Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

[wipster]

To me, its beginning to sound like a broken record for X country requiring Y products/services from Tesla for Z climate change related disaster. It's almost like they're going to have to prioritize based on disaster if this continues.

You're right, it is like a broken record until someone picks up the tonearm and puts on some new music that doesn't skip. Until vulnerable places like Puerto Rico change not only how their power is produced but also distributed, it's never going to change. That's why the Boring Company's utility tunnels make so much sense in these places, not only for power, but water, sewer, and whatever is subject to damage during weather catastrophies. An earthly conduit just makes sense, especially in the relatively smaller locales, and would probably pay for itself based on the repair costs they no longer have to pay.

 

[betstarship]

You're right, it is like a broken record until someone picks up the tonearm and puts on some new music that doesn't skip. Until vulnerable places like Puerto Rico change not only how their power is produced but also distributed, it's never going to change. That's why the Boring Company's utility tunnels make so much sense in these places, not only for power, but water, sewer, and whatever is subject to damage during weather catastrophes. An earthly conduit just makes sense, especially in the relatively smaller locales.

Outside of putting words into my post without actually being in the post...personally, I think it's a broken record because the actual evidence this is a huge problem is piling up...and there's a real latent value in various climate tech companies as investments. Every financial institution should be dumping enough money for companies like, or even just, Tesla to solve the problem before more disasters happen and lives are lost ASAP.

Though, for as big as the problem of climate change is, the various leaders in societies (economy + government) that can lead change don't seem to be changing things quick enough to...avert more disasters and save lives. Even though, Acts like the Inflation Reduction Act is a good step forward...is it enough?

This isn't like your everyday company we're used to that's creating products to invigorate new markets to improve the human condition in boom times. To me, board is shifting around, due to climate change, and making the entire economy + society pretty impossible to live good, productive lives without worry.

I just really wish climate change gets averted soon.

 

[printf42]

So he shorted more TSLA?

 

[betstarship]

View attachment 854103
So he shorted more TSLA?

He's donating his wealth to his foundation on a reoccurring basis until he is off the "richest persons" list. This already includes the $20B he donates from his personal wealth to his foundation in mid-July.

 

[wipster]

He's donating his wealth to his foundation on a reoccurring basis until he is off the "richest persons" list. This already includes the $20B he donates from his personal wealth to his foundation in mid-July.

I'm sure he'll have enough to get by...

 

[betstarship]

I'm sure he'll have enough to get by...

Uh, that's really not the point?

 

[AudubonB]

Mod: The discussion of manufacturing in China turned snarky and political very quickly. I thought about just deleting all the posts, but some of the replies were actually worth keeping, so I made another thread from them: China pro/con turned political

But I remind you all that political discussion is banned in this forum, as is snarky back-and-forth. I won't always put in the extra effort to make new threads, especially since I'm not really a moderator any more.

--ggr

Thank goodness for any Not-a-Mods and the grunt work they do.

——You-Know-Who

 

[OrthoSurg]

Just for fun, and to see the range of confidence of the stock here, what is everyone's best guess as to what the value of a 50K TSLA investment would be worth in 2035?

500k

 

[wipster]

Outside of putting words into my post without actually being in the post...personally, I think it's a broken record because the actual evidence this is a huge problem is piling up...and there's a real latent value in various climate tech companies as investments. Every financial institution should be dumping enough money for companies like, or even just, Tesla to solve the problem before more disasters happen and lives are lost ASAP.

Though, for as big as the problem of climate change is, the various leaders in societies (economy + government) that can lead change don't seem to be changing things quick enough to...avert more disasters and save lives. Even though, Acts like the Inflation Reduction Act is a good step forward...is it enough?

This isn't like your everyday company we're used to that's creating products to invigorate new markets to improve the human condition in boom times. To me, board is shifting around, due to climate change, and making the entire economy + society pretty. impossible to live good, productive lives without worry.

I just really wish climate change gets averted soon.

Agreed. The difficulty is though, the changing climate is the new reality and until countries and companies can find ways to mitigate it, it will continue to be a huge problem. Unless we find a way to not only stop adding to but actually reduce greenhouse gases in the atmosphere, it's just going to get more extreme. Even if we find ways to do that, it will take a century for things to start cooling off... by then the oceans will have risen, global temperatures will have increased, and climate refugees will be a real thing. It's a dystopian future and all we can do is to begin helping our grandchildren's children to survive.

Sorry for being so pessimistic. We'll only be around to see the start of all this but hopefully by investing in companies like Tesla, we can help them turn the tables in the future.

Edit:. Cooling, not cooking...

 

[wipster]

Uh, that's really not the point?

Sorry, I'm not a Gates fan. But good on him if his monies help improve lives around the planet.

 

[ZsoZso]

It's funny because this is a question every journalist ask and the answer is always "we will surpass Tesla". It's a baited question designed to remind people that Teslas valuation is too high because competition is coming. There are no CEO who still wants their job who will concede to Tesla, so the question will always be asked and the answer will always be YES no matter how moronic it sounds.

I was just pointing out how they literally spent a good amount of time telling you competition is not coming due to all these factors...but then say the competition is coming with one moronic question and answer.

You are right, the question will be asked, and the CEO will always answer affirmative that they will surpass Tesla.
The only variable that is important to pay attention is how many such CEOs can be interviewed ?
That number will start to dwindle soon as these lagacy carmakers start going bankrupt!

 

[Discoducky]

Since it's not yet during trading time:

What do you make of Karpathy's Tweet from back in March?:

This is the method by which they are connecting the non-real-time (vector) and real-time data (bag of points). Only a very few points at critical places are turned into vectors and that will expand to all points for single vector stack. Not sure if they are still approaching it the same way now, but it does appear they are working on how to do this more efficiently/effectively. So the measure will be how much new ground truth upcoming segment data they are able to take in (the results will be...for Chucks' turn at least, at first, more consistently doing the right thing) and granted that is a tough turn, but it needs to handle it at 99.9999% (so only fail once every 1,000,000 times) and if he does it 10 times it needs to be essentially perfect.

 

[MC3OZ]

Agreed. The difficulty is though, the changing climate is the new reality and until countries and companies can find ways to mitigate it, it will continue to be a huge problem. Unless we find a way to not only stop adding to but actually reduce greenhouse gases in the atmosphere, it's just going to get more extreme. Even if we find ways to do that, it will take a century for things to start cooking off... by then the oceans will have risen, global temperatures will have increased, and climate refugees will be a real thing. It's a dystopian future and all we can do is to begin helping our grandchildren's children to survive.

Sorry for being so pessimistic. We'll only be around to see the start of all this but hopefully by investing in companies like Tesla, we can help them turn the tables in the future.

IMO the good news is humans are definitely smart enough to develop the technologies to reduce greenhouse gas emissions and to deploy methods (probably plants and algae) to reduce atmospheric CO2 emissions. And humans are good at adapting.

To some extent energy and transport are already solved problems, and the more interesting R&D is in areas like food and construction,

But the bad news is, if humans were smart, we would have taken more action sooner, and we would not have a certain portion of the population hell bent on preventing any progress.

Food and construction will play out much like energy and transport, the new solutions will be more efficient and economic. But a big emotional decision for human centres around dairy. Logic and economics dictates that dairy should come from an industrial scale brewing process, rather than a cow. Emotionally humans might find it hard to accept that change, even when they are 2-3 steps removed from it.

Overall the problem is challenging rather than impossible. I have little doubt that humans have the collective brain power to develop the required solutions in time, less confidence that they will have the brain power to use them.

 

[betstarship]

Agreed. The difficulty is though, the changing climate is the new reality and until countries and companies can find ways to mitigate it, it will continue to be a huge problem. Unless we find a way to not only stop adding to but actually reduce greenhouse gases in the atmosphere, it's just going to get more extreme. Even if we find ways to do that, it will take a century for things to start cooling off... by then the oceans will have risen, global temperatures will have increased, and climate refugees will be a real thing. It's a dystopian future and all we can do is to begin helping our grandchildren's children to survive.

Sorry for being so pessimistic. We'll only be around to see the start of all this but hopefully by investing in companies like Tesla, we can help them turn the tables in the future.

Edit:. Cooling, not cooking...

@wipster - I'm a layperson (by no means an expert) when it comes to anything climate change related and most things. I just read a lot (especially learning from the people on this board) and give an opinion as well as some fandom that is, hopefully, productive and useful to this board, family, and friends. With that said, my education is in Internet Engineering, Business, and Startups. Huge Tesla fan!

Tesla isn't the only holding that's multiplied for me, but its the bigger winner obviously by being in the right place at the right time (much like most of the other investments). Hope all of this climate change gets averted!

Here's a good article I found on getting to net-zero and, hopefully, net-negative emissions:

Explainer: Will global warming ‘stop’ as soon as net-zero emissions are reached? - Carbon Brief

Warming is likely to more or less stop once net-zero emissions of carbon dioxide (CO2) is reached, meaning humans have the power to choose their climate future.

www.carbonbrief.org

 

[wipster]

<snip>
Overall the problem is challenging rather than impossible. I have little doubt that humans have the brain power to develop the required solutions in time, less confidence that they will have the brain power to use them.

Honestly, I don't think we're near the tipping point yet when huge amounts of methane will be released as the Russian and Alaskan tundra melts. But it will be interesting to see what solutions avail us when AI can start addressing these environmental challenges.

 

[wipster]

@wipster - I'm a layperson (by no means an expert) when it comes to anything climate change related and most things. I just read a lot (especially learning from the people on this board) and give an opinion as well as some fandom that is, hopefully, productive and useful to this board, family, and friends. With that said, my education is in Internet Engineering, Business, and Startups. Huge Tesla fan!

Tesla isn't the only holding that's multiplied for me, but its the bigger winner obviously by being in the right place at the right time (much like most of the other investments). Hope all of this climate change gets averted!

Here's a good article I found on getting to net-zero and, hopefully, net-negative emissions:

Explainer: Will global warming ‘stop’ as soon as net-zero emissions are reached? - Carbon Brief

Warming is likely to more or less stop once net-zero emissions of carbon dioxide (CO2) is reached, meaning humans have the power to choose their climate future.

www.carbonbrief.org

@betstarship Informative article; however, the human race is a long way from having net-zero-emissions, if we can even get there. As discussed above, just tackling emissions from cows is going to be a huge task. I sincerely hope that as climate change becomes more obvious, more countries, companies, and people stop looking strictly at profit and growth as the only measure of success and perhaps discover that finding a way to measure a company's contribution to reducing emissions could be a new way of determining their success.

BTW, Buddy Holly wrote a song about it, "That'll Be the Day."

 

[Drumheller]

500k

13 years until 10x? Why so bearish?

On climate change, it's already later than many realize. Methane pockets started rupturing out of permafrost years ago.

 

[Rammstein]

Just for fun, and to see the range of confidence of the stock here, what is everyone's best guess as to what the value of a 50K TSLA investment would be worth in 2035?

I’m guessing 1 million!

 

[MC3OZ]

@betstarship Informative article; however, the human race is a long way from having net-zero-emissions, if we can even get there. As discussed above, just tackling emissions from cows is going to be a huge task. I sincerely hope that as climate change becomes more obvious, more countries, companies, and people stop looking strictly at profit and growth as the only measure of success and perhaps discover that finding a way to measure a company's contribution to reducing emissions could be a new way of determining their success.

BTW, Buddy Holly wrote a song about it, "That'll Be the Day."

Efficiency is an ally, as is the human desire to do something meaningful, while making money,

Just look at the amount of energy storage, R&D going on worldwide.

Behaviour is similar to a goldrush, people are looking under every rock. Not just for the money, but also for the prestige/relevance, and the satisfaction of solving problems.

So when those looking under rocks find solutions, sometimes a solution will stand out as being more efficient and economical than the approach it replaces.

Easy to understand is the efficiency of an EV motor compared to a ICE engine, but in many cases similar level of efficiency gains also exist when the new solution is considerably better than the solution it seeks to replace.

Humans have not yet found the best and most efficient solution for anything. Lots of improvements for solar wind, batteries and electric motors are in the pipeline, and in some areas people, have only recently started looking under the rocks.

So the quality and efficiency of the very best solutions we can find, might help us.

 

[wipster]

Efficiency is an ally, as is the human desire to do something meaningful, while making money,

Just look at the amount of energy storage, and in particular battery, R&D going on worldwide.

Behaviour is similar to a goldrush, people are looking under every rock. Not just for the money, but also for the prestige/relevance, and the satisfaction of solving problems.

So when those looking under rocks find solutions, sometimes a solution will stand out as being more efficient and economical than the approach it replaces.

Easy to understand is the efficiency of an EV motor compared to a ICE engine, but in many cases similar level of efficiency gains also exist when the new solution is considerably better than the solution it seeks to replace.

Humans have not yet found the best and most efficient solution for anything. Lots of improvements for solar wind, batteries and electric motors are in the pipeline, and in some areas people, have only recently started looking under the rocks.

So the quality and efficiency of the very best solutions we can find, might help us.

Let's hope my friend, let's hope. At least I think our finances are in the right place!