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Navigation on autopilot in the UK
- Thread starter 4EVar
- Start date
MX AP2.6 2019.16.3.2
I very rarely use autopilot as I rarely drive on motorways and dual carriageways.
Yesterday however, I had to go from Edinburgh to Glasgow and back. I thought this was the perfect chance to try NoA in light traffic, especially on the return at 11pm when it was quiet.
The EU 5 second rule is very problematic and often leaves you looking like an idiot to traffic behind. If I saw someone driving like this I would be very wary of getting alongside them.
I had the lane change aggressiveness set on medium. Generally suggested changes were sensible and it did well in getting back to the left after passing slower moving traffic.
I had one incident where I indicated a lane change, the car got half way across then changed its mind and started to veer back into the lane it started in. I don't know if this was because of the 5 second rule or because of a car approaching from behind, but still well off, in the lane we were moving into. Generally on autopilot I let my hands gently move the wheel in the direction I expect it to be going, so this also resulted in an instant autopilot disconnect as I was holding the wheel to the right and the car then changed its mind and suddenly turned left.
I also had one incident where despite there being absolutely no traffic in the outside lane the car just kept getting closer to trucks in front, then slowed down to 60, then decided it wanted to change lane way too late. This is more annoying than anything else.
The scary thing was action around motorway exits. I had my home in as the final destination which meant we would drive right to the end of the M8 and not take any exits. At one point the car indicated and started to veer onto the exit to a service station. I had to take control and veer back onto the motorway, the exit was way too tight to take at 70. After this I started to pay very close attention at exits. At three other exits the car veered a little bit onto the exit as it often does, but then started to indicate right. I was very uncomfortable and took control as I had no idea what was happening. I couldn't tell if it was going to veer from the exit to the right lane or it was indicating to say it wasn't taking the exit, something that no one would do and would be very confusing to other drivers. The trouble in these situations is that you have to take control before you find out if the car would have been OK in the end. It is just not safe to let it drive erratically. It made me think that the first time the car may have actually done the same thing as I heard the indicator clicking but was looking at the road so don't know if it was indicating right or left.
One thing I am uncomfortable with is the NoA actually forces you to look at the instrument panel and not the road. On normal autopilot you can watch the road and let the car steer and use the throttle, this probably makes things safer as you have more time to watch what is happening. Now you have to constantly look down at the screen to see what the car is planning, I do not see how this makes things safer.
Other things to note are that the car chimed at me quite a few times. At first I thought this was an erroneous side warning, but I now think it was probably a keep your hands-on the wheel warning. I never took my hands off the wheel but on long straight stretches the car maybe couldn't sense them.
Also, and this might just be me, the car always veers left from my normal driving position when I switch on autopilot. I think I tend to drive a little to the right of the lane, although sometimes autopilot isn't well centred. This is fine, except, when passing trucks I feel very uncomfortable and don't know why the car isn't set up to move to the right of its lane to keep the maximum distance between you and traffic on the left if things are clear to the right. At one point a truck gave a shimmy as we passed it, either hit by wind or the driver was dozing off. I would have felt a lot more comfortable if we had been further away from it.
I very rarely use autopilot as I rarely drive on motorways and dual carriageways.
Yesterday however, I had to go from Edinburgh to Glasgow and back. I thought this was the perfect chance to try NoA in light traffic, especially on the return at 11pm when it was quiet.
The EU 5 second rule is very problematic and often leaves you looking like an idiot to traffic behind. If I saw someone driving like this I would be very wary of getting alongside them.
I had the lane change aggressiveness set on medium. Generally suggested changes were sensible and it did well in getting back to the left after passing slower moving traffic.
I had one incident where I indicated a lane change, the car got half way across then changed its mind and started to veer back into the lane it started in. I don't know if this was because of the 5 second rule or because of a car approaching from behind, but still well off, in the lane we were moving into. Generally on autopilot I let my hands gently move the wheel in the direction I expect it to be going, so this also resulted in an instant autopilot disconnect as I was holding the wheel to the right and the car then changed its mind and suddenly turned left.
I also had one incident where despite there being absolutely no traffic in the outside lane the car just kept getting closer to trucks in front, then slowed down to 60, then decided it wanted to change lane way too late. This is more annoying than anything else.
The scary thing was action around motorway exits. I had my home in as the final destination which meant we would drive right to the end of the M8 and not take any exits. At one point the car indicated and started to veer onto the exit to a service station. I had to take control and veer back onto the motorway, the exit was way too tight to take at 70. After this I started to pay very close attention at exits. At three other exits the car veered a little bit onto the exit as it often does, but then started to indicate right. I was very uncomfortable and took control as I had no idea what was happening. I couldn't tell if it was going to veer from the exit to the right lane or it was indicating to say it wasn't taking the exit, something that no one would do and would be very confusing to other drivers. The trouble in these situations is that you have to take control before you find out if the car would have been OK in the end. It is just not safe to let it drive erratically. It made me think that the first time the car may have actually done the same thing as I heard the indicator clicking but was looking at the road so don't know if it was indicating right or left.
One thing I am uncomfortable with is the NoA actually forces you to look at the instrument panel and not the road. On normal autopilot you can watch the road and let the car steer and use the throttle, this probably makes things safer as you have more time to watch what is happening. Now you have to constantly look down at the screen to see what the car is planning, I do not see how this makes things safer.
Other things to note are that the car chimed at me quite a few times. At first I thought this was an erroneous side warning, but I now think it was probably a keep your hands-on the wheel warning. I never took my hands off the wheel but on long straight stretches the car maybe couldn't sense them.
Also, and this might just be me, the car always veers left from my normal driving position when I switch on autopilot. I think I tend to drive a little to the right of the lane, although sometimes autopilot isn't well centred. This is fine, except, when passing trucks I feel very uncomfortable and don't know why the car isn't set up to move to the right of its lane to keep the maximum distance between you and traffic on the left if things are clear to the right. At one point a truck gave a shimmy as we passed it, either hit by wind or the driver was dozing off. I would have felt a lot more comfortable if we had been further away from it.
Tried NoA briefly on the M1 last week. I concluded that it's easier and less stressful to decide your own lane changes so I'm not seeing any benefit outside of true FSD, which this is nowhere near. This is nothing but a dangerous experiment and I fully expect to hear of an accident involving its usage soon. Nethertheless, I'm still a big fan of AP in general. I just feel this functionality is beyond the system's current capability in typical aggressive motorway traffic.
I tried NoA around the M25 (near M4) to just beyond St. Albans turn off and thought that the car placement in the road was ok. I did overtake a few times and I didn't have any lane cancellations. TBH I didn't trust the exit off the motorway so resumed control of the car but will try this next time.
One thing I did notice was that the adaptive cruise control was not as smooth as I had expected and put this down to an aggressive Mini-driver in front who liked to race up to the next car in front. To me the acceleration was a little sharp and if I had been driving I would have probably just kept pace a little smoother - I did have the distance set to "7" which I think is max.
Another thing was that the camera didn't appear to pick up the variable speed limits - is this common? Not a big issue as I'm pretty careful not to hare around the M25 at 90 slowing at every speed camera gantry and tend to stick to a sensible 65mph, but it'd be nice to just stick on AP at it change the speed accordingly (or at least make a note so I don't have to keep on checking every sign).
I just keep on telling myself it's still in beta and will only get better with age...just like getting old
One thing I did notice was that the adaptive cruise control was not as smooth as I had expected and put this down to an aggressive Mini-driver in front who liked to race up to the next car in front. To me the acceleration was a little sharp and if I had been driving I would have probably just kept pace a little smoother - I did have the distance set to "7" which I think is max.
Another thing was that the camera didn't appear to pick up the variable speed limits - is this common? Not a big issue as I'm pretty careful not to hare around the M25 at 90 slowing at every speed camera gantry and tend to stick to a sensible 65mph, but it'd be nice to just stick on AP at it change the speed accordingly (or at least make a note so I don't have to keep on checking every sign).
I just keep on telling myself it's still in beta and will only get better with age...just like getting old
WannabeOwner
Well-Known Member
I don't think AP is as smooth as me, and I put this down to it trying to maintain follow-distance "religiously", whereas I would happily use up some follow distance to smooth my ride. (And, in the case of AP, if something DID slow up in front it would be the brakes way sooner than a human like me ... even a younger one than me
), so i think an improvement would be to "feather" that gap.I haven't tried Chill mode, but that might be smoother in those situations?
I think even nudging the TACC speed one MPH results in a "lurch" to change speed, particularly noticeable if I do nudge-nudge-nudge with a slight gap between each one.
Only AP1 can read speed signs (currently). Can't remember if my AP1 reacts to gantry signs (i.e. if they are just number and look nothing like circle-sign with speed inside), it definitely picks up temporary signs by side of road etc. - even the one on A1 that has a conventional 50 MPH sign with "In 1/2 mile" underneath ... Tesla brings that up on the dashboard immediately
(proper 1st world problem ...no slowing of AP1 for speed restrictions on 70 MPH road, only on slower speed roads - so AP1 does slow when I am on A-Road (60 limit) and come into a 40/30 MPH zone, but on motorway at 70 MPH it does not change speed for a 50 Zone, but does show the sign on the dashboard
They had Nav on AP a few months before us but that’s now over here too. Summon is different over here, it needs the phone and the key fob to work, whereas in the US only the fob is needed. Enhanced Summon won’t really work over here because of how close the key needs to be to the car for it to work.
WannabeOwner
Well-Known Member
Any regional restrictions are applied as you drive into that country. Buying in UK does not get you that "uk only feature" in e.g. France.
WannabeOwner
Well-Known Member
Yup
German autobahn? This was Bjorn's first video of the Model-X Founder Edition which he won
M3BlueGeorgia
Active Member
I tried NoA around the M25 (near M4) to just beyond St. Albans turn off and thought that the car placement in the road was ok. I did overtake a few times and I didn't have any lane cancellations. TBH I didn't trust the exit off the motorway so resumed control of the car but will try this next time.
One thing I did notice was that the adaptive cruise control was not as smooth as I had expected and put this down to an aggressive Mini-driver in front who liked to race up to the next car in front. To me the acceleration was a little sharp and if I had been driving I would have probably just kept pace a little smoother - I did have the distance set to "7" which I think is max.
Another thing was that the camera didn't appear to pick up the variable speed limits - is this common? Not a big issue as I'm pretty careful not to hare around the M25 at 90 slowing at every speed camera gantry and tend to stick to a sensible 65mph, but it'd be nice to just stick on AP at it change the speed accordingly (or at least make a note so I don't have to keep on checking every sign).
I just keep on telling myself it's still in beta and will only get better with age...just like getting old
1) Yes the car doesn't "read" speed limit signs. You guys need this more than we do because of the variable speed limits. Hopefully Tesla will get this working soon.
2) NoA works well for me, but not the auto-lane change capability because I don't trust the recommendation engine enough to activate that option
3) 7 car lengths is a lot. I set it to 3 on local roads (aka dual carriageways) and 4 on Freeways
4) I hate driving behind people who aren't using some kind of cruise control
WannabeOwner
Well-Known Member
Pedantic point: It isn't "car lengths" but rather "time" (so variable with speed)
hehe ... I have no idea how common CC is in UK ... I'm inclined to think "not very", more especially for ACC or TACC (old fashioned fixed speed CC still needing a fair amount of manual-intervention on our overloaded highways), but I'm a lot happier when the car behind me is clearly keeping a decent distance and maintaining that as my speed adjusts
goRt
Active Member
Pedantic point: It isn't "car lengths" but rather "time" (so variable with speed)
hehe ... I have no idea how common CC is in UK ... I'm inclined to think "not very", more especially for ACC or TACC (old fashioned fixed speed CC still needing a fair amount of manual-intervention on our overloaded highways), but I'm a lot happier when the car behind me is clearly keeping a decent distance and maintaining that as my speed adjusts
All golfs since 2014 have ACC as it's a safety feature.
goRt
Active Member
My golf reads the road signs (displaying them in the dash if I choose) including variable speed limits, but cruise isn't linked to this, I have to press a button or 2.
WannabeOwner
Well-Known Member
Yeah, I had ACC on a Blue Motion Eco Golf of about that vintage. It was dreadful, hared up behind a car and then leapt on the brakes ... not exactly Eco Style Driving
I find exactly the same thing (AP2 Model S, 2019.20), it can be quite uncomfortable going past large trucks.
I recently had an AP1 loaner which seemed better centered in the lane. It also seemed to move the right of the lane when going past large trucks, but I didn't test it enough to be sure if this was the case or my imagination. After driving that loaner I was left thinking AP2+ has perhaps still not surpassed AP1, at least not until NoA becomes slightly better developed.
goRt
Active Member
Yeah, I had ACC on a Blue Motion Eco Golf of about that vintage. It was dreadful, hared up behind a car and then leapt on the brakes ... not exactly Eco Style Driving
Fully customisable on the distance (time) behind the car in front, together with 3 modes of aggressiveness, maybe it wasn't configured correctly. I've had 2 without issue.
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