SF Bay Accident Surveillance Footage

Exclusive: Surveillance Footage of Tesla Crash on SF’s Bay Bridge Hours After Elon Musk Announces “Self-Driving” Feature — The Intercept

Musk has said Tesla’s problematic autopilot features are “really the difference between Tesla being worth a lot of money or worth basically zero.”

apple.news

 

[Daniel in SD]

I think this still counts as a zero disengagement drive, if the driver following had a better reaction time I think FSD beta would have eventually figured it out. Tesla driver was probably making a YouTube video and just got unlucky.

 

[P90D]

FSD needs to be at least as smart as a teen who drives only when she really needs to move stuff around.

Sadly, but ironically, my novice driver daughter hit a pothole (hard not to hit a pothole in San Francisco.) The sidewall of the 22 inch tire on the Model X was cut open instantly … loud noise, shock through the steering wheel, warning lights and noises … she maintained control, put on the hazards and drove with traffic to change lanes and get to safety.

She called me later to say "Tesla roadside is useless, called AAA, they're getting the X on the flatbed now, just checking to be sure they're tying it down correctly, I found 'towing mode' … "

It was torrential rain but she was smart enough to know that the tire was the least of her worries if she slowed down too quickly. : ) Fortunately other drivers slowed and made a rolling road block as she changed lanes and got to safety. It's been raining for weeks and people have started treating it seriously.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

I think this still counts as a zero disengagement drive, if the driver following had a better reaction time I think FSD beta would have eventually figured it out. Tesla driver was probably making a YouTube video and just got unlucky.

I think it is hard to tell from the video if the driver disengaged before the collision. If they did then I think we have to count the disengagement.

Overall I think the car was just being cautious and the brake lights seemed to be working fine so not sure why people did not stop.

 

[emmz0r]

Was it a ghost brake?

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

Was it a ghost brake?

There was bright light at the end of the tunnel but it was midday so glare should not have been awful.

In any case FSD (AP) came safely to a stop (report says 20mph…not sure about that; I would estimate 5-10mph), avoiding any dangers ahead.

 

[2101Guy]

In that crash who was charged? The Tesla driver, or the people that ran into the back of him? In some states, it’s automatically the fault of the person who ran into the back of you.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

In that crash who was charged? The Tesla driver, or the people that ran into the back of him? In some states, it’s automatically the fault of the person who ran into the back of you.

Tesla driver was cited presumably, and another vehicle driver for excessive speed, probably.

“. P-I claims V-1s Full Self Driving mode was active and malfunctioned. In any event, V-I’s left signal activated, V-1’s brakes activated and V-1 moved into the #1 lane slowing to a stop. P-2 observed V-1 stopping and applied V-2's brakes. V-I made an unsafe lane change (21658(a) California Vehicle Code) and was slowing to a stop directly into V-2's path of travel. This caused the front ofV-2 to collide into the rearof V-1 (4.0.1. #1). P-2 did not have enough time to perceive and react to V-1's lane change”

I guess maybe insurance will end up 50/50? Not sure how it works and very complicated in multi-vehicle collisions.

 

[Metralla]

Driver's fault I doubt it's truly FSD but in any event the driver had only to press the accelerator to avoid being rear ended. The car was stationary for a significant amount of time.

 

[thewishmaster]

I've taken both of the left lanes shown in the video on NoA plenty of times and can't imagine what ghosts AP decided to avoid running over that day. The worst thing usually is when you're in the left lane and someone takes that exit shown in the second video - it's pretty sharp and has no dedicated lane so people slow down quite a bit in that left lane. Autopilot still takes forever to react to the car getting out of the way so you have to make sure to push the accelerator manually in time.

The only thing I can imagine relating to FSDb is if it erroneously entered FSDb mode in the tunnel and did its famous unnecessary "changing lanes to avoid obstruction" behaviors that it likes to do lately on my car. (Last time I saw FSDb mode on the freeway it was actually right before that same tunnel while traveling in the opposite direction)

 

[TresLA]

Tesla still has a lot of work to do on FSD before they actually release it (note: they haven't yet). Articles like this perpetuate misinformation and people continue to spread it as well. The article conflates FSD beta with FSD (which hasn't been revealed/finished/released yet) and with FSD Capability (or in this case more specifically "autosteer", NoAP, and TACC some of which isn't part of FSD Capability).

The article tries to tie the reference to what Elon Musk tweeted about (FSDb) to what this driver was using (most likely NOT FSDb since it's not on a surface street). Regardless, both software suites are still SAE level 2. The Tesla driver is clearly at fault for just sitting there doing nothing. It seems pretty clearly not phantom braking. And Autosteer gives up when no response to nags by turning on hazard lights, not just a turn signal and stopping. There's a lot here that the driver and the article are getting wrong (whether intentionally/knowingly or not).

 

[kabin]

It looked like Tesla was already slowing at the tunnel entrance and its turn signal was on early enough for the first following vehicle to brake in time. Rear ending someone is almost always the following vehicle's fault. It looks like the following vehicle took about 4 secs before applying its brakes per the 2nd video.

However there's no excuse for the Tesla slowing and stopping in the #1 lane inside a tunnel. And the Tesla's lane position is odd almost like it wasn't sure which lane to be in. Assuming FSD was operating, it sure looks like another path SNAFU.

I could imagine the Tesla was being navigated to the left lane 15mph exit and the path algo was slow initiate and make a decision so it forced a late lane change and brake for the final failed act. It also answers why the Tesla was slowing at the tunnel entrance. That's my final answer.

 

[2101Guy]

Hands on CEO calls it FSD….but a guy in a forum says it’s not..FSD.


"After wide release of FSD Beta 10.69.2, price of FSD will rise to $15k in North America on September 5th. Current price will be honored for orders made before Sept 5th, but delivered later," Musk said in the tweet. "Note, you can upgrade your existing car to FSD in 2 mins via the Tesla app."

 

[TresLA]

Hands on CEO calls it FSD….but a guy in a forum says it’s not..FSD.


"After wide release of FSD Beta 10.69.2, price of FSD will rise to $15k in North America on September 5th. Current price will be honored for orders made before Sept 5th, but delivered later," Musk said in the tweet. "Note, you can upgrade your existing car to FSD in 2 mins via the Tesla app."

Again, you continue to troll and after being corrected so many times, it's harder and harder for anyone to believe you aren't just trying to find the worst possible interpretation.

And for the benefit of others that may be misled by your lies and twisting of others words: The general public may not be familiar, but "FSD" is often shorthand for "FSD Capability package". Elon Musk and anyone else in the know understands that the final FSD software suite doesn't yet exist, hence the most advanced version we have is called "FSD beta". Purchasing the FSD Capability package is locking in a price for something that doesn't yet exist and has been promised to rise in price for those that don't purchase it. (Disclaimer yada yada: we can and will continue to speculate whether this final FSD software suite will ever exist.) Unless, you actually think Elon Musk is just making a mistake and spouting about a price for a product (FSD) that's called something else on Tesla's website (FSD Capability package), or maybe he doesn't even realize Tesla's not done developing FSD yet?!? Puleez.

 

[2101Guy]

But…the CEO calls it…

FSD.

 

[powertoold]

If all the cars behind were on AP, there would not have been an accident.

This is a case of humans.

This accident could have been caused by NoA. However, it is MUCH more likely:

The Tesla was changing lanes on NoA. The driver saw a car behind approaching, so he INTENDED to press the accelerator. However, the driver accidentally pressed the brake. Notice how fast the car behind was approaching and when the Tesla started slowing down.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

The driver saw a car behind approaching, so he INTENDED to press the accelerator. However, the driver accidentally pressed the brake. Notice how fast the car behind was approaching and when the Tesla started slowing down.

That’s a very reasonable explanation. It explains the incomplete lane change.

If all the cars behind were on AP, there would not have been an accident.

I would not be too sure about that. AP has not demonstrated prowess at partial cut ins and vehicles halfway into lanes.

 

[snorp]

If all the cars behind were on AP, there would not have been an accident.

Using this thought process, one could also claim that if the Tesla was not using any combination of AP/FSD, there would not have been an accident.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

AP has not demonstrated prowess at partial cut ins and vehicles halfway into lanes.

And I don’t think the black SUV following at two car lengths (not behind the Tesla - behind the Tacoma) could physically stop even under computer control given car ahead collided with an object. That was pretty comical, given the generally good outcomes here. Of course with AP maybe they would have all had decent following distance. That’s the real root cause here. And people not immediately applying full brake force.

And I guess that black SUV had 9 passengers?

 

[YNoVA]

"Hey, why is my Tesla changing lanes in front of another vehicle? Oh well I'll let it happen."

"Oh my Tesla is now deciding to stop on a highway for no reason at all? Guess I'll let it happen."

 

[kabin]

If I'm not mistaken that old school Tacoma went around that mess without a scratch. Maybe the message is 'if it ain't broke don't fix it!'