SF Bay Accident Surveillance Footage

Exclusive: Surveillance Footage of Tesla Crash on SF’s Bay Bridge Hours After Elon Musk Announces “Self-Driving” Feature — The Intercept

Musk has said Tesla’s problematic autopilot features are “really the difference between Tesla being worth a lot of money or worth basically zero.”

apple.news

 

[TigerNinety]

On a long trip from DC to Syracuse, NY and back, I had about 6 instances during which AP slowed down radically for "unknown" reasons. I say it that way since, for the moment, it appears that AP felt it had entered a zone in which the speed limit was unknown or much lower than it actually was. This was VERY unpleasant and required me to engage the accelerator manually and then reset the upper speed limit on the screen by hand. It should not have happened, BUT...

It did happen, and I engaged to keep my car going (roughly) with the flow of traffic. Although it could have caused an accident (and I'm anxious to research this further, etc, etc), my intervention insured it did not. I'd have hoped for the same with this driver.

HOWEVER... Any human driver could have braked for any reason (live animal in the road, for example) and the cars behind it would have had the responsibility for stopping in a safe manner behind that car.

It's important to find out what happened and the extent to which FSD contributed to the accident and what the driver did or did not do. But, at the end of the day--from a legal perspective--it's not the driver's fault.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

If I'm not mistaken that old school Tacoma went around that mess without a scratch. Maybe the message is 'if it ain't broke don't fix it!'

No it got rear ended. Since the vehicle behind it was at two car lengths. When that happens, have to really extend following distance in front of you.

 

[stopcrazypp]

I've taken both of the left lanes shown in the video on NoA plenty of times and can't imagine what ghosts AP decided to avoid running over that day. The worst thing usually is when you're in the left lane and someone takes that exit shown in the second video - it's pretty sharp and has no dedicated lane so people slow down quite a bit in that left lane. Autopilot still takes forever to react to the car getting out of the way so you have to make sure to push the accelerator manually in time.

Yeah, I pass through there a lot personally too. That lane rapidly slows anyways regularly because as you say, the exit on the left is a sharp curve. If at all possible, I avoid travelling on that lane or the lane next to it (as people will be making lane changes to try to avoid the slow cars).

The only thing I can imagine relating to FSDb is if it erroneously entered FSDb mode in the tunnel and did its famous unnecessary "changing lanes to avoid obstruction" behaviors that it likes to do lately on my car. (Last time I saw FSDb mode on the freeway it was actually right before that same tunnel while traveling in the opposite direction)

Are you talking about the stop sign where people enter the Bay Bridge westbound from Yerba Buena Island? Or before you reach the tunnel? When I drive, I avoid that lane also on purpose, as that lane people have to accelerate from a stop sign.

 

[thewishmaster]

Are you talking about the stop sign where people enter the Bay Bridge westbound from Yerba Buena Island? Or before you reach the tunnel? When I drive, I avoid that lane also on purpose, as that lane people have to accelerate from a stop sign.

Yeah, the second lane from the right is close to as fast and feels safer when moving past that entrance. But no, I’m referring to being somewhere in a middle lane and the whole visualization turned to FSDb as I approached the tunnel. It went away somewhere by the entrance to the tunnel. Can’t reproduce, no clue why it went into FSDb mode right there

 

[ELETRO]

Statistics fail. It’s entirely possible for Tesla assistance features to be massively safer than human drivers and cause a crash.

How many human drivers do you think caused crashes on the day this one happened?

3 dead, 2 injured in Thanksgiving Day crash

Deputies say two adults and three children were inside the SUV that crashed.

www.wsaz.com

 

[kabin]

No it got rear ended. Since the vehicle behind it was at two car lengths. When that happens, have to really extend following distance in front of you.

Gotcha. It looked like the Tacoma didn't stop. Maybe he stopped a safe distance away or left the scene (no insurance).

 

[Krash]

Moderator Note: Changed the title from “Not Good For Tesla”.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

Gotcha. It looked like the Tacoma didn't stop. Maybe he stopped a safe distance away or left the scene (no insurance).

He stopped. In accident report (that is how we know he got hit, though looking at the video it seems like it is visible, or at least no way to see how he could avoid being rear-ended). Went to a safe place; rational action.

 

[Matias]

In situations like this before, Tesla has quickly commented, when the telemetry data is in their favour.

 

[YNoVA]

Does this part of the tunnel even use FSD or is it the antiqued NoA stack? Did the driver initiate a lane change or was it done by NoA?

I don't live in the Bay Area so maybe someone with FSD on this thread can make a drive through that tunnel to see if the FSD visualization is there.

 

[stopcrazypp]

In situations like this before, Tesla has quickly commented, when the telemetry data is in their favour.

As mentioned up thread, not true from what I can find, if you disagree, please post examples. The last example I can find was when Elon commented on a fatal accident (not on any accidents where there were no serious injuries).

https://twitter.com/x/status/1384254194975010826

A lot more Tesla incidents have happened since then, and he have not commented.

For accidents like this where there were no serious injures, I haven't found cases of Elon commenting (again please feel free to post counter examples). Tesla doesn't have a PR department in the US, so basically it is only his comments AFAIK.

 

[P90D]

fwiw, I'm one of many who've driven both directions across all bridges in the SF Bay Area on Autopilot. I've bought FSD cheaply years ago and had it enabled in the "everyone gets it" update but rarely futz with it beyond the initial "wow, they finally unlocked what I paid for years ago, even though it still does maybe half of what was promised" … : )

Anyway, point being, I've been driving the Bay Bridge on Autopilot since early 2016 and seen all the "one step forward, who knows how many steps backward" releases of AP then sliced up into EAP, etc. Any time it stumbles, you press the accelerator to countermand the ghost brake-check or you wrench the steering wheel out of the hands of Auto-numb-nuts and you mutter something about "drive coast to coast without human intervention" … : ) … but you don't let the car practice parallel parking on the Bay Bridge …

(yes, I agree with the arguments of "but a human driver could need to stop in an emergency" etc.)

 

[TresLA]

But…the CEO calls it…

FSD.

No, he doesn’t call what any Tesla has right now, “FSD”. Stop lying (at worst) and spreading misinformation (at best). Again, it gets harder and harder to believe your reading/listening comprehension is that poor. Read the article. Listen to the soundbite. “FSD coming in around a year!” “…it will be achieved. And my personal guess is we’ll achieve Full Self-Driving this year…” You’re not a very good antagonist (moderator edit) when you link to an article (which is still anti-Elon even) that shows the opposite of what you’re saying.

 

[2101Guy]

No, he doesn’t call what any Tesla has right now, “FSD”. Stop lying (at worst) and spreading misinformation (at best). Again, it gets harder and harder to believe your reading/listening comprehension is that poor. Read the article. Listen to the soundbite. “FSD coming in around a year!” “…it will be achieved. And my personal guess is we’ll achieve Full Self-Driving this year…” You’re not a very good antagonist (moderator edit) when you link to an article (which is still anti-Elon even) that shows the opposite of what you’re saying.

You are arguing that it’s not called FSD…in a thread that calls it …FSD.



(Moderator note: This thread never “calls” anything FSD. The thread was never titled FSD, and neither was the article linked in the first post. Because of this and the fact that your comment wasn’t that funny, I hearby penalize you one of your laugh emojis, so only one laugh and one cry remain. /s

For the record, FSD does not exist. FSD Beta does exist. And you can buy or subscribe to FSD capability, so there is an argument that the capability exists even if FSD doesn’t exist yet. Even more confusingly, buying FSD Capability does not always get you into the beta.)

 

[Watts_Up]

23 P-1 stated V-1 was in Full Self Driving mode at the time of the crash,

The speed limit on the SF Bay Bridge is 50 mph.

I wonder at what speed the vehicles on the videos were going?

If the Tesla was using FSD, and if the vehicle was going faster than 50 mph,
the driver must then have been pressing the accelerator,
so can this situation be considered as Full Self Driving?

If the driver was pressing the accelerator, then could a phantom braking could occured?

 

[mongo]

You are arguing that it’s not called FSD…in a thread that calls it …FSD.

What it's called != what it currently is.

The FSD option currently has, as the the most recent version for public consumption:
Navigate on Autopilot for Highway (also included in Enhanced Autopilot)
FSD Beta for everywhere else
Neither are Self Driving at this point (L2)

NoA has not changed appreciably due to Beta. That transition to single stack will occur with V11.

This occured on the highway, so it should not be related to FSD Beta (if the car even has it).

 

[zoomer0056]

How many human drivers do you think caused crashes on the day this one happened?

At least one, the one this thread is about.

 

[Enginerd]

If the Tesla was using FSD, and if the vehicle was going faster than 50 mph,
the driver must then have been pressing the accelerator,

This is incorrect. TACC/AP/FSD can be engaged with set speed higher than the speed limit with feet on the floor.

 

[kabin]

Maybe the only absolute is software will always have varying degrees of bugs and issues. When software goes into the weeds it's a new normal and all bets are off until the data is accessed and the event recreated.

This topic is getting TSLA attention with TWTR faithful beating their chests. I would be surprised if it didn't have Elon's attention by now.

 

[kabin]

The speed limit on the SF Bay Bridge is 50 mph.

View attachment 894470

I wonder at what speed the vehicles on the videos were going?

If the Tesla was using FSD, and if the vehicle was going faster than 50 mph,
the driver must then have been pressing the accelerator,
so can this situation be considered as Full Self Driving?

If the driver was pressing the accelerator, then could a phantom braking could occured?

From my view the Tesla didn't ever appear to be going fast in provided videos.