Mustang Mach E is a Gamechanger - My Opinion

[MARKM3]

"
Roam outside of the mapped area, and the system will turn off. You’ll be able to use regular adaptive cruise control, but not hands-free. Ford says that geofencing will expand over time, because of the fact that the Mustang Mach-E has OTA update support.

"

 

[MARKM3]

"
Indeed it’s that connectivity which will be used to turn on the system when it’s finally available. Ford will be installing the necessary hardware from day one – though it won’t be standard on all trims – then deploying the software to enable that hardware later.

“So all of the hardware for that technology will be in the car at the launch,” Dave Pericak, Director of Icons at Ford, confirms. “But we will then do is over the air update. We will enable that feature a little bit later as we finish our development of it.”

Ford is being upfront about the fact that this isn’t autonomous driving. “It’s not quite Level 3,” Pericak says, “it’s a little more than Level 2 with the standard definition of Level 2, but it’s not a Level 3.”

Initially, the Mustang Mach-E’s hands-free system won’t be able to do automatic lane changes. The driver will be responsible for changing lane themselves, at which point the system will re-engage. However, that’s something Ford is working on, and the OTA system means that future updates would be able to add that feature in at a later point.

"

 

[MARKM3]

Ford SYNC 4 first look: Mustang Mach-E high-tech dashboard revealed

Ford is doing A LOT right with the tech here. Great article.

 

[Bill Foster]

Of course I'm assuming those things, Ford has been servicing customers and building vehicles for over 100 years. They don't have the best selling truck in the world because the quality is terrible and their service is terrible. We can make assumptions like those because they are a tried and true brand that was the only American car company to survive the recent recession.

The Electrify America Map looks very good as well, and will soon be up to 3000+ fast chargers capable of up to 350kw supercharging by the end of this year. They are expanding much more rapidly then Tesla Superchargers. Their coverage is already pretty darn good, good enough I wouldn't lose any sleep going with a Mach E over the charging infrastructure.

But yes, the dealers selling them will take a while. Most people will order this car online and go pick it up at the dealership once it is delivered. Don't even get me started on my Model 3 delivery which was a disaster, in a parking lot in Raleigh with a 20 minute look over the car and bye bye don't call us again email us if you have any problems during the December 2019 push.

Having owned and serviced a newer Ford vehicle recently, I wish you all the best, but I think you are in for a rude awakening.

especially on the service side.

 

[DMLou]

Bolt seems a fine car IF it meets your driving habits. It is a small city car or fine for most peoples daily commutes.

I wouldn't call the Bolt a city car. It has a 250 mile range and is relatively peppy at something like 0-60 in 6.9 seconds. Are you sure you're not confusing it with the Nissan Leaf? That's the one that up until recently was limited to only something like 60-80 miles of range. In fact, I looked at the Bolt but didn't go with it as it lacked an AWD option. I've also recommended it to a family member who can't quite plunk down the cash for a Tesla but who does want a more affordable EV, especially given how there are quite a few CPO Bolts available for under $25k with low mileage.

side note: autopilot is not Full Service Self Driving - Pilots gets it, some car drivers don't.
Above 40,000 people per year in the US are dead right - try not to be one of them. Keep you hands on the wheel, pay attention.

Student pilot here and I'm completely with you on this one.

 

[cusetownusa]

Ford SYNC 4 first look: Mustang Mach-E high-tech dashboard revealed

Ford is doing A LOT right with the tech here. Great article.

I really like the look of that interior. I have yet to sit in a Model 3 but based on pictures alone, I am really digging the Mach-E interior to the Model 3.

 

[Knightshade]

And where is the nearest V3 supercharger? When Is tesla going to update ours to V3?

Nearest V3s I'm aware of are in Virginia (multiple locations) so pretty handy if heading north from NC.... going south I think Georgia is nearest.

But as noted, even the V2 ones charge significantly quicker than the Mach E can charge and there's LOTS of those right here in NC.

There are several 350KW chargers nearby and whether the car can accept it or not doesn't really matter

I mean- it kinda does.

Because you continually mentioning something you've been told (but clearly didn't know when you began down this road) doesn't actually work on the car you're talking about is kind of relevant.

when Tesla doesn't plan on updating any of ours to 350kw any time soon.

So that means the Tesla will only charge TWICE as fast on DC charging as the Mach E instead of 3 times faster?

That a big problem for you?

By the time Ford comes out with that capability, they may only have a few big city SC updated in the state.

What capability? Ford hasn't announced any intention, at all, to offer faster charging on the Mach E.

150KW is plenty fast for me, going from 10-80 in 45 minutes is good enough for my once every six month road trip.

Then it's weird you keep fixating on the 350kw chargers the car can't even use.

And keep ignoring the fact the ones it CAN use will charge it 2-3 times slower than a Tesla supercharger charges a 3/Y.

 

[thx1139]

You probably hate the design of the S/X then I would assume

Umm my S doesnt have controls everywhere. Mine is a 2015. It has no controls in the arm rest. Is there any good reason to have the R N D P in the arm rest? My S has some controls in the steering wheel. It has the touch screen and it has a couple of stalks for R N D, turn signals, cruise control and they are all by the steering wheel. My 3 has removed the controls for cruise control.

 

[T3SLAROD]

Ford SYNC 4 first look: Mustang Mach-E high-tech dashboard revealed

Ford is doing A LOT right with the tech here. Great article.

Fords Sync system is superior to anything else offered in ICE cars.

Again, the Mach-E will have to impress on the road to stand a chance with the Model Y.......

So far they are already losing on range, price, Built in Mexico, and push button start on an electric car

I might even go out on a limb and say the Fisker will probably be better than the Mach E

 

[thx1139]

Yeah that's interesting, because I read that they will update the autopilot over the air as more roads are mapped. So I'm confused as to what is going on here with this specific article.

I personally don't mind going 0-60s in mid 6s or a few seconds slower than the AWD Y for $9,000 less. You do sort of get what you pay for I recon. We can't really compare Model 3 to Mustang Mach E, Should compare Model Y to Mach E. The model Y will do 0-60 in 4.8 seconds @ 53k and possibly for 55K will do it in low to mid 4's with software update.

OTA updates for maps an autopilot implies that the Mach-E will be at the mercy of maps and GPS for autopilot rather then the also using the actual road and traffic conditions.

Also need to mention as of now Ford has sold ~120K electric vehicles from what I can find. That means they have 70K to sell before they start losing the credit. If they sell 50K this year like they have stated that means they likely will start ramping down 1st half 2021. That means unless you move up your timetable you likely wont get the $7500 tax credit. Also since it looks like Ford is using a larger battery to get similar range the battery cost will be higher cost part of the car and will likely lead to smaller margins, maybe selling at a loss to start. Dont expect a drop in price anytime soon.

 

[Garlan Garner]

This was posted previously from a user with a different name. His posts had repeatedly been deleted by mods for good reason.

I wonder if his last name is/was McClelland. That would make sense.

 

[ElectricIAC]

Indeed, it mentions things like the quicker AWD versions will have a range of only about 240-250 miles- compared to 315 on the Model Y. This despite having a nearly 25% larger battery.

Also those aren't even coming until mid next year.

In fact none of the versions manage to match the 315 on the Y- with only 1 (the RWD Premium) getting to 300, and the rest in the 210-270 range....let alone the 322 on the Model 3.

And once you knock out the tax credit (which will be gone after Ford sells in the US about 20% of the cars Tesla hopes to sell in 2020 alone) it's priced about $4-10k higher than a comparable 3 or Y.

Interestingly, even WITH the tax credit the higher end cars fall a bit short compared to say a 3... the article says the GT will be $60,500 with a 0-60 of "less than 4" (so 3.9 likely).

Same as the rollout # of the LR AWD that sells for under 50k and has roughly 30% more range.

Hell the 3.5 0-60 (with rollout) LR AWD with boost is still cheaper than that Mach E WITH the tax break for only the Ford.



As I say- they'll still sell all they can make- because the demand for EVs that don't suck is much higher than the supply and Tesla at full tilt it gonna top out somewhere in the 500,000-600,000 range this year... so the ~10% of that a legacy vendor will be able to spit out will get eaten up as long as that's true (and the tax credit sticks around to make pricing halfway competitive).

But they're pretty clearly way behind Tesla on the most of the actual EV tech involved in the vehicle- needing much larger batteries to still offer lower range and generally lower performance for the $.


I WILL give them kudos for offering magnetic shocks, something I'd LOVE Tesla to do. On the other hand they're only offering it in one specific trim, the one that's priced even higher than the $60,500 one (no official price per your link) and not even coming out for another 16 months or more.

Ever think maybe they’re actually being realistic on range?

Because this, besides service wait times is my largest complaint when it comes to Tesla. There’s so much that has to be perfect to get anywhere within 20% of rated range on the dual motor cars.

 

[Knightshade]

OTA updates for maps an autopilot implies that the Mach-E will be at the mercy of maps and GPS for autopilot rather then the also using the actual road and traffic conditions.

Not only that- it means it's not going to work at all on most of the roads that Teslas system works on.

Like Super Cruise, the Mustang Mach-E’s system will be highway-only, at least initially. It requires high-precision mapping of the roads first, which the car then uses – along with a more precise GPS sensor – to make sure it’s in the right place within the lane.

Roam outside of the mapped area, and the system will turn off.

It won't change lanes automatically either-- just lane centering and an equivalent of TACC.

 

[T3SLAROD]

Good point. Car and driver did a comparison with the S and Taycan, range was the same on both. We know that as soon as you drive off you lose about 10 miles of range

 

[thx1139]

Also need to add it isnt just the amount of fast charging stations it is the number of chargers at the station. Looked near Raleigh and saw 1 EA station with 6 stalls and the other 3 with 4. Looked at Tesla Superchargers and the minimum is 8 with a few with 12 and 1 with 16 stalls. Finally it really isnt about how many are close to you. Isnt it more about how many are along your route when you travel.

 

[Knightshade]

Ever think maybe they’re actually being realistic on range?

Given the 210-300 mile ranges they've mentioned are their targeted EPA rated ranges no I don't.

Those are the same conditions Tesla continually puts up well north of 300 on all their LR cars under.

And does it with 25% smaller battery packs too.

 

[MARKM3]

Ford Adds 2nd North American Site to Build Battery Electrics; Michigan Workers to Make Its First Autonomous Vehicles | Ford Media Center

 

[MARKM3]

Nearest V3s I'm aware of are in Virginia (multiple locations) so pretty handy if heading north from NC.... going south I think Georgia is nearest.

But as noted, even the V2 ones charge significantly quicker than the Mach E can charge and there's LOTS of those right here in NC.




I mean- it kinda does.

Because you continually mentioning something you've been told (but clearly didn't know when you began down this road) doesn't actually work on the car you're talking about is kind of relevant.





So that means the Tesla will only charge TWICE as fast on DC charging as the Mach E instead of 3 times faster?

That a big problem for you?




What capability? Ford hasn't announced any intention, at all, to offer faster charging on the Mach E.




Then it's weird you keep fixating on the 350kw chargers the car can't even use.

And keep ignoring the fact the ones it CAN use will charge it 2-3 times slower than a Tesla supercharger charges a 3/Y.

Mach-E's Future
The engineer says that the maximum fast-charging rate for the Mach-E will eventually be 350 kW, though he provides no timeline for this.

Additionally, the Mach-E will be able to receive over-the-air updates, which will include some self-driving features. No timeline was provided.

Over 1,000 engineers are working on the powertrain of the Mach-E alone. This could mean we'll see an even better Mach-E in production form.

 

[MARKM3]

Given the 210-300 mile ranges they've mentioned are their targeted EPA rated ranges no I don't.

Those are the same conditions Tesla continually puts up well north of 300 on all their LR cars under.

And does it with 25% smaller battery packs too.

My LR AWD Aero model 3 never sees rated range. In fact, the best I can get out of it is 260WH/Mi on a road trip so I see 8% range loss on average in good weather. Ford is saying they guarantee meeting at minimum EPA range and while both are saying the same metric, when a car uses more WH/MI then the other, variables play less of a role in the actual range of the car. The heat, for example, will become less proportional if the interior cubic space is roughly the same. That will typically not be a linear hit. What if the Mach E uses the AC system as a heat pump for cooler days and a typical resistance heater for very cold days?

It's all speculation, so let's see how it does. I trust them until they give me a reason not to, sort of like I treat everyone.

 

[MARKM3]

1) I don't think you know how to use Autopilot. If you are getting nags every 10-15 seconds, you're not keeping your hand on the wheel. Autopilot is a Advanced Driver Assistance System. You are still in charge and responsible. Plus, Autopilot isn't limit to speed limit. On non divided non restricted roads, it's limited to speed limit + 5mph
4) The Mach E's charging network is much smaller than the Tesla's.....

Not really much smaller, look at all the Electrify America stations out there supporting up to 350kw. How much smaller is much smaller?

With my hand on the wheel, I might as well drive the car. If you have to put your hand on the wheel, it sort of defeats the purpose of relaxing. I'm a pilot, and when I put the airplane in autopilot I do not have to keep my hand on the yolk.