Why do people really want Tesla to fail?

[CapeOne]

Obviously as Tesla sells more cars there will be a greater number of problems and more people posting about them. That doesn't mean the company as a whole is having more problems or going downhill, in fact the company is in better shape today than ever before in it's history, yet the media creates the opposite impression. Elon and Co. do not need a thicker skin, they are rightfully speaking out about inaccurate reporting.

In addition to more customer issues, there seems to have been a lot more "new" or growing (?) issues for Tesla as a company over the past several months. I typically don't follow Tesla the company that closely (don't own any stock) but:

• How often has Tesla recalled over 120,000 vehicles?
• How often has a Tesla been in a fatal accident with AP engaged?
• How often has Tesla’s credit rating been downgraded by Moody’s?
• How often has Tesla reported losses of more than $700 million in a quarter?
• Although they changed their mind since, how often has (had) a Tesla model failed to get a “recommended” rating by CR?
• How often has Tesla stock "performed" so opposite (in a bad away) of NASDAQ? Since September 2017 (Tesla's all-time high), Tesla has dropped around 25% and the NASDAQ has climbed around 16%.

 

[JRP3]

In addition to more customer issues, there seems to have been a lot more "new" or growing (?) issues for Tesla as a company over the past several months. I typically don't follow Tesla the company that closely

Which would seem to put you in a poor position to determine any change in their status, no?

• How often has Tesla recalled over 120,000 vehicles?

Recalls are quite standard in the auto industry, this one was a minor issue. Tesla has had previous recalls.

• How often has a Tesla been in a fatal accident with AP engaged?

May 7 2016 Self-Driving Tesla Was Involved in Fatal Crash, U.S. Says

• How often has Tesla’s credit rating been downgraded by Moody’s?

At least once before.

• How often has Tesla reported losses of more than $700 million in a quarter?

They've had increasing losses the last 6 quarters and 17Q4 was also over $700 million, so that's not really anything new.

• Although they changed their mind since, how often has (had) a Tesla model failed to get a “recommended” rating by CR?

I think each Tesla vehicle failed to get a "recommended" rating by CR at some point.

• How often has Tesla stock "performed" so opposite (in a bad away) of NASDAQ? Since September 2017 (Tesla's all-time high), Tesla has dropped around 25% and the NASDAQ has climbed around 16%.

That's simply a reflection of the excessive negative reporting which we are discussing.

 

[CapeOne]

That's simply a reflection of the excessive negative reporting which we are discussing.

If Tesla had not seen such a significant jump in quarterly losses starting in Q3 2017, the stock would be performing much better. Tesla losses jumped to more than $600 million that quarter (hadn't been above $350 million before that) and have only increased since. Other things like not meeting stated production goals, Elon's "production hell", etc. have hurt too. Growing pains hurt and Tesla is seeing that first hand as they are being tested with their first high volume vehicle. Blaming the media is just petty.

 

[JRP3]

Tesla has always faced difficult problems starting with the Roadster days when the company almost went bankrupt. Tesla is in much better shape today but you'd never know that from the reporting. No one is saying Tesla doesn't have problems but there is no question that inaccurate negative reporting has served to multiply the perception of those problems. There has always been an amount of inaccurate negative reporting about Tesla, it's just increased to a frightening level. Bad reporting should always be called out, and that's why we blame the media when they get it wrong.

 

[Barklikeadog]

That's simply a reflection of the excessive negative reporting which we are discussing.

You think the drop in stock price was due to reporting and not due to the inability to manufacture a car which would make or break the company???

This was predictable! 5,000 cars by the end of the year, 10,000 per week in 2018, Tesla will produce 400,000 Model 3s in 2018!!!
People here are excusing any delays, or saying that the 'underdeliver' is baked into the stock price.

It was not. How many Model 3s have been produced? Bloomberg tracks it at just under 33,000.
According to the Tesla plan last year, they should be well over 100,000 produced at this point.
70,000 cars X the sticker price.... Ouch. Even pessimists expected a better showing than this.
and the stock crashes under that realization

 

[JRP3]

You think the drop in stock price was due to reporting and not due to the inability to manufacture a car which would make or break the company???

You think the drop in stock price was only due to the lag in production??? No one is denying that Tesla failed to meet production targets, they never do, so that's not a new phenomenon. The huge volume of inaccurate and misleading press is.

 

[Peteski]

The big corporate investors are in this for the long haul and well aware of current production issues. They are not that stupid. The popular media are just click bait trolls. Very little they ever report on is accurate or unbiased on any subject. Yet plebs believe everything they read, especially if it supports their own preconceived ideas. We live in an age of junk reporting, but dig deeper and you can often find more credible information.

 

[Barklikeadog]

You think the drop in stock price was only due to the lag in production??? No one is denying that Tesla failed to meet production targets, they never do, so that's not a new phenomenon. The huge volume of inaccurate and misleading press is.

lag in production? We are talking about a shortfall this half of the year of 70,000 vehicles with a $50k+ sticker price.
The big boys aren't worried about an autopilot crash, they want to see products rolling off the line and money coming in.

 

[copyhacker]

Tesla has always faced difficult problems starting with the Roadster days when the company almost went bankrupt. Tesla is in much better shape today but you'd never know that from the reporting. No one is saying Tesla doesn't have problems but there is no question that inaccurate negative reporting has served to multiply the perception of those problems. There has always been an amount of inaccurate negative reporting about Tesla, it's just increased to a frightening level. Bad reporting should always be called out, and that's why we blame the media when they get it wrong.

I wonder if what the public sees as bias or negativity the media sees as “narrative” or “angle”. Good journalism tells a story. However, the story should serve the facts, not the other way around. When there’s a good story, I imagine the temptation to cherry-pick the facts to suit the story is very high, and I’m sure they know that.

I remember hearing in one of the recent popular true-crime podcasts that police detectives look for a suspect they “like” for a crime, and then they build a case against that suspect—they generally stop exploring alternatives. The same thing seems to be going on with the media and Tesla.

 

[JRP3]

lag in production? We are talking about a shortfall this half of the year of 70,000 vehicles with a $50k+ sticker price.

Yes, lag in production, as I said. Tesla is 6 months behind, they are always behind, that's not new. Expecting them to be on time when they never are would suggest poor research on the part of those caught unaware. Regardless vehicle production is not the only metric used to rate the company and the media has been reporting on much more than production.

 

[CapeOne]

There has always been an amount of inaccurate negative reporting about Tesla, it's just increased to a frightening level. Bad reporting should always be called out, and that's why we blame the media when they get it wrong.

Calling out the media for inaccurate reporting is fine but suggesting that Tesla’s stock price decline is "SIMPLY" a reflection of the excessive negative reporting is nonsense. That would be kind of like a sports team blaming losses and declining attendance solely on the negative media coverage. The media didn't cause Tesla to lose over $600 million in each of the last three quarters, the media didn't cause Tesla's production misses/issues, etc. etc.

 

[JRP3]

Fair enough, my use of "simply" was just sloppy writing. Of course it's a combination of Tesla having actual problems and the constant onslaught of media negativity beyond what they deserve.

 

[Electroman]

The huge volume of inaccurate and misleading press is.

And the outright lying.

Like in the case AP suit that Tesla settled, it was reported by almost all outfits as a settlement on AP poor safety. Although the fact is the case was against late delivery of AP features.

 

[Electroman]

The huge volume of inaccurate and misleading press is.

And the outright lying.

Like in the case AP suit that Tesla settled, it was reported by almost all outfits as a settlement on AP poor safety. Although the fact is the case was against late delivery of AP features.

 

[CapeOne]

Fair enough, my use of "simply" was just sloppy writing. Of course it's a combination of Tesla having actual problems and the constant onslaught of media negativity beyond what they deserve.

Thank you, but it's comments like your original "That's simply...." (and worse) which turn some people against Tesla and is what I was getting at in my first post in this thread. I have seen far too many Tesla fans/supporters wanting to blame everyone or everything else for Tesla’s problems. It's not Tesla’s fault the stock is down, it's just the media's or the haters'. It's not Tesla’s fault they keep missing production numbers, it's just the media's or the haters'. It's not Tesla's fault their credit rating was downgraded, it's just the media's or the haters'. You can’t blame Tesla for this or that, they're just a new company. And so on. It’s like Tesla can do no wrong but when they do it must be someone or something else's fault

It is why people like myself fall into the "the problem is not with the 'message' (electric cars and tech), it's with the 'messengers' (fanatics)" camp.

 

[JRP3]

It is why people like myself fall into the "the problem is not with the 'message' (electric cars and tech), it's with the 'messengers' (fanatics)" camp.

Yet that's just the opposite side of the exact error you're complaining about. You're assigning all the "problem" to the "fanatics" when the problem is multifaceted. As I stated previously if the media weren't so often inaccurate the "fanatics" wouldn't have anything to react against. And lets not pretend that there aren't large groups of people who simply hate Tesla and everything they stand for out there being just as bad or worse than the "fanatics".

 

[BozieBeMe2]

Thank you, but it's comments like your original "That's simply...." (and worse) which turn some people against Tesla and is what I was getting at in my first post in this thread. I have seen far too many Tesla fans/supporters wanting to blame everyone or everything else for Tesla’s problems. It's not Tesla’s fault the stock is down, it's just the media's or the haters'. It's not Tesla’s fault they keep missing production numbers, it's just the media's or the haters'. It's not Tesla's fault their credit rating was downgraded, it's just the media's or the haters'. You can’t blame Tesla for this or that, they're just a new company. And so on. It’s like Tesla can do no wrong but when they do it must be someone or something else's fault

It is why people like myself fall into the "the problem is not with the 'message' (electric cars and tech), it's with the 'messengers' (fanatics)" camp.

Most people are inherntly lazy and are not willing to do their own research. They seemed to be very quick to jump, to conclusions, and solutions.
Just take the time to ask;

Who stands to gain,
What do they stand to gain,
How will this effect me.

From what I have seen recently, it is a thinnly veiled Pump & Dump P/R machine.
Some one stands to gain and some one stands to lose.
As for me, I look at the sum of the parts and so far, I like where Tesla is headed and how affects my world.

 

[CapeOne]

Yet that's just the opposite side of the exact error you're complaining about. You're assigning all the "problem" to the "fanatics" when the problem is multifaceted. As I stated previously if the media weren't so often inaccurate the "fanatics" wouldn't have anything to react against. And lets not pretend that there aren't large groups of people who simply hate Tesla and everything they stand for out there being just as bad or worse than the "fanatics".

Not true! I’m not assigning all of the problem to the "fanatics." I never said all, simply due to, etc I am saying that some people dislike Tesla because of the Tesla fanatics, not because they are building BEVs, etc.

Tesla supporters can react to the "inaccurate" stories without saying things like Tesla’s stock decline, quarterly losses, production issues, customer complaints, etc. are just because of the media or the haters or whatever.

 

[CapeOne]

As for me, I look at the sum of the parts and so far, I like where Tesla is headed and how affects my world.

I like where Tesla has been and presumably will continue to be heading too, and hopefully soon with profits.

I also think it’s premature for people who don’t like or are uncomfortable with BEVs (for whatever reasons) to be concerned. BEVs still are and will for a while (even as other automakers start/expand BEV production) be a small part of the overall automotive world especially when you consider all of the current ICE vehicles out there. New or used, ICE vehicles will still be around in large numbers for a long time.

 

[JRP3]

Not true! I’m not assigning all of the problem to the "fanatics." I never said all, simply due to, etc I am saying that some people dislike Tesla because of the Tesla fanatics, not because they are building BEVs, etc.

Well you actually just said:

It is why people like myself fall into the "the problem is not with the 'message' (electric cars and tech), it's with the 'messengers' (fanatics)" camp.