21 inch Michelins. Very frustrating. Three alignments and 3-4 right rear tires in 25,000 miles and everybody at Tesla says it's normal!
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OK. Tire wear is past ridiculous. Photo attached
- Thread starter stevepeck1
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- Driving Dynamics Model S
EarlyAdopter
Active Member
Hmm, weird. I got 10,000 miles on my staggered Michelin PS2's and only replaced them because I wanted quieter tires. They still have 4/32 left, pretty even across the whole tire, both fronts and backs. And this is after several track days and a hill climb on them.
Definitely something is off with your alignment. I'd recommend taking it to an alignment specialist, someone who focuses on exotics and track-day suspension setups.
SPXMike
Member
My staggered PS2s (rear) are down to ~1/32 (2 mm) after 8,000 miles. They do all the acceleration and virtually all the braking. My fronts have at least 50% of their tread left. Tesla told me to expect this when I bought the car last year. As of a week ago have aftermarket 20" with 245/40/20 Mich Pilot Super Sports. Treadwear rating is 300; I believe PS2s are 220, and I can rotate front/back now, so should be better. I do not, luckily, have the severe inner wear that you have, although the inner is about 1 mm further worn than the outer on my tires. I've heard this severe inner wear could be due to the high negative camber. There are a couple of threads in this Driving Dynamics forum by lolachampcar about this. Likely you are already familiar with this as you have been on this forum longer than I have.
@stevepeck1 I feel your pain - those tires are by far the most expensive and lowest life tires I've ever had.
@stevepeck1 I feel your pain - those tires are by far the most expensive and lowest life tires I've ever had.
3 alignments over the same period. Never was off. Camber isn't adjustable. Other than the geometry problem that has camber on the edge of limits, I suspect the use of the pedal on the right puts the alignment off each time. It's a P 85+ so in theory it already has stiffer bushings.
tstafford
Active Member
I feel like this isn't the only thread about uneven tire wear. Seems that Tesla's do this.
FWIW - I'm at 8K miles and down to 5/32 on all four tires with even wear. Figure I'll probably change them at 10-12K miles.
FWIW - I'm at 8K miles and down to 5/32 on all four tires with even wear. Figure I'll probably change them at 10-12K miles.
Tesla is ignoring the tire problems on this car! The crappy Continental "performance tires" that comes as Original equipment can't take a pot hole over 10 mph. 3 flats in the first 3 months. Quiet, yes.
Worse! Tesla wouldn't help me when two tires blew on one pot hole. They will ONLY PROVIDE one tire per incident.
Poor follow up by Tesla, and crap tires.
Now I see the tread issue, IF I ever get a tire that lasts more than 4K miles!
Worse! Tesla wouldn't help me when two tires blew on one pot hole. They will ONLY PROVIDE one tire per incident.
Poor follow up by Tesla, and crap tires.
Now I see the tread issue, IF I ever get a tire that lasts more than 4K miles!
OMG! Must scream about Tesla ignoring problems! Seriously...
Funny how tires on my P85 lasted over 40,000 miles. It still accelerates and regenerates in the rear, same camber as the rest. But surely there is a tire problem with this car! not.
Anyone who buys a car like this with staggered tires who then complains about tire wear probably didn't know what he or she was buying in the first place, or why.
I got 24k miles out of my 21s (they were Conti, and could have got another 2k out of them easily). I thought the 21" Michelins had better wear than the Contis.
The key is to get a good alignment. Get the the camber as upright as possible, and get the toe set as straight as possible (don't want excessive toe in -- this is what causes the extreme wear when combined with negative camber). I've found alignment people will just make the lights on the machine green unless you ask for specific alignment, then you will get the guy who actually knows how to work the machines and get a proper setup.
EDIT: The right rear tire, if wearing like that probably has both excessive negative camber, and toe in. If Tesla's alignment people can't fix that problem after being informed you want less negative camber, and less toe in, it would be worth going to a reputable alignment shop (perhaps one that specializes in performance or race cars)
The key is to get a good alignment. Get the the camber as upright as possible, and get the toe set as straight as possible (don't want excessive toe in -- this is what causes the extreme wear when combined with negative camber). I've found alignment people will just make the lights on the machine green unless you ask for specific alignment, then you will get the guy who actually knows how to work the machines and get a proper setup.
EDIT: The right rear tire, if wearing like that probably has both excessive negative camber, and toe in. If Tesla's alignment people can't fix that problem after being informed you want less negative camber, and less toe in, it would be worth going to a reputable alignment shop (perhaps one that specializes in performance or race cars)
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stevepeck1,
That wear is not normal. I have had the same wear in the past and that issue has been fully resolved for me. It's a sign that your rear toe is being set incorrectly. There are already a couple of threads here on TMC about this, but the bottom line is that that isn't normal and can be corrected. There was a period of time that Tesla's Alignment machines came from the manufacturer (Hunter?) with the wrong settings. It's possible that could be the issue and that they are setting toe opposite of how it should be set.
Peter
That wear is not normal. I have had the same wear in the past and that issue has been fully resolved for me. It's a sign that your rear toe is being set incorrectly. There are already a couple of threads here on TMC about this, but the bottom line is that that isn't normal and can be corrected. There was a period of time that Tesla's Alignment machines came from the manufacturer (Hunter?) with the wrong settings. It's possible that could be the issue and that they are setting toe opposite of how it should be set.
Peter
SO to get tires that work as they are intended you must upgrade? Standard parts on a Model S are not functional for prolonged use Bummer
No. Just need to get a proper alignment, so your tires don't wear out prematurely (bad alignments can increase tire wear on any brand of car).
I have run out-of-spec 49psi (cold) for nearly 3.5 years
steve
1. You might consider reading my post in the link below
2. Consider switching to the brutally practical 19s or possibly TSportline's new turbine 20s along with high UTQG rated tires
3. Getting a group buy together and beg Chris1howell of OpenEVSE of sell y'all a batch of his discontinued I-beam ULs
(I am not affiliated in any way with OpenEVSE)
Good-Luck!
Tire wear after first 4,000 miles
Camber is fixed, as said in the past. You can pay ~$1,000 and give up your links for a 1 degree reduction. I had a SAS car measure -2.0 and -1.5, right and left camber, and this contributes to the problem. With an AWD coil car down to the low setting, I don't have specs near me but believe I'm between 1-2 negative on each side, yet I don't have near these issues (4-5/32nds @15k mi, but rotated). This makes me think RWD acceleration and toe changes (like rear inward torque steer), on top of inside wear getting worse as you use wider rear tires (that you can't rotate), are reasons unique to P85+ tire consumption. Bon appetite.
Looking at your photos I do not think that is alignment issue it is way too far to the side without the tire being worn at an angle. I believe something is rubbing when you go over bumps on that side.
The rear camber can be adjusted it requires a new adjustable bolt to be installed in the knuckle I don't know what size it is but this cars suspension is not magic it's just a normal IR suspension. Like I said though something is rubbing most likely too bad you don't live close to me I would figure it out for you.
The rear camber can be adjusted it requires a new adjustable bolt to be installed in the knuckle I don't know what size it is but this cars suspension is not magic it's just a normal IR suspension. Like I said though something is rubbing most likely too bad you don't live close to me I would figure it out for you.
Canuck
Well-Known Member
You have it backwards. 19" are standard and 21" are the upgrade. It's the upgrade that wears faster.
(A) Get your alignment checked on a different machine at a different site. There was a period when Tesla's alignment machines were arriving miscalibrated, causing lots and lots of misalignments, and your Service Center might still have a miscalibrated machine.
(B) If that doesn't satisfy you, get the 19" wheels and tires. The 21" tires wear out really fast.
(B) If that doesn't satisfy you, get the 19" wheels and tires. The 21" tires wear out really fast.
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