Upgrade to FSD before increase?

[vsansal]

I just purchased EAP couple of weeks back and to me that's more then enough. It is so much fun driving this car, I am afraid if I was to upgrade to FSD I would never drive to justify the money I need to pay. Even with EAP, I don't even bother driving anymore on the highway, at least now I have to drive in the city. That being said, i have immediately edited my cybertruck order to include FSD to lock down the price. God knows how much it will be then.

 

[andy92782]

Tesla already suckered me into paying $5,500+tax for EAP. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice....

Autopilot: Yeah, it works sort of, if you're okay with not being terrified by phantom braking.
Navigate on Autopilot? Absolutely terrifying
Summon: Zero value. I can back into my garage easily on my own.
Autopark: Less than Zero value. Do I really want it to curb rash my wheels?

 

[Thp3]

The true value of FSD is in safe driving. If car accidents are reduced then the cost is worth it. In my driving experiences, I’ve seen many accidents happening in front of me. They were most often accidents of oversight where the driver was looking the wrong way. FSD could eliminate those accidents.

If that happens, insurance with FSD will cost less.

So what is it worth to avoid a dangerous accident? Driving might be the most dangerous activity people do. I love the idea that eight cameras and four ultrasonic sensors and one radar sensor with a custom computer are helping me use the car.

yeah, I bought FSD...

 

[andy92782]

The correct answer to FSD is: HELL NO

I'm not paying $10,000 to be a beta tester. Tesla should be paying ME for risking my own property from damage (or worse) in exchange for monitoring the system when it's active and providing them with NN training data.

FSD will be worth it when the following conditions are met:
- FSD works everywhere, in all conditions, on all paved roads, no restrictions
- Tesla covers all liability when FSD active
- Tesla indemnifies me from traffic violations when FSD active

Basically what I'm saying is this: I should be able to drive to a bar, get sh*tfaced, stumble back to my Tesla, get in the BACK SEAT, and instruct it to drive me home all without having to worry about getting into a collision or being arrested for DUI. Until then... no thx.

 

[Thp3]

The related question is: Will FSD ever be cheaper than $10k? If it works everywhere, won’t Transportation-as-a-Service with apps be the main method? So maybe five years? In five years will people buy cars or just pay for Tesla Network trips? Estimates are that it will cost $0.25 per mile or $25k for 100,000 miles. Not many people will buy cars at that price comparison.

So FSD has to pay for its costs over the next five years. It can do so by; reducing accidents, allowing relaxing long distance travel in all weather, eliminating traffic tickets and allowing for smooth stress free travel in High traffic areas.

if FSD fully works, then it’s value for commercial travel will skyrocket and personal car ownership will plummet. Yeah, it’s fun to drive a Tesla, but if I can pay less and drink alcohol in the passenger seat while traveling. Yeah that’s what will happen.

My history is keeping a car for ten years. So my current Teslas are likely the last cars I will ever buy. I’m enjoying the drive, the cars and the development of FSD.

 

[Chanceofthat]

Got the $5,000 EAP in the 2018 DM LR M3 and enjoyed it greatly on cross-country trips, also love it in rush hour stop & go. Don't use it at all in-city. Recently upgraded to HW 3 for $3000, so a total of $8000 for F$D.

I remember having the "We need to get the keys from Dad now that he's 85..." talk with the family. My main motivation for the $8000 expenditure is to keep my freedom and mobility as long as possible and spare the children that "We gotta get those keys" intervention. I'm only 65 now, so there should be time for the technology to mature by the time I really need it.
The other reason I went for it is I realized I was going to own "one of those Teslas" that didn't have the hardware and stopped getting updates because of the limited capabilities with HW2.5. I hate getting left behind...

Was this during the last sale or something? Or more recently? I’m in a similar spot where I have EAP, and I want HW 3.0 so that I get all the updates, but I’m looking at another $5k which seems a tad unfair.

 

[P3dStealth]

Guys so far all it turns

Price increase has been pushed to Thursday next week. FSD Subscription coming next year.

So that means FSD isn't expected to be worth a subscription until at least next year. We will watch a year of selected youtubers screaming about it first.

 

[Fernand]

Yawn to all the naysayers. First you said "no autopilot voodoo for me". Then it was "of course I want the AP, but that's it". Then you started into "all I want is lane change on request". Next it became "NOA sure, but on subscription". Now it's "EAP is enough, I'll wait 10 years before FSD is worth anything". Well, hang on to your seats, it's all happening faster than anyone thought possible.

I'm not taken with the need for street level NOA, I'm in no rush, because freeway NOA is more important. But I'm sure glad I have the complete (FSD) Tesla package, and get to watch it evolve. If you can afford a Tesla, you want the whole thing.
.

 

[Arctic_White]

OK. I will take the bait. I use my wife as my FSD. OK return on investment is never
great with a partner, Voice control works well and I can mix my drinks in the back seat.
When I can send my car to get a whopper and a 6 pack of beer then we have something.
Sorry what is the question ?

Your username checks out: you HAVE had one too many. LOL.

 

[P3dStealth]

My biggest concern is I think in 3 years I will want to upgrade to the next gen tesla. The way these cars are being upgraded I don't think my model 3 is going to have fsd the same way a model 3 in 2023 will. There is already word of a new long range radar being added to the model 3 also hw4 is going to be significantly more powerful than hw3.

So if I buy this for 8k with the hope I get to use it next year. Will I be happy about spending that when I trade it in??

 

[GTIceman]

My biggest concern is I think in 3 years I will want to upgrade to the next gen tesla. The way these cars are being upgraded I don't think my model 3 is going to have fsd the same way a model 3 in 2023 will. There is already word of a new long range radar being added to the model 3 also hw4 is going to be significantly more powerful than hw3.

So if I buy this for 8k with the hope I get to use it next year. Will I be happy about spending that when I trade it in??

Welcome to Tesla. It's not just a car, it's the latest greatest tech chase. ::sarcasm::

But honestly when I got my S, not two weeks later, AP2 was announced.

 

[Fernand]

The $8K or $10K full automation package are viable choices for people who buy a car now. They can FINANCE it, like other options, like the dual-motor long range option, or the Performance option. For the Tesla buyer who "just drives", who could be happy with SR+ range and RWD, adding more automation to reduce fatigue is a practical option -> $46k. (A skilled speed/power driver might be more of a manual only Model P buyer ).

It's tougher for people who already have a 1 or 2 year old Model 3, because $8K, let alone $10k, in CASH is more painful.

I think that's where the "subscription" idea comes from - as a way to finance adding automation. People who think they will beat Tesla by turning FSD on and off day by day, or week by week for this or that trip, are probably dreaming. I don't think that will ever come to pass. Why not enable the rear seat heaters only when your kids are in them?
.

 

[andy92782]

Hmm, great advice for new folks. "Here, you can finance that $10K, and pay taxes on it, and interest, and DMV fees, and um, oh by the way, it doesn't really exist, nor will it for years to come. But thanks for your support!!"

 

[Maven]

The service needs to become transferable to a new or replaced vehicle at this point. (Or say, within 7-10 years of payment)

10k is silly for what it is now. Moving to a subscription service makes more sense at this point. My guess is, subscriptions would be way down after trying it. (Currently)

I have it, it’s cool but nothing more than EAP really still.

 

[Fernand]

Yeah, yeah, not much more than EAP as of last Tuesday. But people who have basic AP don't have EAP, i.e. they don't have freeway FSD (from on-ramp to off-ramp) that we drive all the time. The question that the OP was asking was whether it's worth buying this next level of automation now. If you're ordering a Model 3 now, IMHO you just might want to.

Because looking at the clips that just came out yesterday, if you can overlook the annoying narration & music, it looks like Tesla has been quietly perfecting the big re-write with street level NOA, and have carried it much further than anyone would have guessed. Kind of like SpaceX self-landing boosters beating giant Boeing, on both time and cost, to everyone's amazement. Y'all "not for years to come" folks, watch what Elon Musk has done here, and what happens over the next 2 months, as he's announced general availability at the beta level by the end of the year.

If you wanna say "yes but beta", note that all of Tesla's automation that we drive every day is tagged "beta". IMHO it will never be "final". It's going to stay "under development" as it learns and matures.
.

 

[Eddie1218]

FSD is officially out of what I am willing to spend on it. I don't trust it to drive around city streets, Will pay for NOA with the promise that Tesla will perfect the AP suite for Highway driving.

 

[Fernand]

I keep seeing this understandable reaction, and I wish I could help the people who try NOA for a bit and are "terrified". I was very nervous at first, and in truth it took me weeks to understand it and learn to use it well. It's a different way to drive. A lot like how you fly and land a modern jet-liner: you give instructions and pay attention, you monitor, and let the machine do the low level stuff. If I had had someone to show me, it would have been much easier.

But, dude, trust me, the NOA system on freeways is amazing. All the people who use it every day aren't here debating. Stay awake, of course, crazy human error happens all the time, but it's pointless to drive in manual, it handles all the basics way better than a human driver. And in critical situations it reacts way faster.

It will now be going through the same stages it went through on the freeways, learning to operate on city streets.
.

 

[dmurphy]

Amazed that nobody’s mentioned this snippet from the Q3 earnings call:

“Martin Viecha: Okay. Thank you very much. The third question from retail is, would FSD be able to be transferred to our next vehicle or pay a transfer fee? It would add a broad -- it would add to a brand loyalty. In the same way, gaming companies and cellphone companies keep you in their ecosystem by letting new transfer purchases to upgraded hardware?

Elon Musk: Yes. We'll give it some thought.”

So let me pose this question: if you could buy FSD for $10k, knowing you could transfer it to another vehicle for, say, a $1000 transfer fee, would you?

I would, without hesitation. Heck, I’m in $12k already anyway between the 3 & X. And I’d do it all over again tomorrow.

 

[garth_angst]

After seeing the videos so far, this is the first time I'd really push for people to buy before the price increase. This looks insanely impressive. Does it mean you'll be sleeping on your way to work in a year? No. But you'll be doing a heck of a lot less driving than you do now.

I love driving my car. That's the fun part of it. Why would I want to take that out of my hands and just be a passenger? I would not even buy if for $3000.

 

[P3dStealth]

Yes I would buy it if it transfered like a software license.