New SDG&E rate: EV-TOU-5

[markb1]

i love this forum! thanks for your post.

maybe you can help me clarify something - our solar went "live" in November 2013. we are going to reach our 5 year anniversary soon. i haven't been keeping up with my SDGE bill review and just assumed they moved us to 4-9pm peak periods (which really sucks if you have solar and kids home from school that period!).

but i just checked my july bill and it shows peak is still 12-6pm. so does that mean after November this year, i lose that and i will be on 4-9pm peak?

Yes, presuming you are on EV-TOU-1 or EV-TOU-2. (EV-TOU-5 does not have this grandfathering.) Note also that the rates are different between grandfathered vs. non-grandfathered. With EV-TOU-2, grandfathered, the summer rates are .40/.38/.23. Without grandfathering, the summer rates are 0.54/0.29/0.23. (In winter, the rates are basically the same between grandfathered and not.)

Here are the details:

Grandfathered: https://www.sdge.com/sites/default/...U (GF) & EV-TOU-2 (GF) Total Rates Tables.pdf
Non grandfathered: https://www.sdge.com/sites/default/...dule EV-TOU & EV-TOU-2 Total Rates Tables.pdf

 

[NathanielHrnblwr]

i love this forum! thanks for your post.

maybe you can help me clarify something - our solar went "live" in November 2013. we are going to reach our 5 year anniversary soon. i haven't been keeping up with my SDGE bill review and just assumed they moved us to 4-9pm peak periods (which really sucks if you have solar and kids home from school that period!).

but i just checked my july bill and it shows peak is still 12-6pm. so does that mean after November this year, i lose that and i will be on 4-9pm peak?

What plan are you on?

 

[wamochi]

Yes, presuming you are on EV-TOU-1 or EV-TOU-2. (EV-TOU-5 does not have this grandfathering.) Note also that the rates are different between grandfathered vs. non-grandfathered. With EV-TOU-2, grandfathered, the summer rates are .40/.38/.23. Without grandfathering, the summer rates are 0.54/0.29/0.23. (In winter, the rates are basically the same between grandfathered and not.)

Here are the details:

Grandfathered: https://www.sdge.com/sites/default/files/regulatory/7-1-18 Schedule EV-TOU (GF) & EV-TOU-2 (GF) Total Rates Tables.pdf
Non grandfathered: https://www.sdge.com/sites/default/files/regulatory/7-1-18 Schedule EV-TOU & EV-TOU-2 Total Rates Tables.pdf

i'm on EV-TOU-2 Grandfathered

i logged into SDGE and it shows that if i go to TOU5 i can save $324 a year?!? but it would immediately shift my peak from 4-9pm so i don't know if i should wait until after the summer? peak production on my solar is obviously during the day so we earn a lot with peak from 11-6.


my true up is on 11/24/18. we haven't been trying to conserve much and liberally using AC this summer, but we are running a cumulative balance of $200 even after the EV credit of $500. so i could try to switch my plan for the next 3 months and try to wipe out balance to nearly $0 by the time the true up comes. but i think i earn more on my solar from 11-6p @ 40c than i would from 4-9p @ 54c. what do you think?

 

[markb1]

i'm on EV-TOU-2 Grandfathered

i logged into SDGE and it shows that if i go to TOU5 i can save $324 a year?!? but it would immediately shift my peak from 4-9pm so i don't know if i should wait until after the summer? peak production on my solar is obviously during the day so we earn a lot with peak from 11-6.


my true up is on 11/24/18. we haven't been trying to conserve much and liberally using AC this summer, but we are running a cumulative balance of $200 even after the EV credit of $500. so i could try to switch my plan for the next 3 months and try to wipe out balance to nearly $0 by the time the true up comes. but i think i earn more on my solar from 11-6p @ 40c than i would from 4-9p @ 54c. what do you think?

It's hard to say. Solar is definitely worth less with EV-TOU-5... a lot less on weekends, holidays, and every day in March and April, were super off-peak lasts until 2PM. But AC could cost a lot less, especially on weekends and holidays, depending on when you need to run it. And if you drive your EV a lot, its going to save you a lot on charging.

If you've got time, you can download your 15-minute interval data from SDG&E and build your own calculator in Excel or Google Sheets, keeping the calculations separate for summer and winter, or by billing period. Too bad SDG&E doesn't do this with their calculator!

BTW, I think your current on-peak time period is noon-6PM, not 11-6.

 

[Skelly]

It's hard to say. Solar is definitely worth less with EV-TOU-5... a lot less on weekends, holidays, and every day in March and April, were super off-peak lasts until 2PM. But AC could cost a lot less, especially on weekends and holidays, depending on when you need to run it. And if you drive your EV a lot, its going to save you a lot on charging.

If you've got time, you can download your 15-minute interval data from SDG&E and build your own calculator in Excel or Google Sheets, keeping the calculations separate for summer and winter, or by billing period. Too bad SDG&E doesn't do this with their calculator!

BTW, I think your current on-peak time period is noon-6PM, not 11-6.

That's kinda the boat I am in. Brand new to solar and Tesla. I have been scouring over all of the different plans, making spreadsheets, driving my wife crazy. ( ), but I am still on the fence. The .09 super off peak is enticing, but the $16 charge a month, the $.53 on peak rate, and the extended super off peak times have me a little leery. I do drive a lot, ~20,0000 miles a year, so I am looking at ~400 kWh a month in charging....

 

[NathanielHrnblwr]

That's kinda the boat I am in. Brand new to solar and Tesla. I have been scouring over all of the different plans, making spreadsheets, driving my wife crazy. ( ), but I am still on the fence. The .09 super off peak is enticing, but the $16 charge a month, the $.53 on peak rate, and the extended super off peak times have me a little leery. I do drive a lot, ~20,0000 miles a year, so I am looking at ~400 kWh a month in charging....

The peak rate is a deal killer to me. I already feel bad enough running the AC in the summer.

 

[wamochi]

i did some math after reviewing my production on SolarOS monitoring system. i took the production from 12-6 peak (i'm still on EV-TOU-2 grandfathered) and multiplied that by the 39c i get right now per kwh.

then i took the production from 4-9pm that i would have to shift to if i switch to TOU5. we have a SW orientation so we have a bunch of panels on two diff roofs, so i get decent production before dusk. here's the math:

From 12-6pm produced 46.92 kwh @ 39c = $18.30

From 4-9pm produced 13.4 kwh @ 53c = $7.10

so i lose $11.20 per day by shifting my peak hours.

but let's say i use 400 kwh per month to charge the car, and that rate goes from 22c to 9c, that saves me $52 per month, less the $16/mo fixed fee, comes out to a $36.00 savings. and that only includes charging the car. if i run AC after midnight, that is greatly reduced also.

so i think all in all, SDGE calculations are about right in saying it'll save me $324 per year. i won't have a choice anyway after November when my 5 year grandfathering period ends and my peak gets moved from 4-9 anyway. but i think i think should just switch now and start saving about $25/mo ...

it just scares me because 6-9p is generally when kids are home from school/practice. right now we wait til 6pm and then blast the AC to get the bedrooms to a comfortable temp. but with new peak hours, we will not be able to wait until 9 and will have to run some AC before then ...

 

[HappyHappy]

it just scares me because 6-9p is generally when kids are home from school/practice. right now we wait til 6pm and then blast the AC to get the bedrooms to a comfortable temp. but with new peak hours, we will not be able to wait until 9 and will have to run some AC before then ...

https://www.sdge.com/sites/default/files/regulatory/7-1-18 Schedule EV-TOU (GF) & EV-TOU-2 (GF) Total Rates Tables.pdf

I hate to break it to you, but the current rates for the grandfathered TOU-2 are a complete scam. Peak is $0.39680/kWh, off-peak is $0.38354/kWh, and super off-peak is $0.22890/kWh. Basically, it's relatively less expensive from midnight to 6 am, then peak for 18 hours a day. So TOU-5 is slightly more expensive ($0.13 more) between 4 pm - 9 pm, but less expensive ($0.10 ~ $0.13 less) the rest of the day. If you use the Green Button tool SDG&E provides, you can see when you use the most energy. For me, the vast majority is due to charging my car, so TOU-5 is an easy call. Even if you run your AC a lot, you spend a bit more from 4 pm to 9 pm, but now you can run it during the daytime and all weekend long without breaking the bank. I guess you can pre-cool the house between 3 pm and 4 pm, and hopefully it won't take as much to maintain the temperature after 4 pm.

As an aside, this totally destroys the point of my solar panels, but I'm sure that's exactly what SDG&E was hoping for. Instead of a 5-6 year pay back time, it's closer to 10 (well, less since I've had them for a couple years already).

 

[Skelly]

As an aside, this totally destroys the point of my solar panels, but I'm sure that's exactly what SDG&E was hoping for. Instead of a 5-6 year pay back time, it's closer to 10 (well, less since I've had them for a couple years already).

This is pretty much how I feel and I just installed my solar.

My installer initially recommended the DR-TOU plan. That has a peak of $.30744 and off-peak is $.25608. I don't see a super-off peak on the rate pdf. That certainly lowers the delta between peak and off-peak, the only caveat being it uses a baseline. If you go over 130% of your baseline, those numbers jump to .538 and .448.

I sent him the EV-TOU5 numbers, and he said that might be great for me...if I can keep my peak usage down.

 

[markb1]

This is pretty much how I feel and I just installed my solar.

My installer initially recommended the DR-TOU plan. That has a peak of $.30744 and off-peak is $.25608. I don't see a super-off peak on the rate pdf. That certainly lowers the delta between peak and off-peak, the only caveat being it uses a baseline. If you go over 130% of your baseline, those numbers jump to .538 and .448.

I sent him the EV-TOU5 numbers, and he said that might be great for me...if I can keep my peak usage down.

Per the rate sheet (https://www.sdge.com/sites/default/files/regulatory/7-1-18 Schedule DR-TOU Total Rates Table.pdf) DR-TOU is closed to new customers. The residential TOU plans that SDG&E is pushing now are TOU-DR1 and TOU-DR2. Those top out at a whopping $0.67kWh and $0.64/kWh, respectively, when you exceed the baseline.

 

[Skelly]

Per the rate sheet (https://www.sdge.com/sites/default/files/regulatory/7-1-18 Schedule DR-TOU Total Rates Table.pdf) DR-TOU is closed to new customers. The residential TOU plans that SDG&E is pushing now are TOU-DR1 and TOU-DR2. Those top out at a whopping $0.67kWh and $0.64/kWh, respectively, when you exceed the baseline.

Yeah, I saw that, but I am not sure how SDGE defines "new customer." I've had their service forever, just not solar. I called and they told me I would be able to switch to DR-TOU. I went through the process online, got the confirmation that I would be switching with my next billing cycle, read more about the EV-TOU5 plan, decided to wait, and canceled my switch-over. Which means I am currently on the default for new solar users, DR-SES.

 

[dipper]

That's kinda the boat I am in. Brand new to solar and Tesla. I have been scouring over all of the different plans, making spreadsheets, driving my wife crazy. ( ), but I am still on the fence. The .09 super off peak is enticing, but the $16 charge a month, the $.53 on peak rate, and the extended super off peak times have me a little leery. I do drive a lot, ~20,0000 miles a year, so I am looking at ~400 kWh a month in charging....

I just signed up last night to switch on next billing to TOU-5. I installed solar just 4 months ago similar to you. That $0.23 super off peak is a killer. Can't hurt when it is one penny cheaper for peak/off-peak. And 14 cents cheaper for super off-peak. That alone will save a lot more than $16 monthly fee. Especially with two EV household... maybe 25k miles total? I am looking at about $75 total savings. Considering I had to pay $230-ish last month with 6.2kW system on the roof. OUCH.

 

[Skelly]

I just signed up last night to switch on next billing to TOU-5. I installed solar just 4 months ago similar to you. That $0.23 super off peak is a killer. Can't hurt when it is one penny cheaper for peak/off-peak. And 14 cents cheaper for super off-peak. That alone will save a lot more than $16 monthly fee. Especially with two EV household... maybe 25k miles total? I am looking at about $75 total savings. Considering I had to pay $230-ish last month with 6.2kW system on the roof. OUCH.

I am close to signing up as well. Since I only have a little over a week of data, I am going to see how September goes. I just had the Tesla wall charger installed, so I will see how the month is with that. I have a running spreadsheet for the billing period. The system I installed (9.7 kW) is supposed to cover my entire usage for the year including the car charging, so I don't want to get to the end of the year, have a negative usage balance, but still owe $192 in fixed fees.

 

[HappyHappy]

I am close to signing up as well. Since I only have a little over a week of data, I am going to see how September goes. I just had the Tesla wall charger installed, so I will see how the month is with that. I have a running spreadsheet for the billing period. The system I installed (9.7 kW) is supposed to cover my entire usage for the year including the car charging, so I don't want to get to the end of the year, have a negative usage balance, but still owe $192 in fixed fees.

Unless your home usage has changed, you should be able to take the data for the entire past year, dump it into a spreadsheet, and calculate under both rate plans. You just have to add car charging, which can be estimated by miles driven times kWh/mile from your car. Just remember that summer and winter have different rates.

 

[Skelly]

Unless your home usage has changed, you should be able to take the data for the entire past year, dump it into a spreadsheet, and calculate under both rate plans. You just have to add car charging, which can be estimated by miles driven times kWh/mile from your car. Just remember that summer and winter have different rates.

I am considering doing this... It does appear that SDGE does keep the data for TOU, but I can't figure out a way to get the data out of their site without going into each individual day of each month and manually hitting the little T button, then copying and pasting the chart. The other, more automated report just give me total usage for the day, which isn't as useful.

 

[markb1]

I am considering doing this... It does appear that SDGE does keep the data for TOU, but I can't figure out a way to get the data out of their site without going into each individual day of each month and manually hitting the little T button, then copying and pasting the chart. The other, more automated report just give me total usage for the day, which isn't as useful.

There’s a way to download your last two years of data in CSV format. It’s in 15-minute intervals, as I recall. I’m not at my computer right now, but when I am, I’ll post directions (unless someone else gets to it first).

 

[markb1]

I am considering doing this... It does appear that SDGE does keep the data for TOU, but I can't figure out a way to get the data out of their site without going into each individual day of each month and manually hitting the little T button, then copying and pasting the chart. The other, more automated report just give me total usage for the day, which isn't as useful.

Here's how to download your last 2 years of data:

1) Don't use Firefox. Chrome seems to work. I haven't tried anything else.
2) Login to your SDG&E account
3) Hover over the "My Energy" link at the top and choose "My Energy Overview".
4) From the "View: My Energy Overview", select "My Energy Use".
6) Click the disk icon. Looks like this (I added the red outline):

7) Select the date range you want and click Export.
8) Wait a while. The page will become unresponsive.
9) When it's done, a blue download link will appear. Click it to finally download your data.

 

[oripaamoni]

so annoying the you have to wait a year before you can change your plans. I got on EV-Tou2 right when i got my car in April. Anybody have know any secrets on how to switch early?

 

[P85_DA]

so annoying the you have to wait a year before you can change your plans. I got on EV-Tou2 right when i got my car in April. Anybody have know any secrets on how to switch early?

 

[Skelly]

Here's how to download your last 2 years of data:

1) Don't use Firefox. Chrome seems to work. I haven't tried anything else.
2) Login to your SDG&E account
3) Hover over the "My Energy" link at the top and choose "My Energy Overview".
4) From the "View: My Energy Overview", select "My Energy Use".
6) Click the disk icon. Looks like this (I added the red outline):
View attachment 331101
7) Select the date range you want and click Export.
8) Wait a while. The page will become unresponsive.
9) When it's done, a blue download link will appear. Click it to finally download your data.

Thanks for your help! I appreciate it.

Unfortunately, when I follow those steps, my data for each day looks like this:

Start Time Duration Value Edit Code Flow Direction TOU
12/18/2017 7:45 PM 15 0 Missing NoTOU

But, if I go into that day, manually, I see the hourly data, for On Peak, Super Off Peak, and Off Peak:

7:00 PM 2.815 0 0

So basically, there is TOU data for each day in there, it just looks like it is not easy to automatically extract. I assume it is because I was not on a TOU plan back then...ie just started solar at the end of August.