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Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

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Perspective
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My wife bought Amazon in the 1990s for a modest IRA investment. We held since then including the dot com crash in 2001 with almost 90% drop. I remember the anxiety we had at that time. Now I can barely see that drop on the chart. Part of the reason we kept these shares has been as a reminder to HODL long term.
 
When they do a van, I hope it's a van that the USPS, Amazon, FedEx, and UPS will also like!
TBH I hope the opposite. That would be too political, and involve whining unions, and people claiming tesla are propped up by subsidies and so on. I'd rather they just made the equivalent of a ford transit van: a workhorse that every plumber, every carpenter, every electrician, every decorator would buy, just because of the massive fuel savings. No need top negotiate with big public utilities or political groups, just 'here is a better van than your current one. Now buy it'.

And amazon will never buy anything made by Tesla. Bezos is still too petulant and deluded, and probably still has some sway. Their stupid loss, obviously, but there is a huge market for a Tesla van without any governments or bezos getting involved.
 
If this is the case then we should see a sharp turnaround after Jan 1st. Or at least an improving trendline.

What an ugly end to an ugly year, lol.
That's what I think. I plan on making a big margin purchase on one of these final trading days and hold for a January pop. Annoying that my margin rate has floated up to 7%. I only plan to hold the debt for a few weeks.

For a sustained turn-around, I kind of think we need the truck launched and ramping.
 
TBH I hope the opposite. That would be too political, and involve whining unions, and people claiming tesla are propped up by subsidies and so on. I'd rather they just made the equivalent of a ford transit van: a workhorse that every plumber, every carpenter, every electrician, every decorator would buy, just because of the massive fuel savings. No need top negotiate with big public utilities or political groups, just 'here is a better van than your current one. Now buy it'.

And amazon will never buy anything made by Tesla. Bezos is still too petulant and deluded, and probably still has some sway. Their stupid loss, obviously, but there is a huge market for a Tesla van without any governments or bezos getting involved.
Do we all agree, anything but a family van?
 
This is a troubling post for me to read. First, because TSLA is actually plotting a pattern on its chart that is in no way unique to oversold stocks/indexes during a market meltdown as we have seen this before and we are seeing it on other stocks right now. And secondly, because the bottom of the 2008/2009 meltdown of the DJI left the exact same pattern........one that was clear enough that I had called the bottom before-hand and acted accordingly.........and yet I did not act accordingly with my TSLA shares this time because I let all the 'noise' of life get in the way despite looking for a similar opportunity over the last decade. It should have been clear that we would be trading here, and I missed it. I will take the 'stoic' road as @Queeg500 often reminds us to do. It was MY fault that I didn't sell enough shares to put some more money on the sidelines when TSLA was grossly over-priced. It was MY fault that I didn't sell some shares on the way down when the rest of life was too noisy for me to pay closer attention, and when I thought TSLA as an ETF would outperform other stocks in a meltdown even though it doesn't pay a dividend. I will not be too proud to say Chicken Genius and others were right, and I was wrong. And I will also say that @TrendTrader007 is looking at some very relative data and sharing it with the rest of the board. And I won't point a finger at Elon and blame him for the actions I didn't take. And I certainly won't point a finger at Elon and blame him for a full market meltdown following a laundry list of items that are all individually bad for the market, and that were all put in the pot together at the same time with the flames on high........to include a 2 year global disruption of EVERYTHING at a time when the Market was massively inflated with the value of hindsight, an over-extended period of almost 0% interest followed by massive & rapid rate hikes, the largest transition of global energy sources, power, and wealth the world has ever seen. And of course the inevitable stagnation resulting from the end of 30+ years of US military involvement in the Middle East which had ramped to a $2+ Trillion per year expenditure for the last several administrations (think post-Vietnam on steroids here). No..............of course I am not going to point a finger at Elon for that.

Here is the chart for the DJI for the 2008/2009 crash:
View attachment 887135

Here is TSLA today:
View attachment 887136
And we might have just a little ways to go yet. But IF history repeats itself, that will be a quick dip, and TSLA should pop its head back above 200 again fairly quickly too.

For comparison, here is Amazon:
View attachment 887139
As you can see, AMZN followed a similar pattern and it has already hit a point that would otherwise look like it could only be a random point on the chart until you compared it to the 2007/2008 DJI drop

And here is Netflix:
View attachment 887140
Interestingly, NFLX go hit harder and faster than Amazon or Tesla, and it hit its support back in June. But it got beat down in exactly the same way.

I don't want to muddy the waters of this post with my thoughts on how and why there is so much noise around Elon at the moment and how BIG that fight really is (save that for a separate post that is long overdue). I just want to get this out there to show that TSLA is not in any way trading in an unprecedented manner, and that several other BIG stocks are trading in exactly the same way..........without any involvement in Twitter, or any claims that their Boards should be acting in a different manner, etc. It is under circumstances like these that we should all be paying closer attention to the source of some of the noise that caused us to miss some massive opportunities............you know, like doubling the amount of shares you own. And it is during times like these that we need to make those examinations void of Cognitive Dissonance to the best of our abilities. For instance........I have long enjoyed Ross Gerber. Yet, if I had been pouring through all of my old trading notes instead of watching Ross drink Teslaquilla on YouTube while telling the World we should be buying TSLA all the way through the stock price slide because he had it all figured out, I would be in a much better position now. So what does that say about Ross' character that he is now pointing a finger at Elon and the TSLA board instead of looking at the other 3 fingers pointing back at himself. We all make mistakes. But how much we improve going forward is dependent upon how much reflection we have on ALL of the surrounding events, and on our ability to have some accountability for the things that were in our power to notice and to change.

I predict this post will become extremely relevant at the end of another 10-12 year cycle.

View attachment 887146
This is helpful and interesting. Thanks.
 
That's what I think. I plan on making a big margin purchase on one of these final trading days and hold for a January pop. Annoying that my margin rate has floated up to 7%. I only plan to hold the debt for a few weeks.

For a sustained turn-around, I kind of think we need the truck launched and ramping.
Can you pay off the debt if the stock continues declining? This sounds like an absolutely crazy play to me, isn’t this the worst time to be using margin in the last like 20-30 years? While we’re going through the most intense rate hike on record?

I fully expect the market to grind down to a new bottom in the first half of 2023
 
I am not a huge chartist, but a big believer in flows. Elon selling triggered a significant amount of puts going in the money and in a stock like Tesla, that has a way of perpetuating itself.

Now that begets additional selling until we get a week or so of an upward trend. There needs to be a catalyst for this, like big name buying in. (Icahn, etc?). Or a buy back, or an unexpectedly good p&d.

The probability of something like that happening increases with SP going down more, where investors get interested or the bar gets lower for what's a good p&d. We're at levels perhaps consistent with a 400k delivery, but who knows.

one thing to watch out for could be the Jan leaps expiry. When a lot of these puts get wiped away, the slate is somewhat cleaner. Folks closing these down in early Jan could be a trigger for better price action in new year. Let's see.
I agree with you and am hopeful for what happens after Jan options expiry. Unfortunately (as has been the case all year long), no big funds have been buying anything all year with liquidity at record lows. With a forecast that all markets will tank Q1 and Q2 due to repricing of all stocks since earnings are still too bullish, no big funds are buying anything in noticeable quantities until then.
 
Someone called mad money to rant about Ford's customer service and ended up buying a tesla...what????

Watching Kramer squirm... ironically Farley is saying quality is their most important metric to fix. Fix... like ugh shouldn't transitioning to EV be the primary focus?


“Fixing quality is my No. 1 priority,” Farley told the Ford Retired Engineering Executives group at their most recent gathering. “It is the most important initiative in the whole company. And it’s going to take several years. We didn’t lose it in just one or two years. Until we fix quality, nothing else matters.”
 
Anyone given any thought to the possibility this huge bear raid is just to lower buy in prices for hedge funds once Moody's upgrades their rating?

The funds waiting for the green light to buy wouldn't want to pay inflated prices, they'd want to buy as low as possible. And according to Tesla Momma, Moody's usually changes their ratings at year's end, a bit over a week from now.

Could this bear raid simply be a coordinated effort to prep TSLA for the waiting funds to start accumulating? 🤔
No big institutions have been buying anything in large quantities this year due to record low liquidity. Soonest bail-out to TSLA will happen probably Q2 or Q3 (since after Q1 TSLA will drop more with all stocks based on a reset of earnings since they still haven't been adjusted down yet).
 
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Can you pay off the debt if the stock continues declining? This sounds like an absolutely crazy play to me, isn’t this the worst time to be using margin in the last like 20-30 years? While we’re going through the most intense rate hike on record?

I fully expect the market to grind down to a new bottom in the first half of 2023
Yes, it might be a stupid thing to do.

Edit: Actually you just reminded me I like to time my trades with where the S&P 500 is in it's trend channel. Right now it's no where close to the bottom so I'll wait unless I decide to break my rule.
 
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I feel like I've been living in an alternate reality for the last 3 months... not only from Tesla,TSLA, and blue bird, but personal issues as well. Hoping the new year brings some positive changes... for all of us.

I am right there with you. For example: since the beginning of the month I've been laid off, discovered that my beloved dog has weeks to live, surprised by a roof leak, endured seemingly endless illnesses circulating within our household, and of course watched my net worth plummet. I feel cursed, or something.

So, without knowing your circumstances, know that I can at least empathize with your situation. Hang in there.
 
To fellow TSLA holders, here is the gift that Elon gave it to us. Enjoy burnt hair

Still holding on shares but not planning to buy more at this point.

I don't use margins so thank god on this one. But still this has been painful especially when seeing it decoupled with QQQ and the rest of them.

On a side note I've picked up extra shifts at work and cut back all the dine out.

Good luck to us all.

Burnt+Hair.jpeg
 
That’s the mystery investors like myself have to negotiate. At hat point do I buy more shares and how long before we see another bull run. I personally think sometime before the mass production of the CT. I will be an early owner of one and it would nice to see the stock have a run at this point.
I hope for all of our sakes before CT ramp. Based on history, TSLA stock price always lags good news, e.g. when Tesla is "revving on all motors", price has remained irrationally low until much later, when it pops in a sudden burst (from shorts flipping to longs).
 
Elon sold shares from the start of November till 12/28 last year. I'm not sure why people keep saying he can't sell during blackout dates.
Hopefully, this could be the last or 2nd last batch he planned this year.
2021's December sales were all due to the 2012 CEO option executions and part of a 10b5-1 filed in September.
None of his sales this year have been under a 10b5-1 (nor arguably, planned).