And avoid fishtail, etc. I'd have gone off the road both last night and this morning had I still had summer tires on my Subaru. Nokian saves the day once again.
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Tesla ranks 2nd worst in Consumer reports reliability survey
- Thread starter stcptl
- Start date
I was rear-ended once because of studded snow tires. Moorhead Minnesota, winter, of course. I stopped on ice at a stop sign. The car behind me didn't have studs and didn't stop.
Circa 1980 in rural North Dakota my sister and my mother were visiting me. There was a dip in the snow-covered gravel road and 4 inches gradually became a foot. My CJ5 Jeep's momentum made it slide along on top of the snow far enough that my sister and I had to shovel for half an hour to get the wheels down to road, and make a path back out. 40-odd years later, she still remembers that visit. I never once got stuck in the snow in my next car, a 1989 Honda Civic.
sleepydoc
Well-Known Member
Based on where you live and your description, I would get them. I don't think you'll be sorry. MN doesn't even allow studs, so that's not a question I need to think about. If you have 44 years of experience then I'd go on that.
As far as clearance goes, the only thing you can do is get an aftermarket suspension system. the undercarriage of Tesla's is fairly smooth, so that helps a bit.
sleepydoc
Well-Known Member
We had a Ford Escort wagon for many years. It was small and anemic but it never failed to start and we never got stuck in it.
What I have also done is put snow tires on their own rims. It means recalibrating the TPMS each time you switch over, and I don't like driving to the Subaru dealer 100 miles away for that, and taking a day to do it. So I don't. So, separate rims (easier on tire bead, cost) or swap over tires every year?
We'll see how it goes with the clearance. Always have the Tacoma for deep snow, which gets plowed within 24 hours, on the days it happens. I'd probably avoid an aftermarket suspension on the Y.
We had a Ford Escort wagon for many years. It was small and anemic but it never failed to start and we never got stuck in it.
Yep. When you know that you can't go through deep snow you never get stuck. When you think you can go through deep snow, the snow will teach you otherwise.
Exactly! I have been reading CR for more than 50 years, and trust their reliability ratings. As you said, they are merely reporting what their readers tell them. At this point, it is reasonable to conclude that there are enough tesla owners among CR's readers that their periodic surveys obtain a statistically valid number of responses.
Years ago, I was a Mercedes owner. In the early years of my ownership, in the 1960s and 1970s, Mercedes Benzes consistently were among the most highly reliable cars in CR's data. American cars were generally much worse. As the Japanese manufacturers sold more and more cars here and as their cars became better, the CR data showed the rising reliability of those cars (and they have mostly stayed as very reliable brands). Various brands have risen and fallen over the years, and from what I can see, CR's findings are pretty well reflected by reputations -- Range Rover and Jeep are good examples, as mentioned above. CR even did an article a few months ago, pointing out that some of the least reliable brands had the most loyal following, with a high percentage of owners who say they would buy the same car again--Jeep and Tesla being the two specific examples.
One of the Tesla fans who does a podcast about Teslas, Rob Maurer, has done at least a couple of long interviews with the CR people about their reliability data, which I found to be quite informative. The CR people were quite forthcoming and generous with their time, openly discussing their methods and data, as I recall. Rob did find fault with CR on a couple of points about their methodology and criteria, so there is room for discussion about those (which would be true for anyone else's data as well, I imagine). The podcasts I heard were about two years ago, and I do not know if he has done anything on that subject recently.
I also agree with the statement above that cars built today are generally more reliable than cars were 50 years ago, so even a low reliability rating does not necessarily mean the car has a low availability for use. As an example, when I was first driving, cars would be much more likely to fail to start than they are today, mainly because of better batteries, better ignition systems, and fuel injection replacing carburetors. I can remember some car brands that were infamous for failing to start if it was raining -- you do not often hear about that sort of problem today. Tires are better, too.
Do any of you wave when you pass another Tesla ? I do, it’s because we are tribal. And we are now part of a tribe (you can probably guess who our leader is). So we, as insiders, can discuss things about Tesla, even criticize them and share tales of woe. But heaven help an outsider who criticizes ! Protecting the brand is when we are at our tribal best.
The people who drive Hyundais are exactly the same
The people who drive Hyundais are exactly the same
When CR went out of their way to show exactly how to defeat the AP driver monitoring system along with a video, that seemed a bit excessive.
Considering how hard it is to believe anything you hear from any source, and based on the sheer corruption in which the flow of information is controlled, it’s become increasing difficult to trust anything at all quite frankly.
With CR, JDP, “studies” Forums….trust but verify and be open to the good and bad while being able to separate fact from anecdotal.
I believe that as Tesla matures and competition increases, tribalism won’t shield the brand from constructive custom criticism, which will improve the product.
With CR, JDP, “studies” Forums….trust but verify and be open to the good and bad while being able to separate fact from anecdotal.
I believe that as Tesla matures and competition increases, tribalism won’t shield the brand from constructive custom criticism, which will improve the product.
roblab
Active Member
Yep, I wave. I wave with 3 fingers at Model 3s, even. My question is, What was the part that was deemed "not reliable" by these drivers?? Does it not start? Won't turn? Headlights not work? Just calling it "unreliable" doesn't do it for me. I have owned four Teslas and I have found them JUST AS RELIABLE as my Toyotas, all of which never had any problems. Toyota had some recalls, so did Tesla. But that didn't make them "unreliable". Unreliable means you can't depend on them to get you down the road, and that has never ever happened to me, with Toyotas OR Teslas. And there's nothing tribal about that.
roblab
Active Member
Well, a long time ago there were only about a dozen Teslas on the road. Those of us who bought and drove them realized this was the future, that oil products had to fade into history in order to save our environment, and just by driving them we were part of a special club. Anyone (and there were precious few of us) driving a Tesla recognized a kindred spirit, smart, savvy, aware, and willing to do their part to save the world, if that were possible.
Nowadays, people drive Teslas because they're quick and gorgeous and fill up at home, but some of us still wave. If I'd known it was bothering folk, I'd have quit. I'll probably quit anyway.
I think that we must accept that "reliability" no longer means "Fix Or Repair Daily," or "Found On Road Dead," things that for the most part don't occur much anymore, Instead, the word has evolved into something else. Something that when said, means what the person saying it means, and it is up to us to figure that out.
It doesn't bother me in the least. I just don't see the point.
FWIW, I don't see us Tesla drivers as saving the world. I bought my first EV in 2006, a Zap Xebra, which was my daily driver for 4 years, until I traded up to the Tesla Roadster. I didn't get those cars to save the world. I got them because I hate the stink and the noise of gas engines. I also hate pumping gasoline and getting the stink on my hands. And now that I have solar, I love "fueling up" my car for free. Even back in Spokane, I liked that my electricity was carbon-free, as it came from hydro.
When I got my Roadster, Elon Musk was saying that his goal was to build an affordable EV and convert the entire car fleet to electric. Start with the hand-made high-end Roadster, because that's where a start-up company could compete in the car market, and to demonstrate that an EV need not be a golf cart, and move gradually to less-expensive, high-volume cars. Tesla seems to have given up on that, as well as the promise of a $35K base price for the Model 3 (still out of reach for most families) and settled on building expensive luxury cars.
I love my Model 3. Best car on the road. But the world will not be saved with $45K cars. Tesla has firmly established itself as a luxury car maker. If we wave at each other, we're not waving at Earth-savers. We're waving at people like ourselves who can afford to pay $45 and up for a car.
Back on topic: Those who say CR is wrong because "I've never had a problem with my Tesla" need to understand that anecdote is not evidence; that one car, or four cars, being problem-free says nothing about the reliability of the brand or the model.
I think it’s more of the “severity” of issues vs number of issues. It seems the media like to make it “sound” like Tesla has all these major issues when in reality they are minor. The term “reliable” I think is misleading. It should simply be number of issues. If they were major issues I think Tesla customer satisfaction would be much lower.
But it is annoying that Tesla does have several minor issues that should be caught prior to customer delivery. I guess that’s a benefit of cars sitting on dealer lots for a few weeks and seen by several potential customers prior to purchase. More motive to fix an issue if a person is trying to sell a car vs a car that’s already sold.
Kinda funny. On front page of yahoo it shows the top 10 least reliable brands and Tesla was number 2 while Lincoln was number one (worst). I’ll let you guess what image they showed on the headline.
Blue Stuff
Member
When it was all over the news and many were asking if it was possible they tried it and answered the question. They also suggested a simple way to fix it (inside camera). That was not excessive. That was responsible research and reporting.
Report on it, sure. But can accomplish the same thing without a “how to” video. All they would need to say is that the driver monitoring is too easily defeated for our recommendation.
Is it “responsible reporting” if the media does a step by step on how to make a dangerous explosive with simple and easily accessible items? No.
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