State based EV road user charge (Overturned 18/10/23)

[paulp]

There's literally zero prospects of success in legally disputing the validity of a act of taxation duly passed by parliament. If you are going to fight it, fight it in the electorate.

I’m not convinced that any state government can charge you a consumption tax/levy for activities in another state. Only a federal parliament can successfully enact such legislation. Thats is the only part that I think can be challenged. its comparable to the victorian parliament introducing a law that victorians that own real estate in nsw must pay all victorian state taxes on that interstate real estate.
Normal registration is a fixed fee and it doesnt change if you go interstate.

 

[OzVic]

Mines 102,581. That should keep you going for a while ;-)

Might be hard convince the authorities you left your car parked for 3-5+ years..

 

[Grenadine]

I’m not convinced that any state government can charge you a consumption tax/levy for activities in another state.

Of course they can. States used to charge income taxes, for example.

 

[paulp]

Of course they can. States used to charge income taxes, for example.

Actually no, they cannot. That was all resolved in the gst legislation so what happened before then is not relevant to law. Thats why your land tax is only for property you own in your state. None-the-less more than happy to hear about a current state tax a state charges for consumption in another state.

The challenge will come about when another state decides to implement the same tax on all EV’s including those visiting, which is more in line with a toll road type charge. You then have double taxation if your car originated from Victoria.

At some point the distribution of ‘petrol tax‘ becomes murky as well. The feds having lost a stack of income will refuse to fund state road projects, whilst the states flush with a new road user tax from EV’s will have wasted it all on more PR teams. Even though petrol tax isnt directly tied to projects, its an easy out for a future federal government.

 

[Vostok]

Of course they can. States used to charge income taxes, for example.

According to this site “Although income taxation powers were surrendered to the Commonwealth in 1942, in theory the States are able to levy income tax. In practice this is unfeasible as Commonwealth funding to States has been contingent on the States not levying income tax”.

I thought a post-war Constitutional amendment formally ended any right the States had to impose their own income taxes. But skimming the Constitution I may have confused that with Section 115 which prohibits the States from issuing their own currencies.

 

[Vostok]

There's literally zero prospects of success in legally disputing the validity of a act of taxation duly passed by parliament.

Is that a formal legal view? The Commonwealth insisted RoboDebt was legal, until it was proved that it wasn’t.

Plenty of examples of Parliaments passing laws or issuing Regulations that were later struck out or amended due to being inconsistent with either State or Federal constitutions, or inconsistent with common law, therefore unlawful. Parliament passing a Bill does not automatically mean the resultant Act is beyond challenge. An Act remains ‘legal’ until and unless it is successfully challenged. If it is never challenged, a notionally ‘illegal’ Act will remain ‘legal’.

 

[Grenadine]

Not much point debating it on the internet. But yeah, if I were to try to concentrate efforts on getting rid of it, I would encourage folks to direct their attention to the political route than through the Courts.

 

[Grenadine]

Is that a formal legal view? The Commonwealth insisted RoboDebt was legal, until it was proved that it wasn’t.

Robodebt was always an assertion by the executive that a debt was owing. It was always dubious.

 

[AussieOwner]

Is this tax only from July 1st? As a regional person this really screws me ... Ive done over 20k kms this month alone.

 

[BCTS]

Is this tax only from July 1st? As a regional person this really screws me ... Ive done over 20k kms this month alone.

I'm in a similar boat.... Not as much as 20k Km but still around 50k a year ... It adds up

 

[paulp]

Is this tax only from July 1st? As a regional person this really screws me ... Ive done over 20k kms this month alone.

20,000km in 20 days?

 

[BCTS]

20,000km in 20 days?

That's a lot of fast charging.... ;-)

 

[AussieOwner]

That should have read since Feb*

 

[paulp]

SA has very high power prices, and although they vary between retailers, it costs around 6c per km to run a model s. That 8.5c with the tax, or $8.50 per 100km.
Havnt run a petrol car in 6 years, can someone highlight what a petrol car costs per km just for petrol?

 

[meloccom]

SA has very high power prices, and although they vary between retailers, it costs around 6c per km to run a model s. That 8.5c with the tax, or $8.50 per 100km.
Havnt run a petrol car in 6 years, can someone highlight what a petrol car costs per km just for petrol?

I understand that the low emission/consumption calculations comes in at 7l/100km
If we take an average fuel cost of $1.50 per litre at that consumption, the cost is $10.50/100Km.
I'm looking at between $400-$500 per year road usage charge.

 

[PC__LoadLetter]

In NSW existing EVs that paid full stamp duty are being grandfathered out of the 2.5c tax. #ShipOfTheseus #PimpMyTesla!

 

[BCTS]

In NSW existing EVs that paid full stamp duty are being grandfathered out of the 2.5c tax. #ShipOfTheseus #PimpMyTesla!View attachment 675479

Now you see that would have been a useful compromise in Victoria. Announce a New EV User charge tax... Give people a $3000 Discount on the Vehicle Purchase and perhaps even take away the Stamp Duty Charge for them.

Let the small number of owners with existing EV's who have paid Stamp Duty etc on their Cars continue to drive without the EV Tax.
Yet another example of NSW Politicians doing something decent and Victoria ****ing it up.. just like Hotel Quarantine etc.

 

[paulp]

I understand that the low emission/consumption calculations comes in at 7l/100km
If we take an average fuel cost of $1.50 per litre at that consumption, the cost is $10.50/100Km.
I'm looking at between $400-$500 per year road usage charge.

Thanks. It still cheaper to run an EV.

 

[Chuq]

More noises from South Australia

 

[ZeeDoktor]

If these morons were as quick at fixing carbon emissions as they are at preventing a perceived unfair advantage, we'd be looking at more snow in Thredbo this winter already!