Tesla cuts 60kWh Model S, entry-level Model S is now 70D.

[ecarfan]

Anyone else think they will get rid of the 85d option and just have 70d and p85d?

I do not expect that to happen in the foreseeable future. No reason to force all buyers into AWD because it adds so much to the price. I don't understand why the 70 is not available in RWD as it would make the base model $5K cheaper. Some have opined that it is part of Tesla's long term plan to more clearly differentiate the Model S from the Model 3. Who knows...

 

[glhs272]

Probably just filled the rest of the 60kwh pack modules. Below is a pic of a 60kwh battery module(note the blank spots).

I think we are seeing the first appearance of new cells. These new cells were required for the Model X to achieve 200+ range with the base model. Like AWD we are seeing this appear on the Model S first. My guess is these new cells are still 18650 with new chemistry/tweaks to anode and cathode. If I am right, we will be seeing a 100kwh pack soon.

 

[yobigd20]

Anyone know how the obsidian black differs in look to the regular black? Is it a blacker black w/metallic flake?

probably metallic flakes. but you can save yourself the cost by getting regular black and then tailgating 18 wheelers and dump trucks in construction zones for a year. the result will look about the same

 

[Racerx22b]

I'm curious how many people actually use the frunk? I've yet to use it, although I've only had my P85D for 2 weeks.

I just used my frunk on a trip to Disney World. My Jura Impressa Z7 fits with no issue along with one piece of luggage. Stayed at the cabins and knowing the crap coffee provided in the cabin I figured why not bring it?

 

[AnOutsider]

Honestly I think the mods are shooting themselves in the foot by moving all threads about 70D from the Model S section to the News section. Yes, I know that's probably where they belong, but not the first place I would look, don't ask me why.

Well considering folks were creating threads in Tesla Motors, Model S and Model S Ordering, Production and Delivery, News seemed not only the logical place, but the most central. I don't think location is the issue. The search up top is universal, and common sense would dictate that you're probably not the first to talk about the old (by internet standards) item you just saw in your FB or Twitter feed, so perhaps you should double check the forum before creating a new topic.

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I found it somewhat surprising that there was no TWEET by EM and very little fanfare from TM regarding the announcement.

True, but the official account did tweet it:

Tesla Motors on Twitter:

Maybe Elon is on social timeout :tongue:

 

[mhpr262]

Honestly I think the mods are shooting themselves in the foot by moving all threads about 70D from the Model S section to the News section.

I'd leave one thread with 70D in the title, with one post saying "thread going on in "News", then close the thread. That way anybody searching in the Model S forum first (I did too) would know where to go.

 

[yobigd20]

The British design studio doesn't have any of that malarkey.

View attachment 77307

Well that is interesting! I wonder why the difference between the two countries?

probably because it's illegal.

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Anyone else think they will get rid of the 85d option and just have 70d and p85d?

no, i actually expect them to get rid of the S85 and just have the S70D, S85D, and P85D

 

[dirkhh]

I still just want an S 60 with supercharging and old tech package. Hopefully those will go for cheap soon.

I sold one six weeks ago
And I'm guessing that Paul Carter will have one for sale, soon...

 

[brkaus]

The 70 does make the 85 a bit less appealing to me. $10k is a good chunk of change for 30 more miles of range.

My most common long distance drive is 220 miles flat with a supercharger mid way. And that is infrequent typically no more than 50 miles a day.

This may also put a rough price on a S100D

 

[bonaire]

I think we are seeing the first appearance of new cells. These new cells were required for the Model X to achieve 200+ range with the base model. Like AWD we are seeing this appear on the Model S first. My guess is these new cells are still 18650 with new chemistry/tweaks to anode and cathode. If I am right, we will be seeing a 100kwh pack soon.

I don't see a reason to use new cells for the 70D - just use the 60 layout and add another brick or re-arrange the cells so you get the same voltage as the 85 with a few cells less per brick. It is just a better configuration of battery size and product features. Cheaper than an 85D and since 60s were not selling "that well", a far better entry model. But I think also we see 85D buyers choosing "down" to 70D in order to save the difference in cash and also because they don't need the range "realistically". How many miles do people drive daily anyway?

 

[bp1000]

p85d is now £1820/$2700 cheaper in my spec.

Do Tesla reduce your final buying price if your car is still on order?

The only difference is i specced rear next gen seats. Do they know this on my order form? I would be pretty upset if my car came with normal leather rear seats when i paid a premium.

 

[googlepeakoil]

probably because it's illegal.

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no, i actually expect them to get rid of the S85 and just have the S70D, S85D, and P85D

Very, very unlikely.
The S85 is their best selling product! So economies of scale built in.
The base of the X is likely to become a X70D as others have posted (no S60).
As Musk has kept to "no change to the Model S for a year" expect that there will be an X100, and in 9 months (3 + 9 = 1 year) there'll be an S100D... maybe still an S85... but maybe not. In a year I expect S70D, S85, S85D, P100D

 

[eloder]

The frunk still exists in the non-AWD S85. Not many S60 orders were out there so the impact of losing part of the frunk on that one model is, in my opinion, fairly minimal.

I imagine Tesla will heavily push AWD in general because it's a much better drive experience, important in northern climates, AND gives more efficiency and acceleration on top, but I very much doubt the Model 3 would go completely without an AWD model. Putting AWD on the lowest-cost model is, in my opinion, very important because AWD EV is so much more advanced than the commuter cars most people are used to.

 

[googlepeakoil]

But the amount of space in the Frunk that is lost is minimal as I understand it. Maybe a cubic foot or so ....

I'd say it's about 3 cubic feet. It's the microwave space (1.5cuft) + a bit from the angle too (another 1.5cuft). Compare the photos posted elsewhere here.
It makes me seriously consider getting the S85 instead of the 70D... Wish they did a plain S70 - I'd much prefer that - but think the S70D is the base of the X70D. Same production line... they mentioned 2 production lines.
I think #1 = S85 (single motor)
#2 = all dual motor configs
If you think about it there's a lot of structural changes between single and dual motor

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Fair enough. News to me. Thanks for the pics.

As the 85D has a smaller front motor than the P85D I wonder if they could have made the frunk a bit different Take a look at the schematic on the order page... probably only about 4 inches different in motor / inverter diamater... but possibly significant if wanting to fit a buggy / spare?

 

[chriSharek]

Anyone else think they will get rid of the 85d option and just have 70d and p85d?

Never. If anything they will drop the standard 85. It looks like they are moving towards an all wheel drive line up.

 

[glhs272]

I don't see a reason to use new cells for the 70D - just use the 60 layout and add another brick or re-arrange the cells so you get the same voltage as the 85 with a few cells less per brick. It is just a better configuration of battery size and product features. Cheaper than an 85D and since 60s were not selling "that well", a far better entry model. But I think also we see 85D buyers choosing "down" to 70D in order to save the difference in cash and also because they don't need the range "realistically". How many miles do people drive daily anyway?

You might be right that the 70 is just a 60 pack with 2 extra modules, thus operating at the same voltage as the 85 (which would be a big boost to performance and supercharging speed). I just view it through the lens of what's coming for the Model X and the fact that the original Model S cell is now about 3 years old. I think it is getting a bit stale.

Perhaps there could be future upgrade paths for current 60 owners where they just add 2 more modules to the existing battery.

 

[dhanson865]

Comparison of specs for the leaving S60 vs the new lineup sorted by Price:

S60_ 208 miles range 5.9 sec 0-60 120 mph

S70D 240 miles range 5.2 sec 0-60 140 mph
S85_ 265 miles range 5.4 sec 0-60 140 mph
S85D 270 miles range 4.4 sec 0-60 155 mph (king of range with no loss of top speed)
P85D 253 miles range 3.1 sec 0-60 155 mph (king of acceleration with significant loss of range)


now sorted by range:

S60_ 208 miles range 5.9 sec 0-60 120 mph

S70D 240 miles range 5.2 sec 0-60 140 mph
P85D 253 miles range 3.1 sec 0-60 155 mph (king of acceleration with significant loss of range)
S85_ 265 miles range 5.4 sec 0-60 140 mph
S85D 270 miles range 4.4 sec 0-60 155 mph (king of range with no loss of top speed)


now sorted by 0-60 / top speed:

S60_ 208 miles range 5.9 sec 0-60 120 mph

S85_ 265 miles range 5.4 sec 0-60 140 mph
S70D 240 miles range 5.2 sec 0-60 140 mph
S85D 270 miles range 4.4 sec 0-60 155 mph (king of range with no loss of top speed)
P85D 253 miles range 3.1 sec 0-60 155 mph (king of acceleration with significant loss of range)

use your imagination if you have a P85 or P85+

I love the new ocean blue option. I like the D on the 70 and it's cool to see 70 is greater than 60.

 

[googlepeakoil]

Never. If anything they will drop the standard 85. It looks like they are moving towards an all wheel drive line up.

Totally incorrect - the S85 is their best selling model - would Musk kill the golden goose!!! I was really worried they had for a minute - until I saw you could click on single motor.
Most people are fine with rear wheel drive. Tesla originally went out of their way to prove the handling (even on ice / frozen lake) of the rear wheel drive S85. Obviously the D is better for ice / acceleration. But the 0-60 times for the 70D and 85 are similar.
I'd prefer an 85 over a 70D as you can go further / will be cycling the battery less / have more comfort in range on distance between superchargers. Not as much in it though as the 60 -> 85.

 

[chriSharek]

What about in climates like mine, Florida? Why do I need all wheel drive? I'm still looking at the standard 85 with rear wheel drive that maximizes my storage in the frunk. And what about the rear wheel drive purists?

Don't get me wrong I love the blue and I love the larger range of the 70 D.

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Googlepeakoil, I agree with you completely! Getting an all wheel drive car in Florida doesn't make any sense to me. but I could also see then going with an all wheel drive line up entirely.

 

[googlepeakoil]

Comparison of specs for the leaving S60 vs the new lineup sorted by Price:

_S60 208 miles range 5.9 sec 0-60 120 mph

S70D 240 miles range 5.2 sec 0-60 140 mph
_S85 265 miles range 5.4 sec 0-60 140 mph
S85D 270 miles range 5.2 sec 0-60 155 mph (king of range with no loss of top speed)
P85D 253 miles range 3.1 sec 0-60 155 mph (king of acceleration with significant loss of range)


now sorted by range:

_S60 208 miles range 5.9 sec 0-60 120 mph

S70D 240 miles range 5.2 sec 0-60 140 mph
P85D 253 miles range 3.1 sec 0-60 155 mph (king of acceleration with significant loss of range)
_S85 265 miles range 5.4 sec 0-60 140 mph
S85D 270 miles range 5.2 sec 0-60 155 mph (king of range with no loss of top speed)


now sorted by 0-60 / top speed:

_S60 208 miles range 5.9 sec 0-60 120 mph

_S85 265 miles range 5.4 sec 0-60 140 mph
S70D 240 miles range 5.2 sec 0-60 140 mph
S85D 270 miles range 5.2 sec 0-60 155 mph (king of range with no loss of top speed)
P85D 253 miles range 3.1 sec 0-60 155 mph (king of acceleration with significant loss of range)

use your imagination if you have a P85 or P85+

The P85D range is further - the EPA range is less because of taking the standard option of a 90% range charge - not the old method of 100% range charge.
Still the "watt per mile" appears worse on the D models (based on people's posts) - despite Musk's bravado about increasing range despite the weight increase.

I wonder which is lighter S85 (more batteries one motor)
70D - less batteries, 2 motors, 2 inverters, extra components (liquid cooling lines) extra aluminium to support all of that.
I suspect the S85 is still lighter.