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Russia/Ukraine conflict

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I'm afraid russians will see this as a way to save face: "we didn't lose to pesky Ukraine, but all of NATO".
If the Russians use it as an excuse to save face, and effectively meet Ukraine requirements for the return of land, then I'm ok with that. That sounds like a different way of describing capitulation or defeat.

However it ends, we can be confident that Russia will spin it as positively as possible for internal consumption. Regardless of how it ends.


Using that resolution as an excuse to go all in. "Hey - we're at war with NATO either way, so lets dust off these nukes and see how they work" kind of logic.
 
If the Russians use it as an excuse to save face, and effectively meet Ukraine requirements for the return of land, then I'm ok with that. That sounds like a different way of describing capitulation or defeat.

However it ends, we can be confident that Russia will spin it as positively as possible for internal consumption. Regardless of how it ends.


Using that resolution as an excuse to go all in. "Hey - we're at war with NATO either way, so lets dust off these nukes and see how they work" kind of logic.

Reminds me of what Timothy Snyder said about the Russians always blaming the US for everything. He said there is absolutely nothing the US could do to get Russia to stop. Russia isn't doing it because they think the US has done something wrong, they are doing it because they need to blame someone else for whatever went wrong and the US is the scapegoat of choice.

Russia will blame NATO for the loss, even if NATO doesn't enter the war. If NATO is drawn into direct conflict, it will give the excuse a bit more credence, but NATO is going to get blamed either way.

And blaming NATO is probably not going to save Putin. At the end of the day, Putin started this war and any Russian who isn't completely drunk on the Kool-Aid knows that this war is Putin's responsibility and when Russia loses, they will blame Putin for it. If NATO is involved in the fight at that point, Putin will be blamed for picking a fight with NATO that Russia couldn't possibly win.

Girkin and Prigozhin have been getting bolder and bolder in their commentary about the war and both have been telling it like it is. Girkin went as far as to blame Putin directly in his latest scree. Girkin could end up having an accident, but Prigozhin would be very difficult to do in.

Prigozhin has positioned himself as the rugged strong man Putin made himself out to be early in his reign. All interviews Prigozhin does now is near the frontlines of the war and he is surrounded by the remaining Wagner people. When someone from the regular Russian army tried to attack the Wagner people, he learned the hard way that Wagner is better than the Russian army.

The fact that Putin hasn't ordered Girkin and Prigozhin taken down means one of two things, either his security forces can't be reliably depended on to take them out if ordered to do so, or Putin is getting spoon fed so many lies at this point he doesn't know that these two are saying what they are saying. I think it was Prigozhin who said the other day that Putin was living in a bubble and didn't really know what was going on.

If Putin tries to spin the war's loss as all due to the US and NATO, Girkin and Prigozhin will probably still be there to tell everyone that it was really Putin's fault.
 
Something happened yesterday. The Ukrainians claim 44 artillery taken out and 30 trucks.

It's getting dangerous to be a Russian artillery gunner.

The total combat losses of the enemy from 24.02.22 to 23.06.23 were approximately:
personnel ‒ about 223330 (+680) persons were liquidated,
tanks ‒ 4017 (+4),
APV ‒ 7798 (+15),
artillery systems – 3985 (+44),
MLRS – 617 (+0),
Anti-aircraft warfare systems ‒ 379 (+3),
aircraft – 314 (+0),
helicopters – 307 (+0),
UAV operational-tactical level – 3447 (+9),
cruise missiles ‒ 1214 (+0),
warships / boats ‒ 18 (+0),
vehicles and fuel tanks – 6708 (+30),
special equipment ‒ 545 (+6).
 

Within 24 hours the pontoon bridge is in place. Cautionary note for those expecting russian collapse. That shows a degree of planning and capabilities. In addition NOEL also has links showing that Russia detected the storm shadows but they could not get their missile to lock on even at point blank range. Good on the brits and french for that.

Also note that the USA says no glide launched bomb til fall. Sigh.
 
Something happened yesterday. The Ukrainians claim 44 artillery taken out and 30 trucks.

It's getting dangerous to be a Russian artillery gunner.

The total combat losses of the enemy from 24.02.22 to 23.06.23 were approximately:
personnel ‒ about 223330 (+680) persons were liquidated,
tanks ‒ 4017 (+4),
APV ‒ 7798 (+15),
artillery systems – 3985 (+44),
MLRS – 617 (+0),
Anti-aircraft warfare systems ‒ 379 (+3),
aircraft – 314 (+0),
helicopters – 307 (+0),
UAV operational-tactical level – 3447 (+9),
cruise missiles ‒ 1214 (+0),
warships / boats ‒ 18 (+0),
vehicles and fuel tanks – 6708 (+30),
special equipment ‒ 545 (+6).
Indeed, ammo tote guy has to be the least favorite job in the russian army.
 
Reminds me of what Timothy Snyder said about the Russians always blaming the US for everything. He said there is absolutely nothing the US could do to get Russia to stop. Russia isn't doing it because they think the US has done something wrong, they are doing it because they need to blame someone else for whatever went wrong and the US is the scapegoat of choice.

Russia will blame NATO for the loss, even if NATO doesn't enter the war. If NATO is drawn into direct conflict, it will give the excuse a bit more credence, but NATO is going to get blamed either way.

And blaming NATO is probably not going to save Putin. At the end of the day, Putin started this war and any Russian who isn't completely drunk on the Kool-Aid knows that this war is Putin's responsibility and when Russia loses, they will blame Putin for it. If NATO is involved in the fight at that point, Putin will be blamed for picking a fight with NATO that Russia couldn't possibly win.

Girkin and Prigozhin have been getting bolder and bolder in their commentary about the war and both have been telling it like it is. Girkin went as far as to blame Putin directly in his latest scree. Girkin could end up having an accident, but Prigozhin would be very difficult to do in.

Prigozhin has positioned himself as the rugged strong man Putin made himself out to be early in his reign. All interviews Prigozhin does now is near the frontlines of the war and he is surrounded by the remaining Wagner people. When someone from the regular Russian army tried to attack the Wagner people, he learned the hard way that Wagner is better than the Russian army.

The fact that Putin hasn't ordered Girkin and Prigozhin taken down means one of two things, either his security forces can't be reliably depended on to take them out if ordered to do so, or Putin is getting spoon fed so many lies at this point he doesn't know that these two are saying what they are saying. I think it was Prigozhin who said the other day that Putin was living in a bubble and didn't really know what was going on.

If Putin tries to spin the war's loss as all due to the US and NATO, Girkin and Prigozhin will probably still be there to tell everyone that it was really Putin's fault.
Girkin is backed by the FSB (KGB) and Prigoshin is backed by a couple in Putins inner Oligarch circle. I would put Girkin as sort of untouchable at this point, he's the voice of the KGB that is very upset with the MOD ..in essence I would view Girkin as the voice of the "deep state" within Russian govt. This is the faction that continuously opposed the west before 1990 and after 1990. MOD vs State vs Oligarchs.

Putin has 3 players here and its important that none become too strong. Where is Wagner now? That's what I would like to know. They are not moving the main focus to Africa. Red herring if there ever was one.
 
Not so random links FYI






 
Since I gave Trent more than one bowl of crap let me be the first to say...I think he's right on the thread @petit_bateau linked to there. Russia moved reserves and then Ukraine blew the rail, in fact that ammo depot blowing really knocked the rail out there for some time I'd think. Not just a few rail ties and rails to put down, the entire area was a crater, plus two bridges cut plus apparently another one. Last night attacking one of the other bridge crossings.

So Russia committed reserves and they don't have ammo for them. Ukraine has breached a significant line of defense. Interesting times.
 
It was possibly four things from two separate directions, or possibly two things from two separate directions. More info regarding the camera system is required to be sure on that point (2x2 or 2x4). I'd say the thing coming from the left is Storm Shadow in its terminal dive phase. The thing from the right I'm less sure about. The thing(s) from the right might be aiming at an adjacent target - is this the location with an old and new bridge side by side and both got hit ? The time on target is spot on within a second, just as if the British had trained them - one does it this way to saturate any enemy defences (PDMS etc). A few decades ago a 2-3 sec window was allowable, but with modern PDMS that window closes to 1 sec or so against a good opponent. Ideally obliquely crossing. Nicely done.

EDIT - the things on the right might be crossing birds. They are somewhat upset by the flashbang.

1687470656032-png.949951
This is one missile. Looks like 2 but it's a frame doubling effect caused by the slo-mo.
 
Not so random links FYI






How embarrassing. The Ruskies were caught with their pant(sir)s down around their ankles. 🙄
 
Not so random links FYI






Interesting how the Russian information is pedantically including “NATO armoured vehicles” and “American Bradleys” for Russian public consumption.
 
It this is sanctioned by Putin, then blaming the Russian Ministry of Defense could be one way of ending this I guess. But if the Dictator is saying that he's ready to 'give' Donetsk back to UKR, then there's of course still all the other parts of UKR that he has occupied...


So was it sanctioned by the Dictator?...

This seems to point to the contrary...

Allegedly: