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State based EV road user charge (Overturned 18/10/23)
- Thread starter jamesgo
- Start date
of course you shouldn't go back to filling your vehicle with anything other than electricity, for city use anyway. For long range use, swappable solid state H2 cartridges could be very useful and much quicker than charging.
But most importantly, the electricity that goes into our vehicles currently comes mostly from fossil fuels. That is an untenable situation and needs to change. I imagine H2 might make a useful intermediate large scale storage and transport medium for energy. I may well be wrong.
But most importantly, the electricity that goes into our vehicles currently comes mostly from fossil fuels. That is an untenable situation and needs to change. I imagine H2 might make a useful intermediate large scale storage and transport medium for energy. I may well be wrong.
Once the interconnector is built we’ll give you some of SA’s excess renewables power, which is now above 58% of our power on average so is now our baseload source. It will cross the border without the risk of a truck driver crashing or taking covid with it. It will also get to you near instantly once dispatched. But yes many EV’s are charged from fossil fuels, but in every state that is now mixed with renewables So part charged is a more accurate scenario. In some states at certain times thats 100% renewables, and with current greenfield developments the ratio of renewables in your EV is increasing.
As do MANY EV owners, I also charge from my excess solar. Over the past three years, I have only used grid power a couple of (brief) times each winter so my use of fossil fuels to power our EV has been miniscule.
Great discussion on hydrogen.
I see the specific energy of 33kWh per KG compared to 0.2 kWh of batteries and think there just has to be a use case out there for green hydrogen. However every time I start to look into various applications a bit deeper (FCEV, grid storage, aerospace, shipping etc) it becomes apparent that batteries simply need to continue to fall in price and increase in specific energy at their current rates to be economically viable. When lithium ion battery cells are $50 per kWh / 500Wh per KG by the end of this decade and being produced in the tens of terawatt hours it will make the hydrogen use cases smaller and smaller until its just a few niches.
However, if we transition to a fully renewable grid, there will be large periods of time (i.e. when sun is shining) where we'll have an abundance of cheap if not negatively priced electricity. In that case, it may make perfect sense to make green hydrogen (as well as green steel etc)
I just don't think its a large enough market for the government to get involved apart from say a few small scale research grants to keep up to date with the technology and potentially capitalise on the hydrogen market when it starts to pop up. The demand for hydrogen internationally I don't think will skyrocket as much as batteries.
I see the specific energy of 33kWh per KG compared to 0.2 kWh of batteries and think there just has to be a use case out there for green hydrogen. However every time I start to look into various applications a bit deeper (FCEV, grid storage, aerospace, shipping etc) it becomes apparent that batteries simply need to continue to fall in price and increase in specific energy at their current rates to be economically viable. When lithium ion battery cells are $50 per kWh / 500Wh per KG by the end of this decade and being produced in the tens of terawatt hours it will make the hydrogen use cases smaller and smaller until its just a few niches.
However, if we transition to a fully renewable grid, there will be large periods of time (i.e. when sun is shining) where we'll have an abundance of cheap if not negatively priced electricity. In that case, it may make perfect sense to make green hydrogen (as well as green steel etc)
I just don't think its a large enough market for the government to get involved apart from say a few small scale research grants to keep up to date with the technology and potentially capitalise on the hydrogen market when it starts to pop up. The demand for hydrogen internationally I don't think will skyrocket as much as batteries.
Good on Chris Vanderstock for challenging the Vic tax
Donations to their legal fund
chuffed.org
Donations to their legal fund
LEGAL CHALLENGE TO VICTORIA’S "FLAWED" ELECTRIC VEHICLE TAX
We are two Victorian electric vehicle (EV) drivers. We live with our partners and children in suburban Melbourne - Chris is a nursing manager and Kath is an engineering consultant. We think we are pretty normal, everyday people. We drive EVs because we care about our families’ health and the...
chuffed.org
EcoCloudIT
Active Member
Good on Chris Vanderstock for challenging the Vic tax
Donations to their legal fund
LEGAL CHALLENGE TO VICTORIA’S "FLAWED" ELECTRIC VEHICLE TAX
We are two Victorian electric vehicle (EV) drivers. We live with our partners and children in suburban Melbourne - Chris is a nursing manager and Kath is an engineering consultant. We think we are pretty normal, everyday people. We drive EVs because we care about our families’ health and the...
Donated….spread the word everyone….
Just chipped in $100. Good luck to them! Wrote to my Labor member about this issue -- never got a reply. Pathetic.Good on Chris Vanderstock for challenging the Vic tax
Donations to their legal fund
LEGAL CHALLENGE TO VICTORIA’S "FLAWED" ELECTRIC VEHICLE TAX
We are two Victorian electric vehicle (EV) drivers. We live with our partners and children in suburban Melbourne - Chris is a nursing manager and Kath is an engineering consultant. We think we are pretty normal, everyday people. We drive EVs because we care about our families’ health and the...
AussieOwner
White M3 2021 LR
Oh god yes…. Take my money !! All taxation is theft but this one is much more abhorrent then others so I really hope this wins.
Umm no. But next time that ambulance takes you on a road to a hospital you can contemplate your tax at work. Much tax is wasted and therefore doesnt need to be levied.
Last time I had to call an ambulance the invoice I received later gave me a nosebleed! They double dip, like all good aussies. Claim you need taxes to pay for X, then add a surcharge, or a deductible, or an excess, or whatever fancy accounting name they can find for it. It makes franking credits look trivial.
So much is wasted. The #1 goal of governments should be to optimise every dollar collected not try everything and anything to collect more.
There is inefficiency everywhere, it isn’t unique to government. But, yes, I agree efficiency with public money should always be a priority.
I would argue the #1 goal should be delivering good outcomes. I have seen optimisation/efficiency lead to some pretty poor outcomes in many places.
Oh trigger topic! Let me tell you how I really feel about efficiency!
Screw efficiency. Sideways. With a pineapple. This misguided pursuit of efficiency F-ed up (yes, capital F) pretty much every software product I ever owned, every hardware product I ever bought a new iteration of, every project I ever participated in, and most importantly, every project I ever led after having become subject to efficiency demands that could only be met by selecting essential bits and bobs at random - and cutting or crippling them.
Oh and the unholiest of all, the efficiency dividend! Screw government, too. With two pineapples, one for each hole.
Screw efficiency. Sideways. With a pineapple. This misguided pursuit of efficiency F-ed up (yes, capital F) pretty much every software product I ever owned, every hardware product I ever bought a new iteration of, every project I ever participated in, and most importantly, every project I ever led after having become subject to efficiency demands that could only be met by selecting essential bits and bobs at random - and cutting or crippling them.
Oh and the unholiest of all, the efficiency dividend! Screw government, too. With two pineapples, one for each hole.
Which I struggle to believe is constitutional, but I’m not a lawyer
We haven’t seen the legislation in NSW yet to implement a RUC - and given they don’t plan to start one until 2027 or EV sales are 30% of all new sales, we might not see how they propose to do it in the legislation going to Parliament next month.
Perhaps NSW has deliberately kicked that can down the road because they wanted to see (a) if anyone challenged it in VIC and (b) whether the challenge is ultimately successful.
A successful challenge could restrict its effect to the State concerned, or potentially strike out an RUC implemented at a State level.
The former would open up a can of worms - having to track how much distance was driven only in the State of vehicle registration and be a perfect loophole for drivers (I did 99% of my driving in Queensland last year - honest).
The latter would be a case of “careful what you wish for” because then the States might ask the Feds to step in, and with the current Federal Government, they could implement an even worse RUC for EVs to keep their fossil fuel donors happy and to “protect Australian weekends” by making sure as few people as possible buy EVs.
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