware upgrade.

 

[Knightshade]

Not my scenario. it has been a rip off for me.

No option to buy AWD at the time for me. Long range RWD was $55k with EAP and $61k out the door[/QU, after fed rebate $53,500 ish.

So first of course they don't sell that model anymore, so you can't actually compare them fairly. But let's look at the math anyway.

Today I can get one for $48k and $54k out the door.

And today it has AP standard.

So... $500 MORE today, not less.

And you realize AP has far less features than the EAP you got right?

To make the comparison equivalent you'd add $3000 to your original purchase (price of FSD in 2018)--- and $10,000 TODAY for FSD.

Meaning todays LR AWD with FSD is still $7500 more than your LR RWD with FSD in 2018

Yes you get the second motor. You don't get homelink or a 14-50 adapter though, nor a few other accessories so now you're at about an $8000 price increase today vs then for that second motor.

Which is...actually MORE than what the second motor cost to add in 2018 by thousands of dollars....(upgrading to AWD was only 4-6k in 2018 depending when you ordered)

So again- 2018 was cheaper overall apples to apples- by anywhere from $2000-4000.

. And HW3 standard. So when I was told in 2018 my car can be self driven. It can’t. Not for another $1500 hardware upgrade.

Naah- just buy FSD (which as an EAP owner is cheaper than 10k) and you get HW3 for free.

And any future HW upgrades needed too (which is looking increasingly likely to be needed for the computer at least)

 

[vickh]

I have an email promising that I had 3.0 when I bought in 6/19

oh well. I guess I'd push the issue if I actually wanted to try out FSD. Wonder how it will affect resale

Full Self-Driving Capability​

​

• Navigate on Autopilot
• Auto Lane Change
• Autopark
• Summon
• Traffic Light and Stop Sign Control

Coming Soon​

• Autosteer on city streets

Hardware Upgrade Required​

A Full Self-Driving computer installation of $1,500 is required. Once the installation is complete, you will be eligible to subscribe.

 

[ebmcs03]

So first of course they don't sell that model anymore, so you can't actually compare them fairly. But let's look at the math anyway.






So... $500 MORE today, not less.

And you realize AP has far less features than the EAP you got right?

To make the comparison equivalent you'd add $3000 to your original purchase (price of FSD in 2018)--- and $10,000 TODAY for FSD.

Meaning todays LR AWD with FSD is still $7500 more than your LR RWD with FSD in 2018

Yes you get the second motor. You don't get homelink or a 14-50 adapter though, nor a few other accessories so now you're at about an $8000 price increase today vs then for that second motor.

Which is...actually MORE than what the second motor cost to add in 2018 by thousands of dollars....(upgrading to AWD was only 4-6k in 2018 depending when you ordered)

So again- 2018 was cheaper overall apples to apples- by anywhere from $2000-4000.





Naah- just buy FSD (which as an EAP owner is cheaper than 10k) and you get HW3 for free.

And any future HW upgrades needed too (which is looking increasingly likely to be needed for the computer at least)

Not buying your math. It’s worse than Elon’s timeline.

 

[dmurphy]

People keep claiming this (often the same people in fact...), then when you run the math it keeps turning out not to be true.

Specifically thanks to the rebates.

For example in 2018 my blue LR AWD with FSD was $63,000 including destination, then $7500 fed rebate, so $55,500 net.

Same car today at tesla.com is $59,990 plus $1200 destination, so $61,190

$5690 more expensive today than when I bought in 2018.

Bingo. My April 2019 LR AWD with FSD was $56,000, and I got to claim a $3,750 tax rebate. Net price: $52,250 plus $1,200 delivery (no sales tax in NJ) = $53,450

Today, the same car is $58,990. Plus $1,200 delivery = $60,190.

Almost $7,000 more now.

 

[henh2o]

Sucks that I paid premium for the car in 2018. It’s more expensive back then. Then it is now even after rebates. Not to mention I paid $5000 for Enhanced auto pilot and in Feb 2019 he offered FSD for $5000 for those who didn’t buy FSD or EAP. Rewarded those who didn’t support him. So F that. I’m not giving him another dime. My co-worker got lucky on the whole time time and I got screwed on the whole timeline. So I’m still bitter.

Lol, Yeah same page on you regarding this, but I pretty much just chopped it up as I was naive thinking being an early adopter/supporter mattered to Elon and that the tax incentive push was providing a good deal. This scenario however sucks more for people since they actually expected the FSD HW (which was confirmed by Elon and Tesla twitter) included in their car, but didn't get lol. I am assuming they did not get any discounts for not having the FSD chip as there was no way to tell if they had 2.5 at the time either? People picking up cars in Sept 2019? still getting jipped with 2.5? In the end ppl just let Tesla get away with all their bullshit since no EV has a chance against them

 

[henh2o]

$1500 seems like a very fair price to me for that computing power.

And without a long-term subscription commitment, I would never expect them to provide such an upgrade at no cost - they'd lose their shirt!

Don't think $1500 is a fair price if the person bought a model 3 expecting it to have FSD HW but doesn't... Paid same as someone during that period who does have it? Now has to shell up $1500 to use the FSD subscription?

 

[ElectricIAC]

And you can also add a few thousands if you don't have AP. That's a lot of money for what it is...

The least they could do is credit you the price of the HW3 upgrade against the subscription.

So upgrade and get 6 months comped for upgrading.

 

[dmurphy]

Don't think $1500 is a fair price if the person bought a model 3 expecting it to have FSD HW but doesn't... Paid same as someone during that period who does have it? Now has to shell up $1500 to use the FSD subscription?

Honestly, if someone bought a car without FSD, they should be thrilled an upgrade is an option at all. Every other manufacturer - what you buy is what you have for the life of the car. Not only has there been an option to purchase FSD since day 1, but now a much lower cost subscription option too. Very unique.

If someone bought the FSD package and didn't get the newest computer, I'd totally understand the angst. But for folks who didn't pay for it .... well, you didn't pay for it.

 

[qdeathstar]

Honestly, if someone bought a car without FSD, they should be thrilled an upgrade is an option at all. Every other manufacturer - what you buy is what you have for the life of the car.

yeah, but on the other hand Elon did say that every model 3 has all the hardware needed for fsd...

 

[Knightshade]

Not buying your math.

I'm sorry you don't agree but your claim remains factually untrue, and the numbers demonstrate it.

So do the ones DMurphy posted.

As I pointed out one problem was you were conflating basic AP with EAP despite them having vastly different feature sets... plus comparing two different models of car which obviously have different costs (and those are ALSO higher now than in 2018).

Any way you do it if you compare apples to apples the actual math shows the cars cost more new net today than in 2018. Thousands more in most configs.

 

[KArnold]

I expected much better from Tesla. This customer feels mislead - regardless of the legalities here. I still hold out hope that honesty and integrity will prevail.

I really sympathize. I'd do the same in your position. But did you just use integrity, honesty, and Tesla in the same sentence? No doubt they are way short of those values. Very few would disagree, I suspect. Your sense of equity is not going to change a micro-managed corporate mind.

And Musk is a habitual liar - he can't distinguish truth from fiction. What he says is irrelevant from an honesty and integrity perspective. He has neither, not even a little bit. I'm always surprised by people believing his con.

I agree what they are doing is wrong and unethical. Unfortunately I think it's legal. But I'd focus on the legalities especially if you are considering court action. There's only 1 entity less concerned about doing what is right beyond Tesla - and that's the courts.

 

[Barklikeadog]

I really sympathize. I'd do the same in your position. But did you just use integrity, honesty, and Tesla in the same sentence? No doubt they are way short of those values. Very few would disagree, I suspect. Your sense of equity is not going to change a micro-managed corporate mind.

And Musk is a habitual liar - he can't distinguish truth from fiction. What he says is irrelevant from an honesty and integrity perspective. He has neither, not even a little bit. I'm always surprised by people believing his con.

I agree what they are doing is wrong and unethical. Unfortunately I think it's legal. But I'd focus on the legalities especially if you are considering court action. There's only 1 entity less concerned about doing what is right beyond Tesla - and that's the courts.

I don't see how they wiggle out of this. I recall when the page was updated with all of the guarantees.
At the time the argument was: Do Musk's tweets = promises tesla has to honor? Dealerships do not have to honor verbal
promises, all that matters is what is in writing.

 

[rxlawdude]

I don't see how they wiggle out of this. I recall when the page was updated with all of the guarantees.
At the time the argument was: Do Musk's tweets = promises tesla has to honor? Dealerships do not have to honor verbal
promises, all that matters is what is in writing.

See, using a term like "guarantees" re FSD just shows how far off the range your point is. Scan and post your purchase agreement where there was any guarantee made in writing as to when FSD would install in your car. Then you'd have a point.

 

[Barklikeadog]

See, using a term like "guarantees" re FSD just shows how far off the range your point is. Scan and post your purchase agreement where there was any guarantee made in writing as to when FSD would install in your car. Then you'd have a point.

The guarantee was about hardware.
I recall my opinion at the time being this is BS for two reasons.... 1. i believe Lidar is necessary, 2. i believe you can't have legit FSD until all the cars on the road communicate with each other.
No cars on the road in 2016 will be FSD
No cars currently on the road will be FSD

 

[rxlawdude]

The guarantee was about hardware.
I recall my opinion at the time being this is BS for two reasons.... 1. i believe Lidar is necessary, 2. i believe you can't have legit FSD until all the cars on the road communicate with each other.
No cars on the road in 2016 will be FSD
No cars currently on the road will be FSD

Ok, Cassandra.

 

[mark95476]

So some anonymous nicks, some maybe even actual Tesla owners, are essentially demanding something for free. Good luck with that!

Yall already know this, but it would have been cheaper to buy FSD earlier if you actually wanted it. It came with any necessary HW upgrade(s).