Range Loss Over Time, What Can Be Expected, Efficiency, How to Maintain Battery Health

[sperkin]

My LR RWD was at 325 at one time and then dropped back to 310. Now it is down to 300.

My LR AWD is down to 290 from 310.

I hope this is software. From this picture today I guess my car can go over 310. How big is the battery? My car only had like 20 miles of range left in the estimate, but I only used 60kWh.

 

[zannman]

I'd expect this to be something software algorithmic as well. Mine had a defined 2% drop in range at just over 8,500 miles while I was at software 28.3.1.

In my case it didn't show itself until I actually charged to 100%. The 90% estimated range calculation prior to that was good for two full 90% charges after the 28.3.1 firmware update before the drop.

Regarding the theory that this happens to folks that don't charge everyday, I typically only work charge. More than half the time I'm on 3kW EVSE's that don't get me back to 90% during my time there. I'm certain that I don't get the time "bouncing" at 90% and adding a trickle to keep the charge there that you'd get plugged in at home overnight.

In any case I'm not too worried about it. I'm on my 4th EV with one of those being a Leaf, so I know degradation.

Can't wait for the Winter range loss panic threads!

 

[KenC]

For those who want to really pamper their Model 3, this article form Battery University is a really good read.
Lithium-based Batteries Information

Do note that Elon himself said that if you want the battery to last the longest, charge to 80% instead of 90%.
Elon Musk on Twitter
(although the tweet was from 2014)

The Tesla batteries might have better chemistry than the batteries being tested by Battery University, you might not have to charge at 70 or 80% for longevity, but for the past year and a half I never had a day where I said "gee, I wish I charged the car to 90%". So I'm still sticking to my 75% regiment. Another factor is how low you bring your battery down. The least amount of drain between charges, the better. So that's something else to keep in mind.

I charge my car at 75% since April 2018. First day the car would charge to 230 miles, and today the car still charge to 230 miles. I have no idea why it doesn't fluctuate, but I did take a couple of road trips recently.

I pretty much have been following the same regimen as you since Spring. I charge up to 75 to 80. And, like you, I'm showing no degradation. My estimated range is always between 306 and 314 miles. I'm wondering if those who charge to higher SOC levels show some initial degradation that eventually levels off, while those who charge to lower SOC levels don't show this phenomena.

 

[FloridaGary]

Yes, it is definitely expected that the battery will lose capacity with age and, evidently, it starts to manifest itself noticeably somewhat after 5,000 miles just as your history seems to indicate. Check Tesla Model S battery degradation data

I hope not. I am approaching 5k miles and I have already seen my Midrange M3 go from 264 to 255 miles of range from March to now. I owned a 2015 Model S for 3 years and only lost 1 mile of range. I was surprised how little it degraded.

 

[ajdelange]

Way back in No. 45 I posted a graph showing battery degradation of a fairly good sized sample of Teslas. It seems the messages from the graph have been missed:
1)No two batteries will age in the same way
2)Your battery capacity will, most probably decline over time and the decline will, most probably, be most noticeable after about 5K miles.
3)What you will actually experience can vary widely.
4)You won't know how your battery will age until it ages.

 

[jasdelta]

Recently I had a mobile ranger tell me that in a recent update Tesla had made some adjustments lowering FSOC to protect battery longevity. I have no idea whether to believe that or not, but I do know that mine has gone down from 310-295.

 

[SleeperService]

Recently I had a mobile ranger tell me that in a recent update Tesla had made some adjustments lowering FSOC to protect battery longevity. I have no idea whether to believe that or not, but I do know that mine has gone down from 310-295.

This is exactly what I expect (and hope) has happened. Seems like they could have said something about it in the release notes instead of it being speculated about, but... We won't know for sure unless there is something official from Tesla.

 

[KenC]

This is exactly what I expect (and hope) has happened. Seems like they could have said something about it in the release notes instead of it being speculated about, but... We won't know for sure unless there is something official from Tesla.

But why some cars, and not all cars? I have a LW-AWD, like jasdelta, and my car shows the range estimate is still 306 to 314 miles, and my software is 32.2.2. As long as it's just some cars, the idea that Tesla changed the spec doesn't make sense. And how can they sell new cars with the same EPA range estimate? Wouldn't they also have to inform the EPA to have the range re-certified?

 

[Stellavator]

But why some cars, and not all cars? I have a LW-AWD, like jasdelta, and my car shows the range estimate is still 306 to 314 miles, and my software is 32.2.2. As long as it's just some cars, the idea that Tesla changed the spec doesn't make sense. And how can they sell new cars with the same EPA range estimate? Wouldn't they also have to inform the EPA to have the range re-certified?

True. But it is interesting that among those that have lost range, the majority seem to have settled at about 295, and most have occurred near the 10k miles range. Feels more and more purposeful.

 

[duanra]

So a while ago they increased the range (260 to 264 and 310 to 325) also they increased the power. Now there is a rumor (nor confirmed neither denied by Tesla), that they reduced the range but not all cars seem to be affected. What really surprises me is that Tesla is keeping his mouth shut and let rumors spread like the one of the mobile tech on one hand, and also whatever the employees tell owners seeing a major drop in a short amount of time...
looks very messy to me...

 

[Steve Martin]

True. But it is interesting that among those that have lost range, the majority seem to have settled at about 295, and most have occurred near the 10k miles range. Feels more and more purposeful.

I lost 9 miles on this release at just over 10k mile range also on my MR.

 

[DB-Cooper]

3P here. Roughly 6500 miles. I’ve seen this degrade over recent updates. I’ve never charged more than 90% and have only supercharged like 5 times. Yesterday, 90% only got to me to 270 miles (previous updates, I recall 274 being where I was at). 100% would put me at 300 miles range by basic calculation (270/0.9).

I wonder if the recent software update with the wheel selection has anything to do with the recent drop. I haven’t changed wheels, but when messing around with a the UI, it said the wheels will impact the estimated range (and require a reboot). Given I average more like 275 WH/mi on road trips doing 65-70, perhaps they’ve just recalibrated the estimations? The 20” P wheels would be the worst in this scenario. I’ve debated charging to 100% just to see, but I have no functional need. I did a 150’ish mile road trip yesterday starting at 90% and ending at 31% averaging right around 275 WH/mi. 275 is 10% more consumption than the rated 250.

Previously at least, the mile estimate was based on a static “rated” WH/mi. On my 3P, it was definitely 250.0 as verified by some testing using the energy monitor. I wonder if that rated line has moved at all because if it has, then the estimated range would change linearly.

 

[neptunesfinest]

True. But it is interesting that among those that have lost range, the majority seem to have settled at about 295, and most have occurred near the 10k miles range. Feels more and more purposeful.

I wonder if it’s specific to wheel setup? They just added the functionality to toggle between the 3 stock setups so it’s possible that the aeros are maintaining the normal rated range while the 19s and 20s are being calculated differently.

 

[duanra]

I wonder if it’s specific to wheel setup? They just added the functionality to toggle between the 3 stock setups so it’s possible that the aeros are maintaining the normal rated range while the 19s and 20s are being calculated differently.

I have the 18 aero and I also had the range drop.

 

[SleeperService]

I wonder if it’s specific to wheel setup? They just added the functionality to toggle between the 3 stock setups so it’s possible that the aeros are maintaining the normal rated range while the 19s and 20s are being calculated differently.

I"ve got the Aeros on my P3D, so that isn't it (but it does seem like that's about the time my range started dropping, when the update that allows that came out). Mine was rock steady at 309 miles of rated range until ~21k miles when it dropped to the current 298 miles. Is it a big deal? Nope. Am I freaking out about it? Again, nope. Would I like to know what exactly is going on? Yes, yes I would. The fact that it isn't all cars on on given software version does kind of put the lie to the supposition that it is a software update related change though. Oh well, I'm going to continue to drive and enjoy my car and not worry about it (too much...)!

 

[duanra]

We will worry about until it averages 4 % every year. Because in this case it will go over 30% in 8 years, then Tesla will worry about it because that's when they'll have to replace our battery for free.

 

[bradbissell]

My MR range at ~10K miles decreased from 264 to 254 miles. Now at 12500 my rated range at 100% is 248 miles. I charge to 90% when fully charging, otherwise the battery typically remains between 40-80% SOC at other times.

 

[duanra]

My MR range at ~10K miles decreased from 264 to 254 miles. Now at 12500 my rated range at 100% is 248 miles. I charge to 90% when fully charging, otherwise the battery typically remains between 40-80% SOC at other times.

So you are basically babying your battery however you already lost 6 % right ?

 

[jjrandorin]

True. But it is interesting that among those that have lost range, the majority seem to have settled at about 295, and most have occurred near the 10k miles range. Feels more and more purposeful.

But I have no lost range at all, and have 13.5k miles. 90% is still 279 for example.

 

[duanra]

But I have no lost range at all, and have 13.5k miles. 90% is still 279 for example.

Interesting, what software version do you have ?