Tesla insurance safety score

[Jefff L]

I have an issue with forward collision warning that causes my safety score to drop. Topic was in discussion back in 2022 (Safety score is trash) but seems not much anyone can do about it. I am hoping there may be people who knows how to address this (with Tesla insurance , or ...)

To begin with, I don't have FSD or EFSD. I was driving around my subdivision, following the car that is about 150ft in front of me with speed of 28mph, and the car in front reached and stopped at a stop sign, all the sudden my FCW kicked in - 28mph with 150+ ft of distance in front of me - I have a separated dashcam that captures all of this (GPS, speed, warning sound, etc.) No surprise, I found my safety score immediately drop by 1 point. 1 point may not be much this time, but how about it keeps happening?

I had FCW set to early - could it be the problem? how about if I just disable it? I really want to take advantage of this safety feature and not to disable it. Any one call Tesla insurance and have a good resolution?
Thanks for the input.

 

[RonAz]

Safety Score is not ready for prime time. Basically it translates what others do around you into something that you are doing. Except for FCW it keeps all incidents secret until you stop and check your score. "You did this wrong, but we are not going to tell you how or where".
Perhaps a dash cam save for every time you get a hit could help one learn how to live with Safety Score.

 

[MP3Mike]

I had FCW set to early - could it be the problem? how about if I just disable it?

Makes no difference. The safety score uses the medium setting, and you can't stop it from monitoring it. (You can turn the FCW off, but the safety score will still log them, you just won't get any warning.) Having it set to early gives you a chance to react before the SS would be impacted...

To begin with, I don't have FSD or EFSD. I was driving around my subdivision, following the car that is about 150ft in front of me with speed of 28mph, and the car in front reached and stopped at a stop sign, all the sudden my FCW kicked in - 28mph with 150+ ft of distance in front of me

The FCW takes your accelerator position into account, as well as speed difference and difference. So if you were still accelerating, even slightly, it would trigger.

Overall I think the FCWs are much better in the most recent FSD Beta firmware. (I don't know if the same improvements have been made in the production firmware.)

 

[Jefff L]

Thanks all for inputs. I wonder why I got myself into this shxthole. I will be looking for other insurance carrier.

 

[WyldRide]

The day after taking delivery I was parked in my driveway after dark when it was cooler putting on accessories with climate control on and listening to music. The car never moved an inch, but my safety score showed "late night driving". I did not drive anywhere in the Tesla that day.
3rd day owning a Tesla I was going to a shopping center and a car turned into my lane and put on the brakes to turn into a shopping center, causing a collision warning, even though it was not even close. My safety score plummeted to 79!
I am a retired police officer and drove for a living in all weather, conditions and even emergency status and have never had an accident - ever. Your rates cannot be defined by the actions of others. I will be changing insurance companies because I cannot let this define my insurance rates. Getting ahold of anyone from Tesla Insurance takes nearly an hour.. if you are lucky.

 

[DPowers]

I share everyone's misgivings. I have a commercial pilots license and thousands of hours. No moving accidents in 60+ years driving and flying for a living in sales. I drive with lots of margin around me, yet today had two FCW which in each case was inappropriate - lots of room around me, lots of stopping margin approaching stopped vehicles.

Most inappropriate is that they charge our insurance based on beta software, but allow no feedback to call out real erroneous incidents.

I keep hoping for improvements with each version, but my consistent score of 100 has dropped with their updates. Especially inappropriate, getting nicked for night driving to put the car in the garage.

I take notes on each trip - if I pull into the garage at 9:55, put the car in park, and then sit writing until 10:05, it logs nighttime driving.

 

[DPowers]

Why isn't my driving time on autopilot considered in my score? I have to drive and manage the autopilot. It's more working than driving myself. My hours and hours behind the wheel, even when on autopilot, should carry some weight in my safety score.

 

[DPowers]

Is there any driver assist for Unsafe Following? Nothing I've seen in 38,000+ miles. Why not? This thing is a rolling computer, and Tesla feels like its computer is the final judge on my driving. If they're really on a mission to make us safer, and really believe we're all following too close, why not provide a tool to help us improve our bad habits?

And then why does the autopilot follow so closely? I would think they would demonstrate exemplary driving, or at least give us some option to adjust the following distance.

 

[MP3Mike]

And then why does the autopilot follow so closely? I would think they would demonstrate exemplary driving, or at least give us some option to adjust the following distance.

Autopilot does have the option for you to set the following "distance" between 2 and 7. (Older radar based cars also have the option for setting it to 1.)

I normally set it to 5 or 6, as I didn't like how close it followed when set below that.

 

[WyldRide]

Is there any driver assist for Unsafe Following? Nothing I've seen in 38,000+ miles. Why not? This thing is a rolling computer, and Tesla feels like its computer is the final judge on my driving. If they're really on a mission to make us safer, and really believe we're all following too close, why not provide a tool to help us improve our bad habits?

And then why does the autopilot follow so closely? I would think they would demonstrate exemplary driving, or at least give us some option to adjust the following distance.

You made a lot of great points and I totally agree. Moving your car into the garage should be a plus since you are putting the car somewhere safe. They vagueness of when and where an event occurred is bad enough, but not allowing comment or a review process is just lunacy. No wonder they want to push binding arbitration - eventually they will be held accountable. I sent in a letter rejecting arbitration just in case.

 

[DPowers]

Autopilot does have the option for you to set the following "distance" between 2 and 7. (Older radar based cars also have the option for setting it to 1.)

I normally set it to 5 or 6, as I didn't like how close it followed when set below that.

Agree. Set on 7 is close enough for me.

 

[Edmax]

A few days ago I was waiting in a left turn lane, about 2 car lengths behind the car in front of me, and the collision warning beeper went off -
twice - for no good reason. Hey! I was stopped! I've mostly gotten 100 safety ratings, but it was 73 for that day, when it should have been. There has been at least one other strange collision warning. BTW I've worked as an actuary, and also as a statistician. I've written about health insurance, and I've also analyzed bank failure risk. Also have plenty of neural network pattern recognition experience. If the guys who do Tesla insurance are on the level, IMO they don't know what they are doing. Possibly pure neural networks with no context awareness, and poorly defined "features" (variables). It also appears that recent changes in the scoring procedures only made it worse.

 

[DPowers]

A few days ago I was waiting in a left turn lane, about 2 car lengths behind the car in front of me, and the collision warning beeper went off -
twice - for no good reason. Hey! I was stopped! I've mostly gotten 100 safety ratings, but it was 73 for that day, when it should have been. There has been at least one other strange collision warning. BTW I've worked as an actuary, and also as a statistician. I've written about health insurance, and I've also analyzed bank failure risk. Also have plenty of neural network pattern recognition experience. If the guys who do Tesla insurance are on the level, IMO they don't know what they are doing. Possibly pure neural networks with no context awareness, and poorly defined "features" (variables). It also appears that recent changes in the scoring procedures only made it worse.

I’ve had similar instances. Really frustrating

Overall, the scoring isn’t terrible and the rates are pretty good, but for someone who is always careful with a clean record over 50+ years, it’s frustrating. Especially that the same system as autopilot is scoring me and it has yet to prove its own overall reliability. And don’t get me started that my hours as copilot correcting autopilot errors doesn’t weigh positively into my score.

I won’t say that they don’t know what they’re doing, since they’re in uncharted territory, but some of the details seem very unfair.

 

[JeffR]

I have had my Safety Score for the day’s drive plummet on several occasions for odd reasons. Most issues involve forward collision warnings under the following scenarios.

1. When approaching a vehicle that is parked at the side of a neighborhood street that gently curves to the left. This has also occurred when pedestrians have been walking on a right-hand sidewalk where the street gently curves to the left.

2. When following another vehicle that is making a right-hand turn onto a side street.

None of the above scenarios have required any slow-down or other intervention on my part. I have my 22 MS forward collision warning system set to Early. I’m a conservative driver with no accidents or tickets for over 40 years. My Safety Score is typically in the upper 90's.

It seems the algorithm for determining realistic forward collision warning situations isn’t quite ready for prime time.

While I’m venting, another Safety Score frustration relates to Hard Breaking. I live in a hilly area of San Diego, CA. When a traffic light changes while traveling downhill, the weight of the vehicle often requires some manual breaking in addition to normal regen breaking in order to keep from rolling into an intersection. This manual breaking usually results in a lowering of my Safety Score.

Tesla previously indicated they would adjust the Hard Breaking score algorithm for changing stop lights, but this doesn’t seem to work most of the time. I’m guessing adding consideration of a road’s slope into the Hard Breaking algorithm would be a modest undertaking for Tesla to resolve this issue.

With all that said, I like monitoring the Safety Score as a way to measure my personal driving habits. I'm looking forward to future improvements and enhancements.

 

[WyldRide]

I have had my Safety Score for the day’s drive plummet on several occasions for odd reasons. Most issues involve forward collision warnings under the following scenarios.

1. When approaching a vehicle that is parked at the side of a neighborhood street that gently curves to the left. This has also occurred when pedestrians have been walking on a right-hand sidewalk where the street gently curves to the left.

2. When following another vehicle that is making a right-hand turn onto a side street.

None of the above scenarios have required any slow-down or other intervention on my part. I have my 22 MS forward collision warning system set to Early. I’m a conservative driver with no accidents or tickets for over 40 years. My Safety Score is typically in the upper 90's.

It seems the algorithm for determining realistic forward collision warning situations isn’t quite ready for prime time.

While I’m venting, another Safety Score frustration relates to Hard Breaking. I live in a hilly area of San Diego, CA. When a traffic light changes while traveling downhill, the weight of the vehicle often requires some manual breaking in addition to normal regen breaking in order to keep from rolling into an intersection. This manual breaking usually results in a lowering of my Safety Score.

Tesla previously indicated they would adjust the Hard Breaking score algorithm for changing stop lights, but this doesn’t seem to work most of the time. I’m guessing adding consideration of a road’s slope into the Hard Breaking algorithm would be a modest undertaking for Tesla to resolve this issue.

With all that said, I like monitoring the Safety Score as a way to measure my personal driving habits. I'm looking forward to future improvements and enhancements.

While Autosteering Autopilot was engaged, my Safety Score recorded an "Aggressive Turning" and later "Hard Braking" as I was stopping to put the car in Park in the 3 minute "trip" to change parking spaces. I took snapshots.. it is totally ridiculous!

 

[JeffR]

While Autosteering Autopilot was engaged, my Safety Score recorded an "Aggressive Turning" and later "Hard Braking" as I was stopping to put the car in Park in the 3 minute "trip" to change parking spaces. I took snapshots.. it is totally ridiculous!

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Apparently you don't have to use the break peddle very much to get "dinged" for hard breaking. Hopefully well see some noticeable improvement in Safety Score reporting as Tesla Insurance expands into more states and the safety score becomes more impactful on one's insurance premiums. Unfortunately, CA is not yet using the safety score as an insurance premium factor.

 

[Ytoelectric]

Glad to hear I am not the only one! I have had completely erroneous safety score data logged also, I generally move my car from the house to the separate garage on the other side of the property around 8PM to charge around 9pm, and I have been told by Tesla Insurance that I am "Late night driving".

The algorithm is so wacky, it has logged some of these events as happening after 10pm, when the car has been parked (over 1 hr), off and charging about an hour after that. I will drive a bit spiritedly on the way to work in the mornings, as I have a long commute, but I will see no dings for driving over the speed limit, but plenty of false FCW, one day, it showed "FCW 39%" when I know for a fact I only received a couple FCW's that were completely bogus (driving down a deserted neighborhood street) and sometimes when driving on a windy road.

What saddens me is that I test drove a few different Tesla's (MY and M3) that had FSD, and they handled numerous windy roads with no issues, no intervention necessary, even with these roads also being significantly steep, yet now that I have my own M3 RWD, the AP cannot handle much more of the windy roads than my 2020 Kona Electric. I was amazed that the safety score dropping from 90 down to 83 DOUBLED my projected future premium, that said, I am 50 yrs old, no tickets or accidents in over 25 yrs, but after the 2 months of "score 90" premiums, I will likely go to USAA.

 

[JeffR]

Glad to hear I am not the only one! I have had completely erroneous safety score data logged also, I generally move my car from the house to the separate garage on the other side of the property around 8PM to charge around 9pm, and I have been told by Tesla Insurance that I am "Late night driving".

The algorithm is so wacky, it has logged some of these events as happening after 10pm, when the car has been parked (over 1 hr), off and charging about an hour after that. I will drive a bit spiritedly on the way to work in the mornings, as I have a long commute, but I will see no dings for driving over the speed limit, but plenty of false FCW, one day, it showed "FCW 39%" when I know for a fact I only received a couple FCW's that were completely bogus (driving down a deserted neighborhood street) and sometimes when driving on a windy road.

What saddens me is that I test drove a few different Tesla's (MY and M3) that had FSD, and they handled numerous windy roads with no issues, no intervention necessary, even with these roads also being significantly steep, yet now that I have my own M3 RWD, the AP cannot handle much more of the windy roads than my 2020 Kona Electric. I was amazed that the safety score dropping from 90 down to 83 DOUBLED my projected future premium, that said, I am 50 yrs old, no tickets or accidents in over 25 yrs, but after the 2 months of "score 90" premiums, I will likely go to USAA.

It seems Tesla has listened to some of our concerns. I looked at my Safety Score yesterday and it has bumped up to 99 from 96 or 97 the day before. While I don't have specifics, it appears some of the "dings" I had received for supposed errant driving have been removed from my daily record. As best I can tell, faulty Forward Collision warnings that were several days away from expiring have been removed and the days they were recorded are blank. Sadly, I can't tell for sure since I can't accurately reconstruct the history. I'll keep monitoring it to see if I notice any verifiable changes. I hope you see some similar changes in your score.

 

[DC_Mike]

Forward collision warning is trash for me in the following scenario:

Two lane neighborhood roads with street parking on a long curve or incline.

Speed and pedal position doesn't matter. Everytime there's a car parked roadside... *alarm-FCW*. And this in on a street thats WIDE. Today, I was below the speed limit, neutral pedal position, and hugging the centerline due to a jogging trail that crosses through. Didn't matter.

Kinda tired of having my FCW score in the yellow or red every month.

I'll probably post the video later, to show exactly when it dinged me.

 

[ZenRockGarden]

Not sure if this hack was mentioned, but Safety Score ignores all time while using AP / FSD. This allows you to roll a lot of miles with perfect score... But yeah, with a little attention Tesla could make a great safety score system, which measures actual safety instead of what they've got which is some pretty arbitrary things with thresholds that often are more about the driver prudently avoiding problems than the driver doing unsafe things