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If Tesla comes even close to guidance, margins should be quite solid this quarter. Some back-of-a-napkin math:

They guided that ASPs would be similar or only slightly lower than Q2. So far there've been no big price cuts, so I presume we're on track. Q2 ASPs ($50k, no?) and pre-credit margins (~16%, no? This is all from memory) imply an average production cost of around $42k, which was big drop from Q1. For Q3, assume an ASP of $49k and an average production cost of $40k. That's margins of 18,4% pre-credit. Now add in credits revenue.

(ED: Fixed a math error above)
 
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If Tesla comes even close to guidance, margins should be awesome this quarter.

They guided that ASPs would be similar or only slightly lower than Q2. So far there've been no big price cuts, so I presume we're on track. Q2 ASPs ($50k, no?) and pre-credit margins (~16%, no? This is all from memory) imply an average production cost of around $42k, which was big drop from Q1. For Q3, assume an ASP of $49k and an average production cost of $40k. That's margins of 22,5%.... pre-credit. Now add in credits revenue.

It works out to such a huge margin improvement that part of me thinks that it's too good.

I don't know how ASP and margins don't tick up a bit this quarter with the number of P3- that are being sold.
 
If Tesla comes even close to guidance, margins should be quite solid this quarter. Some back-of-a-napkin math:

They guided that ASPs would be similar or only slightly lower than Q2. So far there've been no big price cuts, so I presume we're on track. Q2 ASPs ($50k, no?) and pre-credit margins (~16%, no? This is all from memory) imply an average production cost of around $42k, which was big drop from Q1. For Q3, assume an ASP of $49k and an average production cost of $40k. That's margins of 18,4% pre-credit. Now add in credits revenue.

(ED: Fixed a math error above)
There were price cuts this quarter. $1k on SR, $2k on AWD and $5k on Performance, if memory serves. Also, if his tilts the mix to more LR models, a side effect will be higher COGS.
 
So far there've been no big price cuts

There have been several big price cuts.

There were price cuts this quarter. $1k on SR, $2k on AWD and $5k on Performance, if memory serves. Also, if his tilts the mix to more LR models, a side effect will be higher COGS.

That's for the 3, but the S/X also had significant cuts this Q. The LR non-P X I bought in the middle of June is $6k cheaper than it was at that time.
 
There have been several big price cuts.



That's for the 3, but the S/X also had significant cuts this Q. The LR non-P X I bought in the middle of June is $6k cheaper than it was at that time.

The fact that there's no short range version veing sold this quarter more than makes up for that reduction in price for the LP and P versions when it comes to ASP and margin
 
We now have a year of Tesla Safety Reports.

My takeaway is don't drive during holidays or winter. Oh, and yeah, Teslas are much safer cars and autopilot is safer than me (at least on freeways).

Code:
MMiles/accident / Quarter                         Q3/18   Q4/18   Q1/19   Q2/19
Tesla w/ autopilot engaged                         3.34    2.91    2.87    3.27
Tesla w/ active safety but autopilot not engaged   1.92    1.58    1.76    2.19
Tesla w/out above (rest of fleet)                  2.02    1.25    1.26    1.41
NHTSA average                                      0.492   0.436   0.436u  0.498

"u" means NHTSA didn't update their data.
 
The fact that there's no short range version veing sold this quarter more than makes up for that reduction in price for the LP and P versions when it comes to ASP and margin

Sure, it'll be at least partially mitigated on the S/X due to the removal of the SR (partially vs 'more than' will depend on volume which we do not yet know). I was just correcting the statement that there have been no big price cuts--there have been.
 
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There is a class action lawsuit regarding Tesla’s battery range limitation implementation

https://www.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.cand.345967/gov.uscourts.cand.345967.1.0.pdf

Sudden Loss Of Range With 2019.16.x Software

tl;dr

Tesla restricted some cars’ range with software

Just had a read through. It will be an interesting test to see whether a court considers a software fix for a hardware issue sufficient for the warranty, or whether the software fix is at the detriment of the owners who are entitled to new battery packs...

Also an aside, charts with Y-axes that don't start at 0 are very misleading...

misleading_chart.png
 
This stock is practically impossible to day trader right now. Outperforms the macros yesterday......underperforming the macros today. Stable and gradual increase all day yesterday........big MMD attack today. Each time it looks like Tesla oupterms macros for a day or two and seems to be ready to break out comes a day where it greatly underperforms. o_O
Good thing this is the "Investor Roundtable" discussion, not the day traders forum.
 
Amazing to see TSLA trading level these days knowing where SP was only half a year ago.

Not really.

Let's take a step back. Most people think economics is the study of money but any economist who "gets it" will tell you it is almost entirely the study of human behavior. Because every financial transaction has a human buyer and a seller who agree upon a price. How they think and behave determines this price. A high growth stock like Tesla is inherently difficult to assign a present value and two fully informed and knowledgable people can assign it wildly different values on the same day simply by tweaking the timing of future growth milestones or the assumptions of how profitable those milestones will be. The price of TSLA shares is determined by the volume-weighted average of all the buyers and sellers at any given moment. Anyone and everyone with a share to sell or money in their account with which to buy gets a vote. Over time the perception of how much a company is worth changes. Very good news or very bad news can change the value immediately and dramatically. Lacking significant or unexpected news, the change in price is reluctant to change quickly in any dramatic fashion. Because if it was "worth" $x yesterday, it must be worth about $x dollars today. But over longer periods of time the value people assign to it can drift.

I thought Tesla was wildly over-valued when it was trading over $300 over two years ago given the cash challenges they faced. They had to execute perfectly to not need substantially more borrowing or dilution than anticipated. Now, with the Gigafactory on track and the excellence of the reliability and the design engineering of the Model 3 (and by inference the Model Y) demonstrated beyond a reasonable doubt, I think Tesla is solidly under-valued. But some reasonable and fully informed people will and do disagree. It is the balance of those who agree/disagree that determines the share price. It's really a number made up collectively by a bunch of people, most of whom have a rather sketchy idea of what they are betting on. There is no doubt that Tesla still faces many serious challenges. It is not easy to pull off the opening of a new factory. It is dependent upon the excellence of the production engineers. One person can only do so much. However, each year that passes Tesla shows an unnatural ability to be able to make difficult things seem natural. I think Tesla's products are not fully understood for just how excellent they are. They are not just a regular car that a bunch of engineers decided would be a bit better if they hooked it up to electric motors and threw some batteries under the floor. The excellence of the engineering is wildly under-appreciated.

A difficult to assess risk is just how far their adversaries are willing to go to try to stop or slow Tesla's progress. These cretins have proven beyond a reasonable doubt they are not willing to just sit on the sidelines and let things unfold, they will actually take an active role in trying to prevent or slow Tesla from accomplishing their goals. Some of these cretins are well-funded beyond many peoples wildest imagination. Fortunately, we have laws which, coupled with most individuals natural self-interests and capital preservation instincts, prevent the most blatant interference. However, some of them have unimaginably large financial self-interests that are threatened. Others just hate change or progress. When they think they can disrupt or slow Tesla's progress without personal risk, they join forums, spread FUD and even blatant lies, they go on TV, make fake YouTube videos, comment on news stories, fund efforts to hit the share price hard through "dirty trading" or portray the products as crappy and try to cost Tesla money or sales in any way they think they can get away with. There is little doubt this has changed public perception of Tesla (and obviously not for the better). This affects the price at which Tesla can sell their vehicles and it follows that this affects Tesla's financials. Independently of Tesla's financials, it also affects the intangible value people assign to Tesla shares. I would say this latter unquantifiable impact dwarfs whatever share price impact is directly attributable to the impact on Tesla's financials.

To me, it looks like Tesla is on a multi-month bull run caused primarily by good progress with G3 and the perception that Tesla, as a small company, has made it "over the hump" and into the big leagues. This kind of vague change of popular perception is very slow to play out which is why, short of negative news, I expect Tesla to continue to rise as progress with G3 continues. Also, many investors are like lemmings, they don't want to believe a story is a good story until they see the price climbing high. Conversely, when the price is falling, it's all doom and gloom. To many people, a rising price reflects well on the company as silly as that may sound. That is why share prices have "momentum" and is the reason for the age-old market expression "the trend is your friend". Idiotic herd mentality explains how the share price can rise so high, and how it can fall so low. It's not surprising in the slightest and it has little to do with the company's actual prospects.
 
We now have a year of Tesla Safety Reports.

My takeaway is don't drive during holidays or winter. Oh, and yeah, Teslas are much safer cars and autopilot is safer than me (at least on freeways).

Code:
MMiles/accident / Quarter                         Q3/18   Q4/18   Q1/19   Q2/19
Tesla w/ autopilot engaged                         3.34    2.91    2.87    3.27
Tesla w/ active safety but autopilot not engaged   1.92    1.58    1.76    2.19
Tesla w/out above (rest of fleet)                  2.02    1.25    1.26    1.41
NHTSA average                                      0.492   0.436   0.436u  0.498

"u" means NHTSA didn't update their data.
I wonder how many people glance at this and think it's accidents per million miles? Usually this kind of data is presented so that lower is better.
 
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UK Model 3 deliveries have ramped up. Here is a FB post from an old boss of mine who picked up his LR AWD:

I drove home from the Tesla centre near Heathrow and when I came off the M25 and hit a country road, I put my foot down for the first time to test the acceleration.
That was about 3 hours ago... and the grin hasn't left my face yet!

Yep, to be honest the ordering/waiting/communication process for this has been terrible but I think that's due to the large demand. The first big shipment of Model 3s landed in the UK yesterday and each depot is now dealing with 150 customer collections A DAY!
I was lucky as I was one of the first.
 
Just had a read through. It will be an interesting test to see whether a court considers a software fix for a hardware issue sufficient for the warranty, or whether the software fix is at the detriment of the owners who are entitled to new battery packs...

Also an aside, charts with Y-axes that don't start at 0 are very misleading...

Digitized the lawsuit's chart and added 0 to the Y axis (and fixed the X axis labels). It really shows a different story when the chart isn't deliberately misleading. Honestly, 217 miles of range at 138,000 miles on the ODO doesn't sound too bad to me. My guess is that the battery controller had not been adequately adjusting the maximum charge for real-world degradation (and thus overcharging some cells). The software fix just seems to have caught their reported maximum range up to where it should have been.

corrected_misleading_chart.png
 
..
  • Some people really think 10s of millions of miles of real world driving experience is enough to train the car and to verify safety. Elon is betting it will require 10s of billions of miles of real world driving.
  • ...
I realize that this is something of a false equivalency, but one way I think about the volume of driving miles needed around autonomous driving comes from this page I found a few years back doing research for a school project:
Motor vehicle fatality rate in U.S. by year - Wikipedia

Among other information is a table of the volume of miles driven each year in the US, and the fatality rate per 100M VMT (vehicle miles traveled).

The point here is that total miles driven is being measured in units of billion miles traveled, and the fatality rate is in units of 100M vehicle miles traveled. And the fatality rate is getting so low per 100M vehicle miles traveled, I expect the fatality rate to switch to billion miles traveled soon.

I realize that corner cases driving for self / autonomous driving is different than driving fatalities, but knowing that the units to measure one of those is either 100M or 1B tells me that to find enough corner cases, you probably need to measure those miles in the same units.