Welcome to Tesla Motors Club
Discuss Tesla's Model S, Model 3, Model X, Model Y, Cybertruck, Roadster and More.
Register

Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

This site may earn commission on affiliate links.
Currently 25K model does not make sense as battery capacity and cost are the limiting factors, but in a few years, the lower cost model will make sense.
On that 25K model, (not a new theory, and inflation aside) there's still a small part of me that says as the margins continue to improve on the Model 3, they can just lower the price to $25K and compete with leases and insurance products for that new broader market. A single vehicle improves margins more long-term from scaling up 1 vs 2 designs. However, I'm aware that China is creating a new vehicle. What if it's tiny?

So would everyone switch to tiny cars if that happened? Not to knock tiny cars as I used to love driving my MGB (when the Lucas wiring behaved), but not in the US, not yet. For example, Model Y SR RWD in China - HOT.... in the US, NOT. Maybe it should is besides the point, I don't see consumers taking on that flavor unless forced by the economy or laws. Remember, battery prices are STILL dropping. By the time Tesla catches up with existing demand, it will not require nearly today's margins to sustain a single vehicle approach - especially because of volume. McDonalds didn't really create a new burger, but the low price brought the traffic, and then they just made money on leasing the land. That's where the Tesla software goodies come in strong $$$ with value. (I expect some disagrees, please present your thoughts as well).
 
  • Like
Reactions: navguy12 and MC3OZ
Let me just put forth that there may be a logical reason for such a choice. Perhaps hair touching his ears is distracting to him or uncomfortable. Maybe it makes wearing a mask easier/more comfortable. I also note that his baby’s momma can be quite flamboyant with her hairstyles, so perhaps the idea came from her.

I appreciate the way Elon had responded to the not so nice intentions of some to make fun of him, that’s part of what makes him a special individual.
I think it's to help cool the massive supercomputer contained in his cranium
 
Of course we dont and that is what I have been saying. We cant expect Tesla demand to stay where it is in 2021/2022 with $60K cars. If we did then Tesla would have no need to produce a $25K car. This is the exact same reason I am saying that the EV tax credit is important. The demand constraint now is caused by production constraints. For manufacturers other then Tesla the tax credit provides some cushion to produce cars in mass and make a profit.

The Tesla investor in me says screw them. The person who wants my children and grandchildren to not be in a world devastated by climate change says provide subsidies for EVs to kill ICE vehicles ASAP.

My point is we need the EV incentives to cause manufacturers other then Tesla to more rapidly move from ICE to EV. Tesla will benefit as well, although Tesla doesnt need the incentive to dominate. Yet if it makes it easier for Tesla to say introduce the $25K EV earlier at say $30K and still have a healthy margin then that is an added bonus.
You should embrace the screw them perspective. They’ve had every opportunity and 10 years to get with the program. A government incentive didn’t work then, it won’t work today or tomorrow.

People keep saying Tesla can’t do it alone, and they aren’t. The others who will help are the Chinese. Tesla with the Chinese can and will do it on their own. Did you not just hear Elon state that China’s GDP was going to be 2/3xs greater than the US? You think he’s blowing smoke?
 
of course. plenty of dumb money yet, as we progress through the adoption curve.

legacy is selling their stock (on CNBS, etc) to support their lack of product.

however, neither of them are compelling at this point, to those that know. unfortunately there are a majority who do not.
It's was comical man. He, the CEO was saying how by 2025 that Stellantis would be almost 100% EV. And yet as of Q4 2021, they have zero EV vehicles.
 
Which is a pipe dream that will never come true. Could you imagine the Democrats pushing through a bill ending oil subsidies and the resulting mass increase in gasoline prices. Would be a bloodbath in government like you have never seen and the GQP would immediately turn around and put them back in place and be hailed as the saviors to intend saviors.

Cant let the perfect be the enemy of the good.
Ye of little faith. The day will come. Not in the manner you describe, but it’s coming.
 
You should embrace the screw them perspective. They’ve had every opportunity and 10 years to get with the program. A government incentive didn’t work then, it won’t work today or tomorrow.

People keep saying Tesla can’t do it alone, and they aren’t. The others who will help are the Chinese. Tesla with the Chinese can and will do it on their own. Did you not just hear Elon state that China’s GDP was going to be 2/3xs greater than the US? You think he’s blowing smoke?

The climate of the planet is bad enough already, not willing to gamble it further. Would rather overcorrect.

I also get annoyed by the analogies of debt and deficit with companies profits and peoples home finances. Governments aren't supposed to be profitable. Business often start off with years of losses (ahem Tesla). People have massive debts even people with good net worth. My wife and I have a deficit of about $1.5 million in 2021 and our debt went up to $2M, yet somehow our Net Worth increased by $3 million. How could that be?
 
Ye of little faith. The day will come. Not in the manner you describe, but it’s coming.
It will come when the petroleum industry will be dead and buried. Likely the subsidies will still be in laws, they just wont be used.


I am done with this topic of discussion. Going to have lunch and then go have something done that seemingly is an easier thing. Go get a wisdom tooth pulled.
 

New ETF from ARK starts trading tomorrow. Tesla is a top holding. So we can look for more inflows if people invest here.
FYI TSLA is the 4th largest holding.

Screenshot_20211207-133925_Adobe Acrobat.jpg
 
She did a great job from my perspective. I am a Tesla Fan.
In my opinion she missed some follow-ups that could of forced Elon to give more serious deliberative answers.
  1. Although SpaceX and Tesla are doing fine now. Govt seed funding/loans made a big difference in the early years. Isn't this worth continuing?
  2. More important than the taxes Elon pays is the large gap in incentives he gets vs the rest of the company. I am sure SpaceX/Tesla would be nowhere without their super smart workforce.
  3. Wealthy and powerful people have an oversized ability to coerce the market relative to people lower on the totem pole. How would he rectify this inequality without Govt?
 
You're missing Elon's point. The EV subsidies are a counter to the current and long standing oil subsidies. He said they all should be stopped. Tesla doesn't need the subsidy and they haven't had any for two years going.

Today I wrote the White House and those who represent me in Congress regarding EV & oil subsidies.
 
Last edited: