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TSLA Market Action: 2018 Investor Roundtable

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Actually, it changes a lot, because it creates more demand for higher priced units. It's not just the number of customers that matters, but their willingness and ability to pay for cars as well.

Diesel sales are indeed collapsing in Europe:


And note that Diesel sales in Europe are mostly about better fuel economy. Diesel customers forced to buy high price gasoline again makes the contrast between EV charging costs and gasoline costs even stronger

Thanks.

On the topic of new ICE sales in Europe, I see that the sales material completely refrains from mentioning which models are diesel and which are gasoline - the most recent material I remember seeing was from Mercedes. Only on the exact model designation does a little 'd' indicate when it is diesel. And then there is some small print about meeting official emissions standards.

No longer any pride in pointing out the specific advantages of one over the other...
 
Just in case anyone still has any illusions left about the efficient markets hypothesis: oil reaches new highs ... TSLA drops 2 dollars ...

The price coupling between the two is exactly the other way around: to Tesla high oil prices are not a cost, but a competitive advantage! :D

Remember this is oil at $85 with a much stronger dollar. Back when oil was at $100-110 the euro was worth ~$1.30-1.35, now it's worth $1.15. In many currencies oil may now be at an all-time high.
 
While technically true, there's three major flaws in this line of argument:

1)

The problem with ICE automotive are the profit margins, which are atrociously low at 6%, which makes them fragile to even small fluctuations in demand.

I.e. they are only making 'dozens of billions of dollars in profit', because they have an even higher revenue base.

A comparatively small drop in demand can cripple them - as it did around 2009 when every U.S. car companies went bankrupt, except Ford and Tesla, because consumers mostly voluntarily reduced their consumption due to economic uncertainty and deleveraging:

fredgraph.png


And that was a temporary drop in demand everyone knew would recover within a couple of years - while the EV related drop in demand is going to be permanent, it's never going to recover once gone. 90%+ of the customers who buy Teslas never buy an ICE car, ever again.

2)

But it gets worse: to ICE carmakers every EV sale made is a lost ICE sale. So by converting to EVs they lose the profits from their highly optimized ICE products unexpectedly early, years before expected end of life, reducing margins and forcing eventual write-offs.

This creates a catch-22 problem: they rely on ICE sales and profits for their valuation and for the continuation of their business, but by reducing ICE sales they lose valuation. There's a lag of at least 3-5 years before they can mass-manufacture the entirely new technology - during which time they are exposed to the drop in demand, drop in valu

3)

ICE carmakers are new to the EV world, it's a largely new industry to them, where they don't know how to scale up and don't want to scale up due to problems #1 and #2.

So even if they enter the "we have to build EVs" phase, just about now, they are in a fundamentally disadvantageous position not just competitively but from a fundamental business model point of view.

And they cannot just change the business model, unless they are willing to write off hundreds of billions of dollars of ICE equipment within the next couple of years. So the only path they have forward is an expensive, painful 'conversion' and dual-technology ICE/EV manufacturing process - which might or might not work out in the end, plus they have to hope ICE demand doesn't deteriorate.

All of the above plus access to batteries. They're not made of air (yet).
 
They are not banned from shorting, they can still add SELL LIMIT orders $0.01 above the bid to short as much as they want to, and will grow their short positions when the orders are hit.

What they are banned from today are price-aggressive orders that decrease the price actively (and artificially), such as market/stop orders and limit orders below the bid.

Otherwise I agree with you: I don't think today's price action was driven by shorts, other than short covering early in the day.

My mistake. Thanks for the clarification.
 
I prefer they double check it 10x before release. This is too big to get it wrong.
I agree 100% with this. Tesla is under such a microscope that they need to be flawless in all accounting. Also need to make sure a delivery specialist isn't trying to look good, by sneaking in deliveries that didn't happen before midnight. It is just an estimate and they do correct it, often by a few cars for the quarterly report.
 
Remember this is oil at $85 with a much stronger dollar. Back when oil was at $100-110 the euro was worth ~$1.30-1.35, now it's worth $1.15. In many currencies oil may now be at an all-time high.
Diesel over here (UK) is £1.34 X1.3 ($\£) per litre x number of litres/ US gallon and you get the picture. Approx 58% of this is tax to HMG. And people complain about oil companies and producer countries when it goes up, whose robbing who ?
 
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