v7.1 beta testing begins (Driver Mode, Self Parking, AP restrictions)

[Discoducky]

My thought is that it is less wear and tear on the other handles that I hopefully won't have to replace as soon (says the owner of an early VIN with original assemblies and nearly 50K miles)

 

[Andyw2100]

I think this new option will be useful to some people, and people who don't want it won't use it. But at least Tesla listened to its customers. We should be appreciative of that fact and encourage that behavior in the future.

As long as it is a CHOICE I'm cool with it.

I should have stressed this more in my original post.

What I meant that we should be most appreciative of is Tesla listening, and providing two different options, allowing us to choose the option that works better for us. Any extra option that makes more people happy, without taking anything away from users who don't want anything to change, is a plus.

Whenever possible, Tesla should try to make changes this way--by providing additional options and additional settings--as opposed to making changes that they believe will make a majority of people happy, but that may make some other group unhappy because it took something away.

Choice is good!

 

[S4WRXTTCS]

Based on my experience, the time based nag works like this:

1) On roads with curves the car can detect whether or not your hands are on the wheel because of the torque they apply
2) On straight roads the car either cannot detect it or ignores it
3) When the car is looking for hand torque (such as on curvy roads or possibly other sub-optimal conditions), a timer is started and continues to count down while the car is in the mode of looking for torque. The timer pauses if you re-enter a clear road with no curves and continues when you hit curves again. When it expires, the nag pops up. At any point you can forcibly apply torque to the wheel and reset it. This reset works on straight road, curvy road, when the nag is on screen, or before it pops up.

I just did a long road trip and the time interval was very predictable through curves...I should have used a stopwatch to get some hard data On straight roads I can drive for a longggggg time with no nag but curves definitely trigger a predictable nag. For you SW guys out there, you can almost see the code for this - it's a great way of minimizing the intrusion to the driver when not needed.

Anyhow, that's just my experience in my car...YMMV.

This exactly mirrors my own experience. Although I'm not sure if during a corner it's the degree of the corner, or some timing issue. At any rate given enough of a corner it will ask you to put your hands on the wheel.

On straight roads it only seems to nag if it really needs you to take the wheel.

In V7 I'm completely happy with how it works, and it has never caused me any issues. I don't believe Tesla can even implement a time nagged since the steering wheel (on straight roads) simply can't detect your hand unless you provide torque. It doesn't use a touch sensor. It requires actual movement in either direction. If you taped two coke cans (of equal weight) on either end of the steering wheel it would not detect them.

- - - Updated - - -

Even limiting minimum speed to 45mph is bad. I'm using AP in bumper-to-bumper traffic all the time.

There seems to be a lot of confusion about this because people aren't reading the linked article that was posted by the OP of this thread.

"At the time, Musk didn’t specify what the new constraints could be, but today we learn through reports from Model S owners that Tesla now restricts the auto-steering feature of the Autopilot to 45 mph (72 km/h) on roads other than highways."

That to me says on roads that are not highways/freeways the speed is limited to 45MPH.

It does not impact highways/freeways at all, and that remains completely unchanged.

Am I missing something? Because it seems really reasonable to me.

 

[green1]

user manual, page 71:

Autosteer uses data from the camera, sensors,and GPS system to determine where to drive.It also requires you to hold the steering wheel. When entering a curve if Autosteer does not detect your hands on the steering wheel, it displays the following message on the instrument panel and eventually sounds a chime,

This is followed by a picture of the "hold steering wheel" message.
Not a timed nag. This is because the AP can't see around corners very well and wants to ensure that you are doing so.

- - - Updated - - -

That to me says on roads that are not highways/freeways the speed is limited to 45MPH.

It does not impact highways/freeways at all, and that remains completely unchanged.

Am I missing something? Because it seems really reasonable to me.

Yes, you are missing that there is no possible way for the car to currently know if it is on a highway/freeway. It can't do it by speed limit because it constantly gets those wrong. It can't do it by nav mapping, because that's notoriously awful. It can't do it by lane markings because AP has to work with only one line sometimes anyway, so that's the same as many of the other roads.
If the car can't tell if I'm on a highway reliably, how is it going to know when to restrict me without frequently restricting me when I'm on a highway/freeway?

 

[Cyberax]

That to me says on roads that are not highways/freeways the speed is limited to 45MPH.
It does not impact highways/freeways at all, and that remains completely unchanged.
Am I missing something? Because it seems really reasonable to me.

And that does NOT seem reasonable to me. I'm using Tesla AP all the time on two-lane roads with 55-65mph speed limits.

Oh, and Tesla's road sign recognition is also awfully bad in Oregon.

 

[lennier]

And that does NOT seem reasonable to me. I'm using Tesla AP all the time on two-lane roads with 55-65mph speed limits.

Oh, and Tesla's road sign recognition is also awfully bad in Oregon.

When Tesla explicitly state that current beta Autopilot is intended for use on divided highways only then it seems perfectly reasonable to me that they restrict its use on roads that don't meet that criteria. People may not like it, but it can hardly be called unreasonable.

 

[Cyberax]

When Tesla explicitly state that current beta Autopilot is intended for use on divided highways only then it seems perfectly reasonable to me that they restrict its use on roads that don't meet that criteria. People may not like it, but it can hardly be called unreasonable.

I fail to see where it's said that it's required to be used on the divided roads only.

 

[MarkS22]

So, will 7.1 require the eight-camera Autopilot 2.0 Hardware coming out in the next two weeks? :wink:

 

[gsxdsm]

So, will 7.1 require the eight-camera Autopilot 2.0 Hardware coming out in the next two weeks? :wink:

4 weeks man, 4 weeks ;-)

 

[S4WRXTTCS]

And that does NOT seem reasonable to me. I'm using Tesla AP all the time on two-lane roads with 55-65mph speed limits.

Oh, and Tesla's road sign recognition is also awfully bad in Oregon.

No it works perfect.

It see's the sign that says 65, but it realizes its in Oregon. So it just fudges a bit to better match Oregon drivers. So that's why 65=85 in Oregon.



What does work better in Oregon (at least on I5 in sections) is the autopilot doesn't dive for the exits because Oregon has dashed lines giving it lines to follow. And not just empty space on the right.

 

[brianman]

No it works perfect.

It see's the sign that says 65, but it realizes its in Oregon. So it just fudges a bit to better match Oregon drivers. So that's why 65=85 in Oregon.



What does work better in Oregon (at least on I5 in sections) is the autopilot doesn't dive for the exits because Oregon has dashed lines giving it lines to follow. And not just empty space on the right.

I saw a few of the opposite (seeing 80/85 as 60/65) on a trip through WA, OR, ID, UT, AR, NV.

Also, if you have "speed limit XX; truck limit YY" followed by "truck limit ZZ" often AP would show XX as the speed limit and then ZZ. (The ZZ is wrong.)

 

[dirkhh]

I knew you didn't mean it, but was hoping otherwise...maybe v7.1 will have an effect.

Having now had a chance to review the release notes for 7.1 - nope, don't expect it to have an effect.

Err, wait, let me rephrase that. Having had a few too many beers with another TMC member (or was it one glass of sparkling wine? I forget) and then hitting my head repeatedly on something I had a weird vision of PDF files and what I could see in those files, err, I mean in that vision, didn't impress me one bit. They are once again taking away something that I use all the time. But I digress.

Where was I?

 

[LetsGoFast]

K

Really? I live here and I don't understand. That's okay, I don't have to, I'm glad people are getting what they want.

Clearly people want this feature, so I'm glad they are getting it. I do think it solves a completely imaginary problem.

 

[WillinVA]

I have seen it a couple ways now, so is AP being restricted to only highway driving? Like a glorified cruise control? Or is it just being restricted on certain roads to a max of 45mph?

I just ordered the car - gets delivered in a week - and a major reason I got the car was because of AP. I want to be able to use it in stop and go traffic. That is a key feature and I specifically asked the dealer about AP being taken away via software upgrades when I test drove the car. I was reassured that it would not happen. I feel like this would be a bait and switch if it is restricted to highway driving only.

 

[stevezzzz]

I saw a few of the opposite (seeing 80/85 as 60/65) on a trip through WA, OR, ID, UT, AR, NV.

Also, if you have "speed limit XX; truck limit YY" followed by "truck limit ZZ" often AP would show XX as the speed limit and then ZZ. (The ZZ is wrong.)

And then there are the signs that read "min speed NN", which also confuse the system.

 

[kirkbauer]

Clearly people want this feature, so I'm glad they are getting it. I do think it solves a completely imaginary problem.

Which feature are we talking about, the driver-only door handle feature?

It is an obvious security concern in any country for all doors to unlock, and arguably even more so when the handle slides out to show that it is unlocked. An attacker of some sort can hide on the passenger side of the vehicle where you don't see them. You unlock the doors and as you are getting in they also get in and carjack you (or rob, rape, or murder you). I believe it was an easy tactic back when cars had power locks that always opened all doors.

Every country has crime so even if you think you live in a safer country it can still happen.

 

[Soolim]

Which feature are we talking about, the driver-only door handle feature?

It is an obvious security concern in any country for all doors to unlock, and arguably even more so when the handle slides out to show that it is unlocked. An attacker of some sort can hide on the passenger side of the vehicle where you don't see them. You unlock the doors and as you are getting in they also get in and carjack you (or rob, rape, or murder you). I believe it was an easy tactic back when cars had power locks that always opened all doors.

Every country has crime so even if you think you live in a safer country it can still happen.

Interim measure is to disable auto-present handle. Enhance feature will be selectable auto-present handle.

 

[yobigd20]

I have seen it a couple ways now, so is AP being restricted to only highway driving? Like a glorified cruise control? Or is it just being restricted on certain roads to a max of 45mph?

I just ordered the car - gets delivered in a week - and a major reason I got the car was because of AP. I want to be able to use it in stop and go traffic. That is a key feature and I specifically asked the dealer about AP being taken away via software upgrades when I test drove the car. I was reassured that it would not happen. I feel like this would be a bait and switch if it is restricted to highway driving only.

they have always been clear on day 1 and in manual and in their many many public statements that autopilot is for highway only, not for residential roads. so there is no bait and switch here. it should never have been allowed to use on local or residential roads in the first place.

 

[Max*]

they have always been clear on day 1 and in manual and in their many many public statements that autopilot is for highway only, not for residential roads. so there is no bait and switch here. it should never have been allowed to use on local or residential roads in the first place.

Not entirely true. EM said it would work on clearly marked [non-highways]. (I forget the term he used, city streets maybe?).

But I agree that the main intent was always highways.

 

[Mike Strauss]

I'm excited for the new update, especially the updated parking features. I hope they keep their january release date. i guess we'll have to wait until the update comes out to see if it affects the stock. most investors seem to be excited https://www.tipranks.com/stocks/tsla