Nissan Leaf

[TEG]

Well, I think Tesla published graphs of HP and torque. Perhaps it was enough that no one felt the need to repeat?
Or they did and the results matched so they didn't bother posting?

Roadster Technoloy - Motor | Tesla Motors
Changing torque curves

 

[mpt]

One of the best videos I've seen on range anxiety; what actually happens when you run out of power.

Field Trial: Killing the Nissan Leaf's Battery - KickingTires

I liked it because, a. They planned to run out and said that was the plan... I've seen shows where they always run out but pretend to be surprised when it happens. Can't remember the name of the show right now, used to be popular. b. The experience after failure reminds you that, it's just about getting towed home. No problem, no fuss just some minor inconvenience.

 

[TEG]

Can't remember the name of the show right now, used to be popular.

Yeah, I think I vaguely remember what you are talking about. It had something to do with some old fashioned cars that burned stuff and you had to shift between gears.

 

[mpt]

"Gears" LOL

 

[doug]

b. The experience after failure reminds you that, it's just about getting towed home. No problem, no fuss just some minor inconvenience.

Hmm... but I learned from said TV program that the only option with an EV is to have to push the car around for miles in a desperate attempt to find the rare and elusive electrical outlet.

Seriously, though, free roadside assistance is a great idea to add some piece of mind.

 

[mpt]

Yeah, when I was searching for an outlet last week after being without power for a week, I might have been a little more adventurous if I'd known that running out 2 miles from the charging station would just involve getting a quick tow. In the back of my mind I envisaged cost, a tow truck that had no idea how to move a Tesla, standing around waiting into the night and more cost.

 

[TEG]

...Seriously, though, free roadside assistance is a great idea to add some piece of mind...

Nissan has offered that for Leaf, but seems to be downplaying it recently.

How is this for "changing the subject" ("we will pretend you asked a different question"):
Answers about charging Nissan LEAF | Nissan USA

Q: What happens if you run out of electricity on the road?
A: CARWINGS® is a telematics system in the Nissan LEAF™ which will constantly update to show your vehicle and battery status, as well as charging locations, should you need them.

Also, which manual do you look in? :
Nissan LEAF Roadside Assistance

...the LEAF Roadside Assistance Benefits are nowhere to be found in the Roadside Assistance Guide, provided with your new LEAF...

What is covered? Coverage is provided for:

• Mechanical Breakdown
• Tire FailureAccident/Collision (One-way tow, loaner vehicle not included)
• Out of charge
• Lock-out service

 

[doug]

Nissan has offered that for Leaf, but seems to be downplaying it recently.

That's the marketing department. Nissan was criticized for touting it before. It was being twisted into implying that the car would frequently leave you stranded.

 

[tomsax]

Hmm... but I learned from said TV program that the only option with an EV is to have to push the car around for miles in a desperate attempt to find the rare and elusive electrical outlet.

Here's my new favorite story about outlets vs. gas stations: Where Do You Gas Those Things Up?

The same trip could be done in a LEAF with just a few adjustments.

 

[dpeilow]

Our own Leaf driving friend Paul Churchley put that to the test this week!

My Nissan Leaf Story: Not quite what I had planned!

My Nissan Leaf Story: Ecotricity Charge Station Report

 

[TEG]

About the Leaf battery/pack:
Leaf Battery Pack Presentation

 

[JRP3]

Interesting. I thought it had been determined that the pack was larger than 24kwh and the 24kwh was all that was available, but this says it's 24kwh total and only 21kwh are available. $1324 retail per kwh is horrible :scared: I hope cost is at least near half that. The FUD police will be jumping on that if they see it. There was nothing after page five?

 

[dpeilow]

This seems like a non-official presentation. Not sure of the source or why there is a Motorola logo on it. They probably are just quoting a retail price for a single replacement module.

I had no problem getting past slide 5. I've attached the downloaded file which checks out ok.


View attachment Leaf's Battery.zip

 

[jkirkebo]

Interesting. I thought it had been determined that the pack was larger than 24kwh and the 24kwh was all that was available, but this says it's 24kwh total and only 21kwh are available. $1324 retail per kwh is horrible :scared: I hope cost is at least near half that. The FUD police will be jumping on that if they see it. There was nothing after page five?

The ~21kWh available was established a while ago. Also the $1324/kWh price is single module spare parts pricing. It has little connection with the total battery cost of each car. Try to price a car in it's spare parts and it'll cost you many times the MSRP. The real cost is probably somewhere between $9k and $18k ($375-$750/kWh), my guess is toward the lower estimate.

 

[TEG]

This seems like a non-official presentation. Not sure of the source or why there is a Motorola logo on it...
View attachment 2534

A local Leaf owner put that together from multiple sources, so it may have some inconsistencies.
Sort of a 'Frankenstein-ed' document.

 

[JRP3]

I can see the extra pages now, not sure what was wrong yesterday. I don't understand the charge efficiency numbers, 75-85% seems really poor without an actively cooled pack. The Lithium batteries alone should charge at 98% efficiency, my car charges around 92%, where is all the extra energy going? Maybe the up conversion from line to pack voltage takes a bigger hit? My pack is only at 120V so I'm always converting down from line voltage.

 

[TEG]

There is a coolant pump that circulates coolant through the charger during charging.
They may be taking into account the power drain to run that.

 

[JRP3]

Sure that would be part of it but it should be a small amount of current. My charger has some pretty high powered fans and still gets into the 90's. Of course I don't have any of that cell balancing nonsense :biggrin:

 

[Dave EV]

The 85% efficiency number for 240V L2 charging for the LEAF is based on the assumption that the dash mi / kWh readout is correct.

So who knows what the real efficiency is. All I know is that I'm getting about 3.8 mi / kWh from the wall which is all that really matters.

 

[TEG]

By the way, an idea that I have been tossing around:

If CHAdeMO is DOA in USA, then put 3 J-plugs with three 6.6kW chargers in the car, and plug in as many plugs at once as you can find. (The more the merrier!)

Empty lot with lots of J1772 EVSEs?, hook me up!

The cords tend to be long enough that EVSEs from neighboring spots can reach the nose of the Leaf.
(I think they are designed to also go back to the rear of cars that have charge ports in back.)