Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

[SoGA Fan Club]

Fanboys (aka "fanbois"), can see no downside. They defend everything, no matter how ridiculous. They are the TESLAQ of rabid fandom. I tend to not like them either.

Then where were you the last 24 hours?

 

[Buckminster]

Only 2 weeks since the CT reveal - what a ride we are all on!

 

[JRP3]

Then where were you the last 24 hours?

When you came to obviously inaccurate conclusions, as repeatedly pointed out by multiple members?

 

[JRP3]

No way Vern wins. He needed to prove he was harmed, but he didn't. He didn't even show that anyone actually believed he was a pedophile. I'm guessing TSLA rises $2 on news of Musk's acquittal.

You assume juries are rational and actually follow the rule of law. Vern was "upset" during the trial and was there the whole time, Elon testified when required and left. I don't blame Elon in the least, but people in general, i.e. juries, are stupid.

 

[Causalien]

Let’s see if we can get CNBC to run this storyline, base on real facts:

Ford workers break their silence on faulty transmissions: 'My hands are dirty. I feel horrible'

Purposely building faulty transmissions that cost $thousands to repair?

He was referring to the DPS6 dual-clutch "PowerShift" transmission used in 2 million Focus and Fiesta cars sold this decade that is the subject of massive litigation and a federal criminal fraud probe.

"It was cheap to make and cheap to assemble," the engineer said, but because the DPS6 used "dry" clutch technology, it couldn't cool itself, ensuring failures in real-world use.

Can we get a NHTSA investigator on this as well? Seems dangerous to be driving on faulty transmissions. Another reason to convert to EVs, no trans!

This happens because of corporate culture entrapped by bean counters and marketing guys. They worry too much about cost and perception that it prevented them from doing the right thing. Technically minded people and especially engineers will focus on correcting the mistake irregardless of the cost. Which is why a technical based management is superior to one that is slave to the accounting and marketing department.

 

[sparcs]

Must be nice to be a "top tesla analyst" when you can pick any random combination of numbers between zero and infinity.

Now that I think about it. Someone needs to make a website called the "Adam Jonas Tesla Share Price Generator" and have it spit out random numbers.

Odds are it will probably beat the real Adam Jonas. So double the funny.

 

[PeterJA]

I rarely make predictions, so take this with that in mind, but I think Elon will "lose" the case because it's a jury trial and people are mostly emotional and irrational....

Valiant truth-warrior @JRP3 seems to have a low opinion of humanity, maybe from his years of battling lowlifes on Seeking Alpha (at least). But Elon's lawyers helped pick this jury.

British diver REFUSES to apologize to Elon Musk for calling his plan a 'publicity stunt' | Daily Mail Online

...

• [Unsworth] added: 'My insult was to the tube (mini-sub), not to Mr. Musk...
• Unsworth fought tears on the stand, saying Musk's remark left him 'ashamed'

If I was a juror, I would wonder:

1) What kind of lying idiot expects me to believe that "put your sub where the sun don't shine" is not an insult to the owner of said sunless cavity?

2) What kind of lying snowflake feels shamed by an insult from a man he just insulted? Is he unfamiliar with the Internet? Unfamiliar with playgrounds and the Old Testament saying about eyes and teeth?

One man deleted his insult and apologized. The other man filed a lawsuit for big dollars. I know where my sympathies would fall even if I knew nothing else about Elon and Tesla.

 

[EVDRVN]

This happens because of corporate culture entrapped by bean counters and marketing guys. They worry too much about cost and perception that it prevented them from doing the right thing. Technically minded people and especially engineers will focus on correcting the mistake irregardless of the cost. Which is why a technical based management is superior to one that is slave to the accounting and marketing department.

I guess they lack technically minded people in CS That time bomb is only delayed from the wonderful thing Tesla managers cherish called the arbitration clause.

 

[StealthP3D]

2) What kind of lying snowflake feels shamed by an insult from a man he just insulted? Is he unfamiliar with the Internet? Unfamiliar with playgrounds and the Old Testament saying about eyes and teeth?

Regardless of whether Unsworth is familiar with the Internet and the Old Testament, doesn't admitting that when someone called him a "pedo-guy" he felt "ashamed" pretty much amount to an admission that he's sexually attracted to children? Why else would he feel full of shame unless there was at least some truth to it?

 

[Tslynk67]

Jonas said 62 of their institutional clients looked at the Cybertruck, zero percent said it will be a success. This shows the quality of their clients. Seriously.

Is it because they're all in institutions?

Seriously though, it's pretty evident over the years I've been following this stock that 62 of MS institutional clients are short on the stock. Historically, MS have the habit of popping up with a lower price target at strategic moments. No rhyme or reason behind these other than manipulating.

Seems to me that AJ spent a lot of effort getting himself positioned as a "Tesla bull" so that when he did turn bearish, the impact was higher.

It's all games to make people rich, total BS.

 

[PeterJA]

Regardless of whether Unsworth is familiar with the Internet and the Old Testament, doesn't admitting that when someone called him a "pedo-guy" he felt "ashamed" pretty much amount to an admission that he's sexually attracted to children? Why else would he feel full of shame unless there was at least some truth to it?

Right, either Elon's insult hit a nerve or Unsworth is lying about it causing him pain and suffering. Either way, not a sympathetic plaintiff.

 

[Sancho]

Only 2 weeks since the CT reveal - what a ride we are all on!

Really. It’s like the flip side of watching a train wreck in slow motion.

The active members of this forum know that a humongous transformation in transport and energy is about to hit an inflection point,

Yet by obsessively (at least in my case) reading hundreds of posts per day analyzing every small detail of this transformation, it is all proceeding in super slow motion.

The downside of this is that we tend to spend too much time on things that will just be footnotes later (the current pedo trial being a prime example).

The upside is that the better this story becomes, the more exquisite the detail.

So I look at it this way: if we knew we were about to have the greatest sex of our lives, would we rush it, or take it as slow as possible?

 

[Fact Checking]

We do know what the biggest trade-in were.

1) Prius
2) BMW 3 Series
3) Honda Sedan ( Civic?)
4) Toyota Sedan ( Camry?)
5) Nissan LEAF

It isn't

1) BMW 3 Series
2) MB C Class
3) Audi A4
4) Lexus ES
5) Cadillac CTS.

You are making an apples to oranges comparison again, it's not valid to extrapolate from Tesla's list of trade-ins to the rate of ICE luxury car displacement effect Tesla has in California:

• Luxury/premium segment sales in California are lease-heavy, with a higher than 50% leasing rate for some of the brands. Many people are leasing exactly to avoid having to "sell the old car". (One of the early signs of the collapse of ICE sales will be the increase in lease percentages, as buyers become increasingly worried about the residual value of luxury ICE vehicles.) A leased Benz, BMW or Audi is simply left at the Benz, BMW or Audi dealership when the lease expires and the owner buys or leases a Tesla. These cars won't show up on Tesla's trade-in list.
• Tesla's trade-in offers are not the best on the market and they cannot match a good private sale. For an old Prius or Civic few Tesla buyers will go through the hassle to maximize the sales price and consider Tesla taking their old car off their back a convenience service. It makes more sense to get a better used car value for higher value used ICE premium vehicles - and these won't show up in Tesla's trade-in list, even though Benz, BMW or Audi lost a customer to Tesla.

This means that the Tesla trade-in list is heavily biased towards less expensive cars, and I was surprised to see the BMW 3-Series on it at all.

Make no mistake about it: Tesla is hurting BMW and Benz dealership sales in California big time, even if you find the Prius as the top Tesla's list of convenience trade-ins.

I'd say the most reliable indicator of Tesla's effect in California are probably lease rates and residual values. Sales are an imperfect substitute: we just went through a 10 years bull market that benefited California disproportionately - the German luxury brands probably lost a lot of growth which they'd have gained, absent Tesla.

 

[Sancho]

Regardless of whether Unsworth is familiar with the Internet and the Old Testament, doesn't admitting that when someone called him a "pedo-guy" he felt "ashamed" pretty much amount to an admission that he's sexually attracted to children? Why else would he feel full of shame unless there was at least some truth to it?

Regardless of how unsympathetic Unsworth turns out to be, and regardless of the outcome of the lawsuit, can we all agree that Musk was doubly wrong in making the pedo tweet?

First, because none of us should publicly make unwarranted accusations, and

Second, as an extremely high profile CEO, Musk should be held to an even higher standard (than the rest of us) to not abuse the powerful megaphone he has at his control.

This has been an embarrassment for Musk, and by extension, Tesla.

Nothing more.

But also, nothing less.

 

[Tslynk67]

I don't like the headline.

It's like saying: "you might get a 50% gain in 2-3 years, but only if the freaky Cybertruck succeeds and China plays well with the US."

Don't agree with the China/US comment. To the best of my understanding, GF3 is quite insulated from the ongoing stupidity between the Trump regime and China. I don't understand why $TSLA falls when we get "bad news" about the whole process, it should go up as Tesla have an advantage over all their non-Chinese competitors on this front.

I know some here have posited that GF3 might be used as a bargaining chip, but I rather think Shanghai is very proud to have Tesla based there and there will be no issues.

That being said, we still don't know why it has apparently stalled right now, but that's just lack of communication, I feel.

 

[Fact Checking]

Don't agree with the China/US comment. To the best of my understanding, GF3 is quite insulated from the ongoing stupidity between the Trump regime and China. I don't understand why $TSLA falls when we get "bad news" about the whole process, it should go up as Tesla have an advantage over all their non-Chinese competitors on this front.

I know some here have posited that GF3 might be used as a bargaining chip, but I rather think Shanghai is very proud to have Tesla based there and there will be no issues.

That being said, we still don't know why it has apparently stalled right now, but that's just lack of communication, I feel.

IMHO the market still hasn't priced in China GF3 ramping up in time and insulating Tesla from most of the negative effects of China tariffs.

Tesla's previous Model 3 ramp-up was disastrous, so some skepticism is warranted - which I'd expect to largely go away once all the permits are in, deliveries start and GF3 ramps beyond 1,000/week or so.

 

[Tslynk67]

Regardless of how unsympathetic Unsworth turns out to be, and regardless of the outcome of the lawsuit, can we all agree that Musk was doubly wrong in making the pedo tweet?

First, because none of us should publicly make unwarranted accusations, and

Second, as an extremely high profile CEO, Musk should be held to an even higher standard (than the rest of us) to not abuse the powerful megaphone he has at his control.

This has been an embarrassment for Musk, and by extension, Tesla.

Nothing more.

But also, nothing less.

Yup. I love his tweets as do many, they often funny, informative, interesting or just plain weird. People relate to them and by association, him, and it's an invaluable tool for communication and stealth marketing.

But in this case he was totally out of order. He was right when he apologised for it, but then ended up doubling-down due to being lured by a con-man, who may, or may not, have been planted by Unsworth's legal team. Regardless of that he should have walked away after the apology was accepted by Vern.

Only defence is that I believe he was in dire mental straits at the time and he just let it all get under his skin. I imagine the constant barrage of hatred and bile that gets directed to him on a daily basis by the $TSLAQ lunatics must be pretty awful - hopefully he never gets to see this or has learned to zone it out.

We all ****-up from time to time, he's as human as the rest of us, but hopefully he'll learn from it and come out stonier and better.

 

[CorneliusXX]

Regardless of whether Unsworth is familiar with the Internet and the Old Testament, doesn't admitting that when someone called him a "pedo-guy" he felt "ashamed" pretty much amount to an admission that he's sexually attracted to children? Why else would he feel full of shame unless there was at least some truth to it?

That's pretty unfair. I'd imagine being criticised by someone as public as Elon would be similar to being criticised by your boss. Even if you did nothing wrong you'd still feel some shame.

That said, he was clearly being an arse first by unfoundedly criticising Elon's motives and telling him to stick his sub. So he completely brought it on himself.

 

[Sancho]

Yup. I love his tweets as do many, they often funny, informative, interesting or just plain weird. People relate to them and by association, him, and it's an invaluable tool for communication and stealth marketing.

But in this case he was totally out of order. He was right when he apologised for it, but then ended up doubling-down due to being lured by a con-man, who may, or may not, have been planted by Unsworth's legal team. Regardless of that he should have walked away after the apology was accepted by Vern.

Only defence is that I believe he was in dire mental straits at the time and he just let it all get under his skin. I imagine the constant barrage of hatred and bile that gets directed to him on a daily basis by the $TSLAQ lunatics must be pretty awful - hopefully he never gets to see this or has learned to zone it out.

We all ****-up from time to time, he's as human as the rest of us, but hopefully he'll learn from it and come out stonier and better.

Yep. And we all make more mistakes when we are under a lot of stress, and at that time Musk was under incredible stress with little sleep, which explains (but does not excuse) a number of his unfortunate tweets of that period.

Our heroes are sometimes fallible, and our villains sometimes act admirably. Our favorite stock sometimes goes down. Real life is complicated.

 

[Ocelot]

View attachment 485183

Gail Wise was the first person to buy a Ford Mustang in 1964.

55 years later she is still driving it, fully restored a few years ago.

Don't know if she calls herself Mustang Diva but she is hard core.

OT

...and the first mustang ever made wound up in Newfoundland!


Stanley Tucker - Wikipedia