SuperCharge every day?

[paco3791]

I do wonder though how some of these posters who have no problem with people using them instead of charging at home will feel when they start having to wait an hour to use it when they actually need them.

Simple, lets as a community agree that we are all going to be considerate and not let that happen. If someone else needs to charge when you have other options, give way for that person. I would love to see Tesla integrate a messaging service at SC's or even a simple notification system, like ChargePoint has for there chargers, so you can go online and see which plugs are in use and which ones aren't.

Hopefully this will be an issue eventually, regardless of the commute charging, because that will mean a huge number of Tesla's on the road! Which will hopefully push expansion of the SC network.

 

[WarpedOne]

Depends on how much electricity cost I guess. So if you live in Germany, you are paying about USD0.40 per KW/h. People with high usage in the area I live in can easily pay USD0.35 per KW/h. So filling up 70KW/h or so costs USD 25, more that that if you live in Germany. Now that gets me about 200 miles (The same in an ICE car would be about 7 gallons at $3.5 per gallon = $25).

If I would be living in Washington State and pay $5 to fill my car I would not spend time at a supercharger. But at $25 things start to add up.

After buying a 100k car you rather spend a few hours of your free time waiting on charging than paying 25$ for the night charge?
Not me, I value my free time higher than 25$.

 

[scaesare]

Certainly lots of folks are of the opinion that the wording on Tesla's web page does not prohibit using supercharging specifically to avoid having to pay your own electrical costs. And technically they are right. That's the letter of the law.

But I don't think it's the spirit of the law. Just because something is not prohibited does not mean the usage aligns with the intent of the provider. Tesla has always discussed supercharging as removing the obstacle to "long distance travel" and take a "road trip" (Elon's words), where you don't have alternative typical destination-style charging available. Note the description on Tesla's web site regarding supercharging on the Model S page:

Superchargers are for refueling quickly on road trips. ... Superchargers will be positioned at convenient locations along major interstates throughout the country.

Now, folks may want to make the argument that a long commute is a road trip. I tend to disagree if you could reasonably arrange for facilities to charge on a regular/daily basis. If you can do that, and instead are using superchargers just to avoid paying electrical costs even if it's several hundred dollars, (after all, cost of commute is part of considering a job), then my opinion is that you using the system in a way that Tesla was not really intending.

As an example: hotels provide free ice for guests. In several situations I'm aware of where our large organization was arranging for a convention, it became obvious that some guests were using the ice machines to fill their coolers for the activity the next day. It only took a small percentage of folks abusing that resource to cause problems for the vast majority of the rest of the folks.

Was that usage expressly prohibited? No. Was it a problem to do as it wasn't in line with what was intended? Yes.

And therein lies the rub: The usage of superchargers other than for what's intended will not scale well.

Most people probably take road trips every few months on average. If it's every 50 days on average, Tesla needs to accommodate 2% of Model S users concurrently, spread out over the common travel hours of a given day. If instead just 5% of folks supercharge every day, and likely during commute hours, then the load at those times could easy be 10x what Tesla has planned for. If you keep biting the hand that feeds you, sooner or later you are going to regret it.

So, I'm under no delusions that people will go to whatever means to save a buck, but I think it's unfortunate. And although it has to do with HPWC charging at a Tesla Gallery location no longer being offered, I find one of the factors leading to that decision telling, according to Lump: "I was told some locals were abusing the privledge & leaving their cars there all day long so they were forced to close it off to all".

I fear similar will happen with supercharging over time if folks abuse the system.

 

[Aussie]

After buying a 100k car you rather spend a few hours of your free time waiting on charging than paying 25$ for the night charge?
Not me, I value my free time higher than 25$.

A very valid argument. So it comes down to how much one values ones time and also what you are doing while charging. If you are performing work which otherwise you would be doing anyway then things might make more sense compared to just waiting for grass to grow.

 

[Kraken]

No. You paid for the superchargesr. "Free for life". "Free to use it as much as you like". This money was paid , real money, to crowdfund the supercharger network, which includes the solar arrays for free sustainable energy. You paid for I it. You have the right to use it as much as you'd like for any purpose whatsoever, including free energy from the sun and to avoid charging at home since that power likely comes from a fossil fuel burning plant. Tesla's purpose is all about helping sustainable energy and travel. How are we going to achieve that if we continue to "fuel" the cars from coal burning power plants? If anything, Tesla would be encouraging this. It would seem contradictory otherwise.

Eh... I think you didn't read the rest of my post which I spent refuting my opening statement in a similar manner that you did.

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After buying a 100k car you rather spend a few hours of your free time waiting on charging than paying 25$ for the night charge?
Not me, I value my free time higher than 25$.

Not if they concurrently do something they normally need to do, like get dinner once a week or make a business call.

 

[Trnsl8r]

I would just like to add that it would be super-nice if the mobile app had a function to alert you when the charge was done (or better yet, close to done). It should help avoid drivers occupying spots without charging, which can happen at Gilroy and other shopping friendly locations.

 

[brianman]

This has to be at least the 4th thread on this exact subject.

 

[paco3791]

This has to be at least the 4th thread on this exact subject.

I'm sure your right, though I hadn't seen anything recently, though I've mainly been trolling the model S forum so I probably didn't see it if it was elsewhere. Nothing new under the sun, especially on a forum that's getting as big as this one.

 

[gg_got_a_tesla]

I'd argue that Supercharging as the primary or the predominant way of getting juice on a regular basis - and thus avoiding charging at home as much as possible - is fundamentally no different than using free charging options at your workplace, your friendly neighborhood grocery store, community center etc. I'd think that the Model S, being a big battery BEV, would rarely need to be plugged in at these non-home charging locations unless the driver's stopping by while on a roadtrip. All the same, I plugin at such locations all the time (hopefully not at the expense of a smaller-range EV who may have then missed out on that spot) as I see it as a perk that those businesses/facilities are offering to attract my patronage.

As long as one's respectful of waiting cars and move the car promptly once done charging (enough), I'd say go for it; it's part of Tesla's promise to you of free lifetime supercharger access. There's no absolute right or wrong here.

 

[KJD]

Supercharging every day sounds like a great way to wear out the battery pack in a hurry.

 

[AmpedRealtor]

Supercharging every day sounds like a great way to wear out the battery pack in a hurry.

Only if you max charge, otherwise you can charge to the typical 80% "standard" charge level and be fine. The rate at which the battery charges does not degrade the battery in any appreciable way.

 

[Ocelot]

I personally feel Tesla should institute limits going forward. To be fair I think they would have to grandfather in all the people who have reserved or bought a Tesla already with no limit supercharging. The reasoning lies with the scale of things we all hope to see in the next 5- 10 years. Hopefully Tesla's will be everywhere. Hopefully the model E is offered with supercharging capabilities even as an option.
One person said previously if they supercharge they will save 300 plus dollars a month! ...now if you scale up to include much more of the population, this all of a sudden is not the anomaly but the norm of all the people who are using the chargers. Meaning Tesla will be paying that ( I highly doubt solar is going to be 100% at all the superchargers). I do not feel that wouldbe beneficial for the long term sustainability of the company.

 

[qwk]

Only if you max charge, otherwise you can charge to the typical 80% "standard" charge level and be fine. The rate at which the battery charges does not degrade the battery in any appreciable way.

There is little doubt that supercharging is harder on the battery. The only question is how much?
At $40k+ per battery, that could potentially be one expensive experiment.

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Only if you max charge, otherwise you can charge to the typical 80% "standard" charge level and be fine. The rate at which the battery charges does not degrade the battery in any appreciable way.

There is little doubt that supercharging is harder on the battery. The only question is how much?
At $40k+ per battery, that could potentially be one expensive experiment.

 

[Chipper]

There is little doubt that supercharging is harder on the battery. The only question is how much?
At $40k+ per battery, that could potentially be one expensive experiment.

Care to provide some data supporting your claims? I would be particularly interested in your claim of $40K per battery. The last I heard the battery pack was not even half that much!

 

[rlcordeiro]

I told my wife "Honey I can charge my car for free at the Hawthorne SC" (20 mi away). She said "cheap B*****d".

 

[KJD]

I would be particularly interested in your claim of $40K per battery. The last I heard the battery pack was not even half that much!

This was written about on Green Car Reports by David Noland.
Life With Tesla Model S: Battery Upgrade From 60 kWh To 85 kWh

 

[scaesare]

I thought it interesting that in Post #43 of the "Supercharger Crowding?" thread, where it was discussing congestion at some locations with a large Telsa population nearby, it had this to say:

• Hawthorne had a back up on Friday from 1pm to 4pm. And typically has back ups at that time as well as Sunday morning and evening

...

• A few owners lived very close to the supercharger and were "topping off" at the busiest time

Now certainly that wasn't the only factor... but it was a contributing factor. One of the suggestions the poster made there:

• If you live close or use it often, try your best to not use it during peak times. Plan ahead so you don't need a charge at peak hours

This reinforces my opinion that using SC's instead of your home for your daily charging needs, especially as that will likely be during peak commute times for many, is not something that will scale well...

 

[paco3791]

Yeah I was just reading through that thread, thanks for linking to it!, hopefully Tesla will implement some type of notification system through the App. Should help limit some of the problems.

 

[spentan]

I'm going to be moving to usa and living at my uncle's place in Orange County.

Now the Supercharger being built in San Juan Capistrano, is 15-20mins walk from my gym (Anytime Fitness),

So whenever I need to, I can go start charging, go to the gym, and come back to a nicely charged Tesla without having to ask my uncle for access to his garage (and remove one of his cars, and use his power more than I need to).

Lets see how we go. There are the HPWCs at Mission Viejo store too, but I'd rather go to the gym, than loiter in the mall haha.

 

[gg_got_a_tesla]

spentan, 15-20 min walk each way would mean 30-40 min just to go back and forth not including the time spent at the gym. Parking your S at the Supercharger for an hour or more when it's most likely going to be done charging long before you get back wouldn't be cool IMO. SJC is going to be a busy supercharger site, so, please be considerate.