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New Navigation Maps for Europe Rolling Out 2021.8
- Thread starter drewpost
- Start date
I got it. My TomTom sat nag used to refer to Norfolk dual carriageways as motorways. Probably just being ironic because we don’t have any motorways. But then they do have four lanes and no grass growing out of the tarmac. B roads could easily be mistaken for fields.Sarcasm doesn't translate very well in the written form
For the absence of all doubt, I was making a (poor) joke about us being excluded from these maps because it says "EU" in it.
No doubt here - poor or not, it made me chuckleSarcasm doesn't translate very well in the written form
For the absence of all doubt, I was making a (poor) joke about us being excluded from these maps because it says "EU" in it.
Sarcasm doesn't translate very well in the written form
For the absence of all doubt, I was making a (poor) joke about us being excluded from these maps because it says "EU" in it.
Ah, you've killed what was turning into a never ending joke with the constant replies
.
Pink Duck
Active Member
I'm curious to know if they've integrated speed limit signs picked up from FSD into the database. Near to home I have a T-junction with 20 mph signs on all approaches with Speed Assist showing database default 30 mph after making a turn there having picked up the 20 mph just before. A slight hope that newer (as in last 15 years) dual carriageways are understood to be just that so that auto lane change works, but that's likely due to forced use of old EU transport network database.
RedMod3
Member
Slightly off-topic but the EU is a political structure that the UK is no longer part of. We will always be part of the geographic area Europe.EU means Europe and UK, CH are european countries
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MrBadger
Badger out
I can see that making matters worse. Speed limit recognition picks up so many wrong road signs from adjacent roads its not funny.
eg If the visual speeds were integrated into the map, then this section of A319 would be incorrectly tagged as 40 - its been a 50 for several years, reduced from NSL. Likewise going the opposite direction, at the next junction it would be tagged as NSL as that are the signs on the other road. It also doesn't help that when this junction is cleared, the speed limit immediately changes to 60 - presumably its getting that data from an out of date base map that pre dates the newer speed limit.
Even more of a pain when in a 30 and it picks up a side street on 20 and TACC wont engage at the correct speed limit.
Misreading road signs from adjacent roads is a pretty fundamental error. Its not like the car doesn't know where the road signs are (their location is pretty accurately visualised) and that it doesn't know that it is a completely different road.
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Pink Duck
Active Member
I've seen no evidence for the UK map database that OSM has been used at all. It seems to mostly be outdated TomTom vector data, where they abandoned maintaining speed limits altogether due to their 'smart' learned routing time estimates taking priority years ago. It's not even possible to get them to correct speed limits in their navigation app. Tesla likely went for the lowest-bidder to get the feature established here. Which is why there's hope for something better now that FSD speed limit sign fleet capture has arrived.
Hot damn. Here it comes! 2020 LR FSD for the winSN 15 is still on the ground.
My M3 is still using 2 year old maps
SN15 still on the ground but looking good for launch. Go SpaceX.
The update has landed. Road test on the morning.Hot damn. Here it comes! 2020 LR FSD for the win
SN15 still on the ground but looking good for launch. Go SpaceX.
SN15 is fueling...
Genuine question as i dont know but do Teslas have an actual traffic sign recognition camera or is it all based on the database?
I am just asking because i know they used Daimler electronics at first and a lot of the Tesla functionality is still closest aligned with Merc as a result, all of my Mercs since 2012 would have shown 40 on the speed limit for A319 when passing that road, only my most recent had the adaptive cruise control so would have automatically reduced speed as a result, but I was so used to the problem of incorrect speed displays that i turned the automatic speed adjustment function off on day 1.
If its a physical sign detection camera then its probably a step too far to assume any intelligence, it just sees a sign and adjusts the displayed limit accordingly otherwise it wouldn’t react to changes in limit or temporary restrictions.
MrBadger
Badger out
Its a bit of both and history involved.
The original Tesla Autopilot system, typically referred to as AP1, was based on the third party Mobileye system. It could do speed limit sign recognition and was apparently very good at it. For whatever reason, Tesla and Mobileye parted company with Tesla going it alone with many premature promises as to when parity would be achieved. Roll on Tesla Autopilot AP2. AP2.5 and now AP3 as they are typically referred, the latter being based on HW3 aka the 'FSD computer'. Due to Mobileye apparently holding patents in speed limit sign recognition (reality was it was more complex than just patents which were very specific in their method), Tesla AP speed limit detection was wholly based on maps.
AP3 bought in significant changes to object detection and visualisation, the first being traffic cones at the end of 2019. I believe that some limited forms of this has been retrospectively applied to AP2.5. I think that traffic cones was really an exercise in Tesla showing that they can both identify and pretty accurately locate fairly small objects. Roll on mid/late 2020, Tesla started to introduce vision based speed limit detection in certain circumstances and only on HW3.
How things stand at present is that visual speed limit detection is for 'local roads' only - how you interpret that is anyone's guess, but if you assumed that excluded Motorways and/or any NOA (an EAP/FSD only feature) enabled roads, you probably wouldn't be far off.
So that section of A319 road is covered under visual speed limit detection, until the system gets itself in a position where it needs some assurance, in which case it reverts to GPS/map based detection. This actually occurs immediately past this junction, as the moment the car realises that the incorrect 40 no longer applies it reverts to an incorrect NSL/60 limit - presumably the map data pre dates the road being changed to 50 several years back.
So what we have is a system that knows exactly where it is, knows exactly what route the car is navigating, knows exactly where the speed signs are yet cannot work out that the speed limits do not apply to the route that the car is driving on. Now, this would be understandable if the car was a bit more basic, but if that section of road was being driven on full autopilot (I'm not stupid enough to try it as I know it would end in tears), it would very likely respond to the incorrect speed limit changes. And its certainly a very basic function needed for FSD. Unfortunately, its not unknown for the car to phantom brake when on high speed roads such as Motorways (so no visual detection going on) because the car has incorrectly used the speed limit for an adjacent junction/intersection.
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