The Seattle Area Needs More Superchargers

[EV-lutioin]

Presently there are 20 superchager stations under construction in the U.S., which is more that I have seen in quite a while. My guess is Tesla has been planning the pay-to-charge announcement for some time and the new SC's under construction right now were planned with that announcement in mind. But, of course that is just conjecture...

 

[melindav]

did some quick (not absolute) math to show how underserved Washington is.
There are 6 SCs in WA (including 1 under construction).
WA EV ownership is the highest per capita in the country at 1.6%, with a population of 7,170,351. That would be 114,725 EVs (in a world where every census counted person owns one vehicle). So assuming every EV is a Tesla, that would be 19,120 per SC
Wyoming has 5 SCs and one of the lowest EV ownership per capita rates at <0.1%, with a population of 584,153 and 584 EVs (giving them the benefit of the doubt and using a straight 0.1%). Again assuming every one is a Tesla, that would be 109 per SC
thats 175:1 in favor of Wyoming.

If you feel comparing to a low ownership state isn't a fair comparison, here's California with nearly 2:1 over Washington and Oregon 6:1 over Washington:
California has 54 SCs (including 4 under construction and 1 waiting on permits). Population is 39,114,818 and EV ownership at 1.4% = 548,027 EVs / 54 SCs = 10,148 per SC
Oregon has 13 SCs (including 1 waiting for permits). Population 3,744,432 and EV ownership at 1.1% = 41,118 EVs / 13 SCs = 3,163 per SC

So obviously not all EVs are Teslas using the SCs, but all four were calculated the same to give a ballpark comparison.
Likely the only state worse off using this logic would be Hawaii without any SCs and also at 1.6% ownership

 

[pdxrajiv]

Assuming you believe Tesla's assertion that SCs are placed for convenient long-distance travel:
Not much need for SCs in Hawaii since you can't go very far n a car..
My guess is that Wyoming chargers are to allow visitors to reach Tetons and Yellowstone, and to transit through the state.

 

[roblab]

Assuming you believe Tesla's assertion that SCs are placed for convenient long-distance travel:
Not much need for SCs in Hawaii since you can't go very far n a car..
My guess is that Wyoming chargers are to allow visitors to reach Tetons and Yellowstone, and to transit through the state.

TRUE! I think the original plan was that owners would charge at home (radical thinking, I know). It has nothing to do with population, but with tourism. Even if there is nothing to see in one area, if it is a throughway to somewhere, there will be SCs.

I went on a little drive yesterday, near 400 miles. Used one SC. Got home with 35 miles. Plugged in and went to bed. That's how it works.

 

[melindav]

@pdxrajiv you are likely correct, but it would be nice to be able to drive from Portland to Marysville or Everett and back in one day. At this point, it would not be possible to get to/from Centralia unless having the larger battery.

 

[Chuq]

did some quick (not absolute) math to show how underserved Washington is.

It's not as simple as number of Teslas divided by number of SCs.

Yes, Washington has 6 sites. But they cover all the interstates - unless you are doing a specific route (Olympia to Everett and back again, over and over) you can get to pretty much everywhere in the state. Perhaps one on the 101 north of Olympia National Park somewhere.

There are also another 5 just outside its borders. If Coeur d'Alene, ID was at Spokane Valley, The Dalles, OR was at White Salmon, Seaside, OR was at Chinook, that would alter your numbers significantly but wouldn't be particularly better or worse for Washington owners.

If they built one at (for example) Lewiston, Idaho, would you still think they are ignoring Washington just because it is outside the border?

 

[pdxrajiv]

@pdxrajiv you are likely correct, but it would be nice to be able to drive from Portland to Marysville or Everett and back in one day. At this point, it would not be possible to get to/from Centralia unless having the larger battery.

I would like more superchargers in urban centers. Current sparseness and premium pricing at many hotels that provide destination charging makes life hard for out-of-town visitors. (Some may protest my comment about premium pricing. Maybe I am too frugal. Also, there is a less polite word for it )

Two cases in point:
1. My first range mishap happened when I was visiting Seattle from Portland. We charged at Centralia on our way up and I thought I would have enough charge to make it back to Centralia. But then I foolishly let a few friends go on a joyride to test the car's capabilities and ended up having to charge at Tahoma Market in Fife on my way to Centralia from Seattle. A Seattle SC would have been welcome,

2. On a recent extended trip to Phoenix, I ended up having to go to charge at Casa Grande or Buckeye multiple times because the only hotels with destination charging were at least $100 more per night. Phoenix does have other paid charging options but they were either too slow or too inconvenient so I ended up driving 30 minutes each way to keep the car charged.

So I know the desirability of city SCs. But I also understand why Tesla currently does not prioritize these higher.

Also, I think more urban SCs will come very quickly after Tesla charges for charges,
But this is a complete speculation/projection.

 

[Mattzilla]

TRUE! I think the original plan was that owners would charge at home (radical thinking, I know). It has nothing to do with population, but with tourism. Even if there is nothing to see in one area, if it is a throughway to somewhere, there will be SCs.

I went on a little drive yesterday, near 400 miles. Used one SC. Got home with 35 miles. Plugged in and went to bed. That's how it works.

That's how it works for suburbanites. Many, many owners do not have garages or places to plug-in at home.

 

[pdxrajiv]

That's how it works for suburbanites. Many, many owners do not have garages or places to plug-in at home.

BTW, that is how it worked out for me.
We live within 30 miles of an SC. And I did not have a real charger at home for a month after I had the car.
My rationale was that if I needed, I could charge with our home outlet overnight so I could get to "our" SC.
And my first SC experience was at the Woodburn SC, the one nearest to my house.
But that was intended to allow me to learn what I could expect at a distant SC.
I found that experience useful. Never been back to the Woodburn SC.

 

[hpartsch]

It's not as simple as number of Teslas divided by number of SCs.

Yes, Washington has 6 sites. But they cover all the interstates - unless you are doing a specific route (Olympia to Everett and back again, over and over) you can get to pretty much everywhere in the state. Perhaps one on the 101 north of Olympia National Park somewhere.

There are also another 5 just outside its borders. If Coeur d'Alene, ID was at Spokane Valley, The Dalles, OR was at White Salmon, Seaside, OR was at Chinook, that would alter your numbers significantly but wouldn't be particularly better or worse for Washington owners.

If they built one at (for example) Lewiston, Idaho, would you still think they are ignoring Washington just because it is outside the border?

I want to go to the HOH rainforest -- I agree, Tesla needs one there!

 

[Mattzilla]

I want to go to the HOH rainforest -- I agree, Tesla needs one there!

I took my Tesla to the Hoh Rainforest this summer and the rangers let me charge at the station there.

 

[EarlyAdopter]

I want to go to the HOH rainforest -- I agree, Tesla needs one there!

The Hoh Rainforest is a 200 mile round trip from Seabrook, WA. There's a free L2 charger there in the middle of town and several of the houses for rent have L2 chargers. Nice town. Stay the night, charge up, and do a day trip out to the rainforest.

Or, it's a 224 mile round trip from the soon-to-be-opened Supercharger in Aberdeen, WA. Once that opens, any day now, could be done in one go, depending on your battery size. That Supercharger will really open up a lot of the coast.

 

[Mattzilla]

Or use the free L3 charger in Port Angeles, WA, and hit Gastro Pub and Hurricane Ridge while in the area. Driving from Port Angeles to the Hoh Rainforest and back was easy with my 70D. You can also charge at the RV park in Forks, WA (NEMA 14-50) if you are desperate, as well as behind the maintenance building at Forks Hospital (I used to work in the area and they allowed me to do this).

 

[ReddyLeaf]

My location speculations in the other Seattle thread:
New SC in Seattle

 

[melindav]

the new 2017 plans show a couple proposed locations coming our way!
Looks like one around Vancouver/Portland, Olympia, Forks, 3 around Seattle, Port Angeles (or is that San Juan Island/Whidbey Island or Victoria?), Wenatchee and near the intersection of Why 97 and 20.

 

[Drone Flyer]

Presently there are 20 superchager stations under construction in the U.S., which is more that I have seen in quite a while. My guess is Tesla has been planning the pay-to-charge announcement for some time and the new SC's under construction right now were planned with that announcement in mind. But, of course that is just conjecture...

I'd like to see more SUperchargers around the Vancouver, BC area and Vancouver Island, namely Victoria and Nanaimo.

 

[FlatSix911]

This should help ... Tesla unveils its 2017 Supercharger network expansion plans

Last night, Tesla updated the Supercharger network map on its website to show its expansion plans for next year. With only a few weeks left in 2016, the company had fallen behind on its 2016 expansion plans for its network of DC fast-charging stations and the current Supercharger maps, which should have looked like the “2016 maps”, were missing several stations. Tesla Supercharger “2016 maps” are replaced with “2017 maps” showing some new Supercharger expansions in Hawaii, Mexico, Taiwan, Korea and New Zealand.

North America:
In North America, Tesla announced new Superchargers in Hawaii and Mexico, and it pushed to next year expansions to extend the coverage in the US and Canada that were originally planned for 2016. We are talking about more extensive coverage on the west and east coast, as well as expansions in states currently without any stations, like North Dakota or Arkansas, that were supposed to get some Superchargers in 2016, but they are now on the 2017 map.

Here are the relevant maps per region. The first map represents the current Supercharger stations. The second map represents the planned network for 2016 that Tesla has now abandoned and finally, the last map is the new planned network for 2017:


Current 2016

Planned 2016 – abandoned

Planned 2017

Europe:
Not much as changed from the 2016 map of planned Superchargers in Europe to the planned 2017 map. More stations are planned for central Europe and France, but expansion in East Europe and along the Mediterranean sea that were originally planned for 2016 have now been pushed to next year:


Current 2016

Planned 2016 – abandoned

Planned 2017

Asia-Pacific:
Same thing for Asia, Australia, and New Zealand. The new map only confirms Supercharger expansions that were announced in the last few months after the market introductions of Tesla in Taiwan, South Korea, and New Zealand. Tesla will also continue its expansions in China and Australia.


Current 2016

Planned 2016 – abandoned

Planned 2017

Tesla currently operates over 4,800 Superchargers at over 769 locations around the world. The company aims to almost double that number by the end of next year in preparation for the Model 3 hitting the market during the second half of 2017 and in large numbers in 2018. In order to accelerate and finance the deployment of more stations, Tesla announced last month the end of unlimited free Supercharging and the change to ‘Supercharging credit program’, which gives owners roughly 1000 miles of free charging at Superchargers each year. After reaching the threshold, owners will have to buy ‘Supercharger Credits’. Also, it doesn’t want to make money on its recent $.40/minute overstay fee on chargers, it will make some. More importantly it will incent people to free up stations, allowing more people to use them.

 

[BerTX]

I'd like to see more SUperchargers around the Vancouver, BC area and Vancouver Island, namely Victoria and Nanaimo.

Looks like Nanaimo is on the 2017 map.

 

[snort]

I think the single best thing about EVs is waking up every morning with a fully charged car.

I think we need to adjust the world so that people who live in apartments or need to park on the street have options too. The solution for apartment dwellers is obvious. I paid to get a 14-50 put in my condo and helped the electrician put it in....and it wasn't all that hard. most of the work was with the utility company, getting the meter activated. making those commonplace--even mandatory for new construction--will go a long way to solve the problem. I've experimented with charge rates. for anything less than a 90 mile day, 240V16A (e.g. NEMA 6-20) is adequate, although more is better.

I think we need to convince city planning commissions and councils that residential areas that are primarily on-street only parking should also have frequent charging bollards...e.g. J1772, and that they need to enforce EV only parking in such places. since such places are invariably strapped for parking, this could get a little complicated politically. A lot of private parking lots have done this already.

The same is true for stores and restaurants. A bunch have them now. we've had quite a lot of trouble with some of the providers failing to keep their chargers in working order. I think we're on the cusp of a big transformation. The model 3 and the Bolt will change a lot and I think we'll soon see J1772s so commonplace that there's little need to use plugshare to track one down. If the first you see is busy or broken, go across the street and there'll be another. A few groups have had the insight that the cost of the electricity is small enough that it's not worth the cost and hassle of billing to use it. (special kudos for Plug-In North Central Washington). (e.g. the electricity for a 240V30A J1772 costs about $1 per hour.) I think we'll see more of this.

 

[snort]

I put this in another group a few months ago. this is a more appropriate place.

The biggest 20 US cities:
NYC: 1 supercharger within city limits 9 within 35 miles.
L.A. no superchargers in the city but 9 in the basin, all within 50 miles
Chicago: one within the city, 4 in the metro area
Houston: none in the city, one 17 miles from downtown.
Philadelphia: none in the city, 2 within 40 miles.
Phoenix: none in the city, 4 within 35 miles
San Antonio: nearest is 45 miles
San Diego: nearest is 17 miles,
Dallas: nearest is 45 miles, one is going in midway to Ft Worth
San Jose: none in the city, 3 within 15 miles
Austin: nearest is 35 miles
Jacksonville: 2 within 35 miles
San Francisco: Nearest is 21 miles, 7 within 40
Indianapolis: one in the city
Columbus: one in the city
Fort Worth: one is going in in the city
Charlotte: one in the city
Seattle: nearest is 70 miles
Denver: 2 in the city
El Paso: nearest is 270 miles

So: Seattle is indeed the biggest city without a supercharger within 70 miles. If you sort by size of Metro Statistical Area, the disparity becomes even worse. Seattle at #15 is the only MSA without a supercharger in the top 20, and Seattle, Portland, San Antonio and Austin are the only ones without in the top 50: and the distance to Seattle's nearest is almost double the distance the others need to drive.

It looks like they're working on I-10 and I-20 and may have a supercharger in El Paso before long.