Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

[willow_hiller]

Any language on battery storage?

Now THAT would be a big win for Tesla

Yes! BSS qualifies for the 30% tax credit by itself, it seems:

Page 345

(b) RESIDENTIAL CLEAN ENERGY CREDIT FOR BATTERY STORAGE TECHNOLOGY; CERTAIN EXPENDITURES DISALLOWED
10 (1) ALLOWANCE OF CREDIT.
Paragraph (6) of section 25D(a) is amended to read as follows:
‘‘(6) the qualified battery storage technology expenditures,’’.
(2) DEFINITION OF QUALIFIED BATTERY STORAGE TECHNOLOGY EXPENDITURE.—Paragraph (6) of section 25D(d) is amended to read as follows ‘‘(6) QUALIFIED BATTERY STORAGE TECHNOLOGY EXPENDITURE.—The term ‘qualified battery storage technology expenditure’ means an expenditure for battery storage technology which— ‘‘(A) is installed in connection with a dwelling unit located in the United States and used as a residence by the taxpayer, and ‘‘(B) has a capacity of not less than 3 kilowatt hours.’’.

 

[thx1139]

Yes! BSS qualifies for the 30% tax credit by itself, it seems:

Page 345

(b) RESIDENTIAL CLEAN ENERGY CREDIT FOR BATTERY STORAGE TECHNOLOGY; CERTAIN EXPENDITURES DISALLOWED
10 (1) ALLOWANCE OF CREDIT.
Paragraph (6) of section 25D(a) is amended to read as follows:
‘‘(6) the qualified battery storage technology expenditures,’’.
(2) DEFINITION OF QUALIFIED BATTERY STORAGE TECHNOLOGY EXPENDITURE.—Paragraph (6) of section 25D(d) is amended to read as follows ‘‘(6) QUALIFIED BATTERY STORAGE TECHNOLOGY EXPENDITURE.—The term ‘qualified battery storage technology expenditure’ means an expenditure for battery storage technology which— ‘‘(A) is installed in connection with a dwelling unit located in the United States and used as a residence by the taxpayer, and ‘‘(B) has a capacity of not less than 3 kilowatt hours.’’.

What page is the 30% tax credit language on? Forget about it. I found it.

 

[StarFoxisDown!]

Yes! BSS qualifies for the 30% tax credit by itself, it seems:

Page 345

(b) RESIDENTIAL CLEAN ENERGY CREDIT FOR BATTERY STORAGE TECHNOLOGY; CERTAIN EXPENDITURES DISALLOWED
10 (1) ALLOWANCE OF CREDIT.
Paragraph (6) of section 25D(a) is amended to read as follows:
‘‘(6) the qualified battery storage technology expenditures,’’.
(2) DEFINITION OF QUALIFIED BATTERY STORAGE TECHNOLOGY EXPENDITURE.—Paragraph (6) of section 25D(d) is amended to read as follows ‘‘(6) QUALIFIED BATTERY STORAGE TECHNOLOGY EXPENDITURE.—The term ‘qualified battery storage technology expenditure’ means an expenditure for battery storage technology which— ‘‘(A) is installed in connection with a dwelling unit located in the United States and used as a residence by the taxpayer, and ‘‘(B) has a capacity of not less than 3 kilowatt hours.’’.

Is there any wording for commercial energy storage in addition to the residential?

 

[Singuy]

How about TSLA went from outperforming the Nasdaq by 10X to merely 4X now……and continuing

Wait wait, that's 2x beta and that's a disappointment?

 

[Discoducky]

Assuming

It's a mix

DO BOSTON DYNAMICS' ROBOTS USE ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE?

"Out-of-the-box, Spot has an inherent sense of balance and perception that enables it to walk steadily on a wide variety of terrains. This form of AI that we call “athletic intelligence” allows Spot to walk, climb stairs, avoid obstacles, traverse difficult terrain, and autonomously follow preset routes with little or no input from users."

So they preprogramed a course and let the AI do the balance/perception needed to follow the course.

There are plenty of outtakes of it failing the course. Similar to

https://twitter.com/x/status/1427671567375405069

But you do have to pre program courses, they don't have the ability to decide where to go (if there are 3 viable paths on a course they can't choose), only how to follow a path that someone chose before they started.

Not the place for this discussion, but until they say they are training NN models and running real-time inference predictions, they are NOT doing AI. They are using straight up coding of tolerance bands and Gaussian distributions.

 

[Discoducky]

They don’t always build on mountains, sometimes it’s in the valley, and in the big city in the past, but true they have some additional knowledge and skills that sets them apart. They are a tight knit group and have been together for a couple decades with the exception of the new ‘kid’ they’re trying out. Word on the street consistently says they are the best.

Ultimately, talented, hardworking people will always have more work available to them than they can complete. No demand issues for them.

Krugerrand is describing us (at least that is what I'm telling myself)

 

[Ogre]

Well, as of right now there is no "new tax credit", there is a proposed one that will likely change many times before it becomes real, if it ever does.

Given Elon's distaste of tax credits to support the market they may not make changes just to qualify for the tax credit. (That way shorts can't say the tax credit is funding Tesla.)

Maybe depends on battery mix.

If Tesla has enough LFP cells to shift most of their Model 3 production to the base model, they could just let the Model 3 demand naturally slide towards the shorter range variant. That would drive demand towards the Model Y. Since they have so much more capacity for the Model Y coming online that seems like a decent play.

Puts the base price of the Model 3 down below $40k again (with incentives).

 

[dhanson865]

Tesla launches Cloud Profiles in update 2022.24

The long-rumored 'cloud profiles' are finally arriving in Tesla update 2022.24. Tesla is officially calling the feature 'Tesla Profiles.' With this late

www.notateslaapp.com

Tesla is officially calling the feature 'Tesla Profiles.' With this latest update, you'll be given the option to tie your driver profile to your Tesla account.

If you decide to connect your profile to your Tesla account some of your vehicle's settings will be able to travel with you from one Tesla to another.

Settings such as mirror, seat and wheel positions will be synced across other supported vehicles. So if you're lucky enough to have multiple Teslas in your household and adjust your seat in one vehicle, then the setting will automatically be synced to the other vehicle.

These vehicles could be rentals or owned by you. As long as they show up in your Tesla app then your car profile will become available on that vehicle.

This could work on Hertz rentals if we can add the rental car to our tesla app.

2022.24 allows you reposition the Blind Spot Camera display [Video]

Tesla's newest update 2022.24 is now in the beginning stages of rolling out. While it's still early and it may be several weeks before your vehicle rec

www.notateslaapp.com

You can move the blind spot camera display to any of the 4 corners.

 

[Ogre]

AI day ... are we gonna see anything like this ... guess not.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1552305083475341313

I think I would like to see what happens when someone goes in and shuffles all those props around. If the robots could dynamically change their little routine to match a changing environment, it would be rad. Seeing a robot following a choreographed program is much less rad.

No, TeslaBot will not do things like this. That sort of thing is complex, requires an expensive robot, and requires a lot of human time scripting it. Optimus is almost the opposite end of the robotics curve from this. It is simple, inexpensive (relatively), and should be able to figure out how to basic tasks without skilled human programmers engineering it's tasks.

 

[TN Mtn Man]

Yes the PowerPoint presentation will be more compelling with Lamborghini in the words…

Yep-why is hiring someone from a company that does very low volume, niche market manufacturing, to your "car company"? Seems like someone familiar to high volume manufacturing and a focus on costs would be more of an asset. But that's just me. I don't understand the hoopla over an "Apple Car". As far as I know (correct me if I'm wrong), Apple doesn't have much actual in-house manufacturing experience, with most of their products outsourced to contract manufacturers. A Foxconn car would be more of a threat...but that's likely what an "Apple Car" would be.

 

[willow_hiller]

Is there any wording for commercial energy storage in addition to the residential?

Hmm, looking right now. So far I see:

1. Extension of the QUALIFIED ALTERNATIVE FUEL VEHICLE REFUELING PROPERTY credit (EVSEs), including BIDIRECTIONAL CHARGING EQUIPMENT
2. ADVANCED MANUFACTURING PRODUCTION CREDIT including the production of things like battery active material, battery cells, battery modules, residental inverters, commercial inverters, and photovoltaic cells

Ah okay, I think I found commercial energy storage starting on page 254, it's just vague:

EXTENSION AND MODIFICATION OF ENERGY CREDIT.
striking ‘‘January 1, 2024’’ and inserting ‘‘January 1, 2035’’
(f) ENERGY STORAGE TECHNOLOGIES; QUALIFIED BIOGAS PROPERTY; MICROGRID CONTROLLERS; EXTENSION OF OTHER PROPERTY.
IN GENERAL.—The term ‘energy storage technology’ means— property ... which receives, stores, and delivers energy for conversion to electricity (or, in the case of hydrogen, which stores energy), and has a nameplate capacity of not less than 5 kilowatt hours
IN GENERAL.—The term ‘microgrid controller’ means equipment which is— ‘‘(i) part of a qualified microgrid, and ‘‘(ii) designed and used to monitor and control the energy resources and loads on such microgrid.
‘‘(B) QUALIFIED MICROGRID.—The term ‘qualified microgrid’ means an electrical system which— ‘‘(i) includes equipment which is capable of generating not less than 4 kilowatts and not greater than 20 megawatts of electricity

 

[thx1139]

Reviewing the Tax Inflation Reduction Act document. Think the used car part of it is stupid. Must be used car bought from a dealer. So private person to person sale doesnt qualify. Can only be the 1st transfer. So you go to a used car dealer and 2 of the exact same car on lot. One gets a tax credit and one doesnt. Because one was sold to dealer by original owner and another by 2nd owner.

 

[TN Mtn Man]

So is Model Y technically a SUV? What is the official definition of an SUV? Is there one? Incredibly strange that a slight difference in cabin space will enable a $25k increase in price ceiling for the EV subsidy (Comparing the model 3 vs model y).

Hopefully this doesn’t freeze sales in the US in the interim Period until subsidy is active for Tesla (once the bill is actually passed) - good thing there is a big order book to work through, and plenty of international markets they can ship to if needed.

This. We have a month-long backlog on EVs now, this taxpayer handout is unlikely to result in the sale of one new EV. And for the reason you mentioned, is likely to be a negative impact in the short term. Why does gov always try to mess with the private sector and promote winners and losers? The last big spending bill from last October seems to have put a damper on (non-Tesla) charging companies as businesses waited to see what the impact would be.

 

[Discoducky]

Tesla launches Cloud Profiles in update 2022.24

The long-rumored 'cloud profiles' are finally arriving in Tesla update 2022.24. Tesla is officially calling the feature 'Tesla Profiles.' With this late

www.notateslaapp.com

This could work on Hertz rentals if we can add the rental car to our tesla app.

Super cool! Cloud profiles are not trivial, but a very complex hand-off of information, data sharing, sync'ing, ensuring tokens get handled properly so they don't get corrupted...etc.

I worked on the XBOX Cloud Profile launch in 2014 and of our 270+ services almost all had to be updated to support cloud profile features and yes we bricked a bunch of our personal accounts while during development and testing...

 

[Nocturnal]

Reviewing the Tax Inflation Reduction Act document. Think the used car part of it is stupid. Must be used car bought from a dealer. So private person to person sale doesnt qualify. Can only be the 1st transfer. So you go to a used car dealer and 2 of the exact same car on lot. One gets a tax credit and one doesnt. Because one was sold to dealer by original owner and another by 2nd owner.

Individual sellers aren't able to bribe politicians.

NADA PAC

NADA PAC is NADA's political action committee and represents the interests of all franchised dealers of new cars and trucks by supporting pro-dealer congressional candidates of both political parties.

www.nada.org

 

[MadScientist23]

Is that true AI, or a machine just programmed to run a specific course in a predetermined way...?

What I think would be groundbreaking and a real show stopper would be to throw a ball at Optimus and have it catch the ball. I'm talking tossed underhand from a person. Showing the adaptation to a real time problem and using sensors to adjust to the environment is a very simple thought but would show a grand ability overall. I doubt this to be possible but you never know.

 

[Ogre]

Reviewing the Tax Inflation Reduction Act document. Think the used car part of it is stupid. Must be used car bought from a dealer. So private person to person sale doesnt qualify. Can only be the 1st transfer. So you go to a used car dealer and 2 of the exact same car on lot. One gets a tax credit and one doesnt. Because one was sold to dealer by original owner and another by 2nd owner.

The whole idea of incentives on used cars is fraught. Limiting it to one used sale per vehicle is the least stupid thing about this.

This whole bill is going to create a weird pile of bizarre unintended consequences. If you are the owner of an EV which you purchased new, the resale value of your car just went up by a bit under $4000 if you sell it to a dealership. If you have the same exact car but it's second hand, no luck??

Good for me I guess? I think I'm going to go order a Model Y LR. If this passes, resale on my current one just went up again and price of a new one just went down.

 

[thx1139]

I dont see anything about PHEVs in the new bill. Anyone else notice? What about motorcycles an e-bikes?

 

[The Accountant]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1552683880510984193

 

[Singuy]

Reviewing the Tax Inflation Reduction Act document. Think the used car part of it is stupid. Must be used car bought from a dealer. So private person to person sale doesnt qualify. Can only be the 1st transfer. So you go to a used car dealer and 2 of the exact same car on lot. One gets a tax credit and one doesnt. Because one was sold to dealer by original owner and another by 2nd owner.

If it's not from a dealer and doesn't have the 1 time stipulation then I can see people reselling their car back and forth infinite times to get infinite rebates.