150kW Supercharging for Model 3

[craigcabrey]

V2 superchargers were expected to be updated to 145 kW but after further software tweaks, they are able to achieve 150 kW and announced that that will be the new max on them.

Do you have a source on that? I don’t remember the blog post saying that (and don’t recall any Elon tweets of the sort).

Edit: looks like they’re right: Tesla unlocks even more power (150 kW) out of existing Superchargers, expands rollout

Never been happier to stand corrected

 

[Zoomit]

V2 charging equipment doesn’t support 150 kW, they go up to 145 kW. The 150 kW peak rate is much more relevant to EU owners that have access to third party DCFC networks (such as the hypercharger).

Yet another reason we should be pressuring Tesla for a CCS adapter.

It's very possible the V2 Supercharges cannot do more than 145kW but the release notes are market specific. So the expectation is that NA cars could "charge up to 150kW peak rates at Tesla Supercharger stations." Based on that statement, I inferred Tesla dialed up the peak Supercharger amps, maybe based on more constraining temperatures or durations.

@Silver Ghost reports that his LR battery was warm, having driven at ~80mph for an hour while also navigating to the SC. These are basically optimal conditions to heat the battery.

 

[smartypnz]

Ok, say you are using an unpaired SC and maxed out at 150 kW. What happens to the arriving car that plugs in to the pair?

 

[Big Earl]

Ok, say you are using an unpaired SC and maxed out at 150 kW. What happens to the arriving car that plugs in to the pair?

If you’re charging at 144 kW and someone else plugs in, you would drop to 108 kW and they would get 36 kW. Once you dropped below 72 due to the charging taper, the second person would get up to 72 kW. If you were below 36 kW due to taper, the second person would get up to 108 kW.

There are 12 chargers in the cabinet that are split into 4 groups of 3. Urban sites allocate 6 chargers per pedestal, while the regular sites (currently dubbed 120 kW) function as described above.

 

[willow_hiller]

@Zoomit first example of 12.1.1 on an SR I've seen in the wild: Just got 12.1 update.

No mention of the Supercharger speed in the changelog, but as you said earlier it's possible there are slight improvements even absent an explicit mention?

 

[hugh_jassol]

Mid-Range owner here. Got 12.1.1 last night - no mention of supercharging in the release notes. Not even on-route warm up.

Does anyone know what the mid-range profile is supposed to be?

 

[willow_hiller]

Mid-Range owner here. Got 12.1.1 last night - no mention of supercharging in the release notes. Not even on-route warm up.

Does anyone know what the mid-range profile is supposed to be?

I wonder if Tesla is doing some A/B testing within a single version number. We got 12.1.1 last night on an SR+ and the notes did mention battery warm up. I've also seen in another thread someone getting 12.1.1 from an older version and not getting No Confirm NOAP.

 

[hugh_jassol]

I wonder if Tesla is doing some A/B testing within a single version number. We got 12.1.1 last night on an SR+ and the notes did mention battery warm up. I've also seen in another thread someone getting 12.1.1 from an older version and not getting No Confirm NOAP.

Whoops sorry. I was wrong it does mention the warmup just not the 150kW

 

[Zoomit]

This TMC thread links to a video from Out of Spec Motoring of two LR cars charging at 120 kW and 150 kW. Here's a screen capture of the resulting profiles. (The source video was low quality, but you get the drift.)

I took some choice data points and added the profiles to my previous graph.

After a brief delay at 60kW, both cars ramped up to their peak within 3-4 minutes without any significant intermediate steps. The "150kW" peak was at 147kW but it tapered earlier than @Tz00 experienced. The "120kW" taper was later than "150kW" but it does seem to line up with the taper from @Tz00.

This is progress but we need more examples to really see what's possible on 12.1+. Keep it coming folks!

 

[hugh_jassol]

There was another video posed on reddit... the 150kW gets you to 50% much quicker, but in the end they reached 90% within a minute of each other. So when you need that quick boost to get you home or to the next supercharger, it will save time, but if you're one of the supercharger-as-a-way-of-life types, could be a wash depending on how often you charger

 

[Zoomit]

There was another video posed on reddit

Link? or better hint to find it? It sounds like the same video I linked to above.

 

[MarcG]

I charged my P3D+ this morning at a V2 supercharger in an unpaired stall, starting around 14% SoC, and got up to 148kW after a few minutes. My car was sitting in my garage overnight and I drove about 30 minutes to the SC while navigating to it, so it had time to warm up more if needed.

Funny that the miles per hour charged already showed 500 when power reached ~130kW, but didn’t increase beyond that as power kept going up. It reminds me of how the cars charging at the V3 launch event showed 1000mi/hr at a little below 250kW but stayed there no matter how power fluctuated.

I’m also attaching a table from Teslafi for this charge session, if anyone is interested in converting it to a chart or adding it to existing ones.

 

[Zoomit]

I’m also attaching a table from Teslafi for this charge session, if anyone is interested in converting it to a chart or adding it to existing ones.

Thanks @MarcG! Great summary. It looks like it stayed above 140kW until somewhere around 40-45%.

I would like to plot it but have a big favor. Can you repost the TeslaFi spreadsheet with the Charge Power data as well? You’d select “Edit Layout” to change or add a column then pick “Charge Power”.

 

[AustinPowers]

Never mind 150 kW charging. I have yet to experience charging rates higher than 100 kW! All my trips to SC's so far have yielded between 90 and 100 kW at maximum, and that was after driving for quite some time, warm temperatures, and no other cars at the SC. Usually charging from about 10% to 90% and twice, during a longer trip, to 100%.

I am reading quite a lot of reports of European Model 3 users not experiencing charging rates of more than 100 kW. Strange.

 

[MarcG]

Thanks @MarcG! Great summary. It looks like it stayed above 140kW until somewhere around 40-45%.

I would like to plot it but have a big favor. Can you repost the TeslaFi spreadsheet with the Charge Power data as well? You’d select “Edit Layout” to change or add a column then pick “Charge Power”.

Sure thing, here you go @Zoomit

 

[MarcG]

@Zoomit now that I'm at a computer, here's a text-based format from the table, if that's easier (sorry I was using my phone earlier):

Time Connection State Charging State Battery Level Charger Power Battery Range Charge Energy Added Charge Rate Usable Battery Level Charger Voltage Charger Actual Current Fast Charger Type Inside Temp Outside Temp
2019/05/01 10:27:45 AM online Starting 14 0 41.93 0.0 0.0 14 348 0 Tesla 24.2 18.5
2019/05/01 10:28:41 AM online Charging 14 79 44.04 0.52 323.6 14 346 0 Tesla 24.6 18.5
2019/05/01 10:29:45 AM online Charging 16 104 50.82 2.18 426.8 16 355 0 Tesla 25.0 18.5
2019/05/01 10:30:43 AM online Charging 19 140 58.44 4.05 500.0 19 364 0 Tesla 25.3 19.0
2019/05/01 10:31:50 AM online Charging 22 147 68.18 6.74 500.0 22 369 0 Tesla 25.6 19.0
2019/05/01 10:32:46 AM online Charging 25 148 77.08 8.92 500.0 25 372 0 Tesla 25.9 19.0
2019/05/01 10:33:50 AM online Charging 28 147 87.66 11.31 500.0 28 374 0 Tesla 26.2 19.0
2019/05/01 10:34:52 AM online Charging 31 148 97.4 13.59 500.0 31 376 0 Tesla 26.4 19.0
2019/05/01 10:35:53 AM online Charging 34 148 106.72 15.98 500.0 34 378 0 Tesla 26.7 19.0
2019/05/01 10:36:48 AM online Charging 37 147 116.04 18.26 500.0 37 380 0 Tesla 26.9 19.0
2019/05/01 10:37:46 AM online Charging 40 147 125.36 20.54 500.0 40 382 0 Tesla 27.1 19.0
2019/05/01 10:38:44 AM online Charging 44 143 133.83 22.93 500.0 43 384 0 Tesla 27.3 19.0
2019/05/01 10:39:44 AM online Charging 46 138 142.72 24.8 500.0 46 386 0 Tesla 27.5 19.0
2019/05/01 10:40:46 AM online Charging 49 129 152.46 27.18 500.0 49 387 0 Tesla 27.7 19.0
2019/05/01 10:41:49 AM online Charging 52 121 161.35 29.36 492.4 52 388 0 Tesla 27.5 19.0
2019/05/01 10:42:56 AM online Charging 55 110 169.82 31.44 450.4 55 388 0 Tesla 27.4 19.0
2019/05/01 10:43:47 AM online Charging 57 104 176.17 32.99 424.7 57 389 0 Tesla 27.4 19.0
2019/05/01 10:44:48 AM online Charging 59 96 182.53 34.76 390.7 59 389 0 Tesla 27.5 19.0
2019/05/01 10:45:50 AM online Charging 61 88 189.3 36.21 360.5 61 389 0 Tesla 27.6 19.0
2019/05/01 10:46:46 AM online Charging 63 84 195.23 37.56 342.1 63 390 0 Tesla 27.8 19.0
2019/05/01 10:47:47 AM online Charging 65 80 200.74 39.01 326.4 65 390 0 Tesla 27.9 19.0
2019/05/01 10:48:44 AM online Charging 66 76 205.4 40.15 309.5 66 391 0 Tesla 28.1 19.0
2019/05/01 10:49:48 AM online Charging 68 72 210.48 41.61 293.4 68 392 0 Tesla 28.2 19.0
2019/05/01 10:50:44 AM online Charging 70 68 215.56 42.64 279.6 70 393 0 Tesla 28.3 19.0
2019/05/01 10:51:44 AM online Charging 71 65 219.37 43.79 264.9 71 393 0 Tesla 28.5 19.0
2019/05/01 10:52:48 AM online Charging 72 62 224.45 44.93 253.6 72 395 0 Tesla 28.6 19.0
2019/05/01 10:53:50 AM online Charging 74 60 228.69 45.86 244.9 74 396 0 Tesla 28.8 19.0
2019/05/01 10:54:49 AM online Charging 75 58 232.92 46.9 238.1 75 397 0 Tesla 28.2 19.0
2019/05/01 10:55:46 AM online Charging 76 57 236.31 47.62 231.2 76 397 0 Tesla 25.1 19.0
2019/05/01 10:56:48 AM online Charging 77 53 240.12 48.66 217.1 77 398 0 Tesla 22.5 19.0
2019/05/01 10:57:45 AM online Charging 79 50 243.51 49.6 203.7 79 398 0 Tesla 22.7 19.0
2019/05/01 10:58:46 AM online Complete 80 0 246.9 50.43 0.0 80 2 0 Tesla 25.5 19.0

 

[adamtc4]

Looks like yours followed TZOOs charge curve a little closer than the other fellows. Looks much better than theirs.

 

[Zoomit]

Thanks again @MarcG! You're the current leader! That session had consistent 147-148kW power levels then a taper later than I have seen elsewhere. Along with your data, I've also included new data from u/Wugz on reddit and added the best V3 dataset I've seen from u/privaterbok.

It looks like the new 150kW V2 Supercharging profile does plateau close to 150kW but basically matches the previous taper with an inflection point around 85kW and 60%. Besides the early 250kW peak, the V3 demo profile had a ~5% later taper until they converge near 75%. If the V3 demo profile gets widely released as privaterbok recorded, it would likely result in a further improvement on V2 Superchargers by allowing a later, more linear taper starting near 46% instead of 42%.

 

[MarcG]

Thanks again @MarcG! You're the current leader! That session had consistent 147-148kW power levels then a taper later than I have seen elsewhere.

Hehe thanks, but I’m wondering if it’s not because my session started at a higher SoC than the others you have graphed so far?
So perhaps the ability to hold a high charge rate is not only a function of SoC, but also how long that high charge rate was maintained for.

 

[Tz00]

Can you repost the TeslaFi spreadsheet with the Charge Power data as well?

I didn't know you could add that column to TeslaFi. I always wondered why it wasn't shown. Here is mine. The previous data was me taking pictures of the charging screen while sitting in the car at the SC.