Man if I had any Nvidia I would be cashing out so quickly lol. AI has quickly turned into a bubble when it comes to their valuation verse the reality of the numbers they’re putting up currently in earnings and what they’re guiding by themselves for this year
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Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable
- Thread starter AudubonB
- Start date
Krugerrand
Meow
I’d assume any new US factories would be for North America product predominantly. However, with a Mexico factory -
Tesla will build factories where product is needed to reduce costs like shipping and increase efficiencies like shipping.
So, I wouldn’t actually depend on a lot more US factories. We’ve already got Nevada, Buffalo, Austin, Fremont, Lathrop. Those will obviously continue to expand as more products require for the ‘local’ areas.
But just how many more US factories are you expecting? Additionally, Tesla isn’t primarily hiring OEM union workers, so don’t expect Tesla to hire all those displaced workers dying OEMs. A lot of those workers don’t have the skill set nor the work culture to work at Tesla. And finally, Tesla is clearly going the route of more labor bots, less human labor - again, reducing the chances of your typical OEM union worker of being a Tesla hire.
I’ve no idea who or what or when does or does not get bailed out, but eventually all companies die or significantly morph into something unrecognizable, so says history of continued progress and change.
Tesla’s unspoken slogan is technically; change or die.
Gigapress
Trying to be less wrong
"When you have paying subscribers it is much better to deliberately bias your model away from the maximum likelihood estimate instead of aiming for accuracy and letting your clients do their own risk management with respect to missing high vs. low"
MartinAustin
Active Member
They still need to pay this back before they get any more taxpayers' money! IMO Ford took $6B government loan in 2009 — and debt still haunts company
In my opinion Tesla is not maximizing profits but maximizing the number of electric vehicles being put on the road. Since they operate in a capitalist system they use the means of capitalism (profits) to achieve that goal.
bkp_duke
Well-Known Member
Not blasted, just bear in mind that Ford's current efficiency per SF of plant space is a fraction of something like Giga Shanghai. Texas and all future GFs will be even more efficient.
KBF
Model X owner (formerly Cdn Signature Model S)
Why would you get blasted? I think this is good news - we need EV competition. It's good that at least someone is trying to imitate Tesla; not sure they'll be very successful, but this is Ford's chance at survival, and they seem to be the only US OEM to understand this. New CEO seems okay so far. I certainly wouldn't invest in them, though... Too risky.
I still don't understand how Tesla builds so quickly - my guess is fewer meetings, more power to team leads for decision-making, and having cash sure helps. Any timelines for the Ford factory?
Only because you made a comparison between F and T...
I'm not sure that's a good thing... (for Ford).
The nearly six square mile "mega campus" is called out as at/near Stranton, TN and has a planned completion of 2025 (3 year construction schedule, 4 years from announcement). 6000 jobs. It will reportedly assist Ford in reaching their company wide goal of 2 million EVs a year by 2026.
Meanwhile, Tesla completes plants in around one year from announcement and may achieve production of 2 million from a single location. Oh, and the Giga Mexico site is larger than Ford's
Honestly looks pretty decent. It will be interesting to see how it stacks up against the Kia EV9.Talking about Ford. They just introduced the New All Electric Ford Explorer...
Here is my oversimplified view of Tesla and the margins in the EV industry.
My understanding from the media of what people think is the current and future situation:
Here's my view of the current and future situation:
My understanding from the media of what people think is the current and future situation:
- The media often assumes that the EV industry is profitable.
- Tesla's margins will decrease over time due to increased competition.
Here's my view of the current and future situation:
- The margin of the industry is currently negative.
- Due to competition, the margin gap for Tesla will likely close.
- It is not realistic to think that Tesla will be the only car company, so the industry average margin is likely to become positive.
- Despite competition, Tesla's margin is expected to remain strong and stable due to its constant innovation.
Important clarification, it can be both. Tesla is maximizing overall profit by lowering vehicle profit and multiplying by more vehicles. It doesn't make sense for them to leave money on the table (so to speak)
Crude example:
2 Million cars at 13k gross margin each is more profit than 1.5 Million cars at 15k GM.
Really? With ChatGPT hitting the world like a ton of bricks? I think Nvidia has got a good year upcoming. But maybe we should continue this in the What Other Tech Stocks thread.
Mostly agree, but I think the Tesla line has a positive slope...(margin can grow while prices are reduced)
jeewee3000
Active Member
The big wild card is software revenue. That can bump revenue per vehicle for Tesla without extra manufacturing cost.
Talking about price wars, in Europe Tesla is really pushing sales during the last week of the quarter. For selected Model Ys the discounts have been raised from €3000 to over €5000 (and for other Model Ys to €3500-3700). Model 3Ps even get a €6000 discount, but those have the performance upgrade so it's easier to give them a large discount.
On my commute from the western part to the eastern part of The Netherlands I'm seeing more and more Model Ys on the road. It's such a cool car to see. And to my surprise a lot of them have German license plates. Must be vacationers or businessmen driving to the port of Rotterdam. It's a sign of Tesla's popularity in Germany.
I also spot trailers almost every day with Chinese built Model Ys going in the direction of Germany (probably RWD) and with German built Model Ys (AWD) going in the opposite direction.
On my commute from the western part to the eastern part of The Netherlands I'm seeing more and more Model Ys on the road. It's such a cool car to see. And to my surprise a lot of them have German license plates. Must be vacationers or businessmen driving to the port of Rotterdam. It's a sign of Tesla's popularity in Germany.
I also spot trailers almost every day with Chinese built Model Ys going in the direction of Germany (probably RWD) and with German built Model Ys (AWD) going in the opposite direction.
I don't know if "price war" is negative or positive. My point was that Tesla is not at war with anyone. They are just balancing supply and demand.
And also, Tesla has the ability to price their cars more effectively than anyone else. Is "price efficiency" a good term for it? Maybe there is a real business or economics term for this. Not my area of expertise.
If this were any other company, the day that a major competitor came out and admitted that they were losing a crap ton of money on their competing products at at best would take years to make a profit, that company's stock would be up 20%. 
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Darn, and I saw their stock rise coming a few days ago from a youtube video when "trying" to keep up on latest AI tools (moving fast). If I were to diversify, NVDA would be a good game to play. In a nutshell, any one of us will be able to upload training data and pay NVDA servers to spit out NNs. I bet it's on GMs roadmap already.
AI cloud services are exactly where Dojo could go, but Tesla chose to maintain course for FSD, (likely resource constrained as we've heard in the past, along with it wasn't quite ready yet, but I'm not following that closely). It would take some convincing to get me to believe Tesla (or Elon) isn't already preparing his "Open" AI on a Dojo-like (or parallel) platform. AI for profit is clearly a threat to humanity, which is perhaps why Tesla isn't going that route with AI business for just anyone. If they did, it would likely be tightly controlled and not used and abused for profit.
have you seen how small it is? It is nothing near the size of a current Explorer or the EV9.
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