New headlights retrofit

[goRt]

How about we agree to disagree on the prior things and leave them alone. You aren't going to back down from your post that tesla willingly retrofits certain things (which you extrapolate to that they should retrofit anything that is a new version of the same part, if you don't think this is your stance, then you need to reevaluate what you have written and the arguments you have made as to why they should). I am not going to back down from my stance that they are not just retrofitting anything. They are doing it when circumstances are favorable and there is a slight safety adjacent issue that they can "improve".

How about we focus on the issue at hand, trying to make the retrofit work with what is readily available to every Tesla owner, parts and the knowledge from other owners.

You say there are 3 wires, have you tried using other power sources to see if you can power the individual components? Has anyone verified that it is just a software issue and not a different wiring harness? Just because there are 3 pins and the same connector doesn't mean the wires go back to the same pins in the main computer. That is someone needs to try swapping pins to see if Tesla just rearranged them in the connector or at the main computer.

Ok, we'll agree to disagree, but I did identify that Tesla retrofits the PWS where there is no legal obligation to do so

If you believe the wiring harness is key, then please explain how the existing LED would work given only 3 pins, there must be some logic within the unit which the car talks to and controls.
Ergo that should be able to control the matrix lights as only the 3 pins are available, therefore it should be enabled within software.

 

[127.0.0.0]

How about we agree to disagree on the prior things and leave them alone. You aren't going to back down from your post that tesla willingly retrofits certain things (which you extrapolate to that they should retrofit anything that is a new version of the same part, if you don't think this is your stance, then you need to reevaluate what you have written and the arguments you have made as to why they should). I am not going to back down from my stance that they are not just retrofitting anything. They are doing it when circumstances are favorable and there is a slight safety adjacent issue that they can "improve".

How about we focus on the issue at hand, trying to make the retrofit work with what is readily available to every Tesla owner, parts and the knowledge from other owners.

You say there are 3 wires, have you tried using other power sources to see if you can power the individual components? Has anyone verified that it is just a software issue and not a different wiring harness? Just because there are 3 pins and the same connector doesn't mean the wires go back to the same pins in the main computer. That is someone needs to try swapping pins to see if Tesla just rearranged them in the connector or at the main computer.

If someone is trying this.. there is a video on this forum someone posted earlier about the disassembly of the matrix to see the inner components of it..

 

[Mrbrock]

Ok, we'll agree to disagree, but I did identify that Tesla retrofits the PWS where there is no legal obligation to do so

If you believe the wiring harness is key, then please explain how the existing LED would work given only 3 pins, there must be some logic within the unit which the car talks to and controls.
Ergo that should be able to control the matrix lights as only the 3 pins are available, therefore it should be enabled within software.

It can be enabled with software if the pins are the same.

For example on 2020 cars, you have red white and blue wires connected to posts A B and C at the computer and pins 1 2 and 3 at the headlight. A is power and B and C are used for some type of signaling communication. A red 1, B white 2, C blue 3.

Now for the 2021 M3 and MYP you have the same 3 red white and blue wires but at the computer, the wiring is reversed so you now have A blue 3, B white 2 and C red 1 or even A white 2, B blue 3 and C red 1. The colors and pins at the headlight are the same but the outputs from the computer are different. This is why a different wiring harness is required and the “software programming“ won’t make the lights work. There have been instances where service centers here have put the wrong light in during a repair and it doesn’t work even with aTesla level programming.

 

[goRt]

It can be enabled with software if the pins are the same.

For example on 2020 cars, you have red white and blue wires connected to posts A B and C at the computer and pins 1 2 and 3 at the headlight. A is power and B and C are used for some type of signaling communication. A red 1, B white 2, C blue 3.

Now for the 2021 M3 and MYP you have the same 3 red white and blue wires but at the computer, the wiring is reversed so you now have A blue 3, B white 2 and C red 1 or even A white 2, B blue 3 and C red 1. The colors and pins at the headlight are the same but the outputs from the computer are different. This is why a different wiring harness is required and the “software programming“ won’t make the lights work. There have been instances where service centers here have put the wrong light in during a repair and it doesn’t work even with aTesla level programming.

Ok, I accept your explanation on the wiring harness as a valid possibility.

However I remain unconvinced on the second conclusion - it has been reported that Tesla incorrectly fitted matrix lights to a non matrix car. What's not been demonstrated is that during this fitment if Tesla attempted to enable premium LEDs and that failed,, the case I've seen is a single unit installed not a pair




The

 

[Mrbrock]

Ok, I accept your explanation on the wiring harness as a valid possibility.

However I remain unconvinced on the second conclusion - it has been reported that Tesla incorrectly fitted matrix lights to a non matrix car. What's not been demonstrated is that during this fitment if Tesla attempted to enable premium LEDs and that failed,, the case I've seen is a single unit installed not a pair




The

I was talking about the single unit replacement as well, not a set we are talking about the same thing. I would think that if the wiring harness was the same, you’d be able to use the software to say right headlight=LED and left headlight=Matrix and the car would control them separately.

 

[goRt]

I was talking about the single unit replacement as well, not a set we are talking about the same thing. I would think that if the wiring harness was the same, you’d be able to use the software to say right headlight=LED and left headlight=Matrix and the car would control them separately.

My view is that the connectors are likely to be wired the same way, changes to that would be risky/dangerous.
The matrix function will take extra processor when functioning, Tesla would leave that disabled by default. If the service instructions do not include enable premium LEDs then that would explain why the software is not activated.
Testing or a truthful conversation with a knowledgeable Tesla employee will reveal the truth.

 

[WhiteM3P-]

 

[WhiteM3P-]

Does anyone have a 2021 model 3 wiring diagram to compare? I have highlighted the connector for the headlights.
Pin 1 is Power
Pin 2 is LIN <----- My guess is some sort of PWM signal. Might have to hook it up to the oscilloscope to figure out.
Pin 3 is Ground

 

[MP3Mike]

Does anyone have a 2021 model 3 wiring diagram to compare? I have highlighted the connector for the headlights.
Pin 1 is Power
Pin 2 is LIN <----- My guess is some sort of PWM signal. Might have to hook it up to the oscilloscope to figure out.
Pin 3 is Ground

Here is some information on LIN:

Introduction to the LIN Bus Protocol

The Local Interconnect Network (LIN) is a low-cost embedded networking standard for connecting intelligent devices & is most popular in the auto industry.

www.ni.com

 

[WhiteM3P-]

Based off what I'm looking at. It would appear that the "Slave ID" for the new headlight may differ and the new headlight in turn ignores the call outs from the master to do anything. We got any EE guys in the forum?

 

[MP3Mike]

Based off what I'm looking at. It would appear that the "Slave ID" for the new headlight may differ and the new headlight in turn ignores the call outs from the master to do anything. We got any EE guys in the forum?

@rhuber has experience with LIN in a Tesla as he has been working on putting stalks into the refresh Model S.

 

[WhiteM3P-]

Has anyone with both sets of headlights tried using the old ballast on new headlights and then seeing if it will talk to the car? Not sure if it would even fit. Just a thought, since the processing power of the entire headlight lives in the ballast.

 

[eesmjus]

I tried one time last year. My 2021 car recognized the headlight is there but lights did not turn on. Everything else snaps into place though.

 

[goRt]

I tried one time last year. My 2021 car recognized the headlight is there but lights did not turn on. Everything else snaps into place though.

My guess would be old/new left/right all have different IDs or from your experience, it could be either old or new but not both

 

[eesmjus]

My guess would be old/new left/right all have different IDs or from your experience, it could be either old or new but not both

My 2021 arrived with the old head lights. I decided to purchase the new ones sometimes last year but when I tried it, it was not plug and play. Tesla needs push software to my car to recognize the new headlights. I asked my local Tesla service center and they were given specific instructions by software team (HQ?) not to install new head lights. Hope this helps a few people that are interested

 

[goRt]

My 2021 arrived with the old head lights. I decided to purchase the new ones sometimes last year but when I tried it, it was not plug and play. Tesla needs push software to my car to recognize the new headlights. I asked my local Tesla service center and they were given specific instructions by software team (HQ?) not to install new head lights. Hope this helps a few people that are interested

In Europe we have an extra option in toolbox where I'm hoping to be able to enable the configuration, but as it's €175 for 24 hours I'm waiting until warmer weather before trying/asking Tesla for details on what's available.
It appears that the third party Chinese software has the correct option but that's USD 4.5k
Tesla USA will supply / activate the PWS whereas in the UK we're awaiting this to be available

 

[eesmjus]

In Europe we have an extra option in toolbox where I'm hoping to be able to enable the configuration, but as it's €175 for 24 hours I'm waiting until warmer weather before trying/asking Tesla for details on what's available.
It appears that the third party Chinese software has the correct option but that's USD 4.5k
Tesla USA will supply / activate the PWS whereas in the UK we're awaiting this to be available

- What is this extra option in toolbox are you talking about?
- Chinese third party figured it out? So for 4.5k they can install the new headlights?

 

[goRt]

- What is this extra option in toolbox are you talking about?
- Chinese third party figured it out? So for 4.5k they can install the new headlights?

*Service repair and diagnostic" if you go to service.tesla.com and change tou region to Europe the additional option appears with no detail.
An internet video when paused shows the menu option for LEDs with the option to select "premium"

I'd need to do a lot more research before spending 4.5k including seeing what the demand for PWS / matrix being enabled in the UK is

 

[eesmjus]

*Service repair and diagnostic" if you go to service.tesla.com and change tou region to Europe the additional option appears with no detail.
An internet video when paused shows the menu option for LEDs with the option to select "premium"

I'd need to do a lot more research before spending 4.5k including seeing what the demand for PWS / matrix being enabled in the UK is

Also on our US mobile app for Model 3. If you click "upgrade and accessories". Under the "exterior" section it shows new headlights. I'm thinking they might offer it some day to purchase upgrade at the online store.

 

[WhiteM3P-]

Does this toolbox allow us to reconfigure parts such as the headlights and taillights? For instance can I separate the blinker and brake light using this toolbox? (granted that I have EU tails installed.)