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2017 Investor Roundtable:General Discussion

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Musk achieves the impossible because he doesn't look at things as how they've always been done, etc, etc.. I've said this many times on Electrek, but long charge times and going 55mph in the right lane don't matter for freight if you don't have a driver, or if your driver gets to relax and watch movies while on the freeway, and only take over when getting off the freeway! If you have Level 4 autonomy on the freeway, then the driver can get paid an hourly wage while he's sitting around doing nothing, and then the normal "mileage" rate when in town. Eventually when it is all level 5, you can ditch the guy in the cab. These guys are too constrained by their conventional thinking. It blows my mind that they can't step outside the box even to entertain different ideas... sigh.
And, if they know they can make a tractor change in a known distance, they can waste power and energy by maintaining 55 mph on the up-hills. I'm assuming Tesla can design in enough power to do that. That would make a lot of car drivers happy.
 
What if Tesla sells the semi to Walmart, and Walmart puts in super chargers in all their locations...

Chargers at stores and distribution center. Maybe batteries. Maybe rooftop solar. Walmart becomes greener and partially self sufficient on total energy. Profits. The walmart owners are good citizens.

Compare the reality of that near future to a strategy to develop a massive battery swapping network funded by Tesla.
 
You are not factoring in TCO and residual value.

The Model 3 is priced just right. People need to learn

I agree with you, people need to do the math, but they don't trust their math.

They trust Dave Ramsey...

Someone said to reach out to him. It would be better if Tesla reached out to him, and they prioritized feature delivery based on his math.

On the last call, Elon said "There are a lot of people with the latest and greatest [battery].... If you want us to look at it, don't give us a power point, everything works in power point, give us a report on the [battery] from an independent test lab (ITL)."

If Elon wants to sell to the middle class, he should follow his own advice. Replace the word [battery] with the words [new car] and treat Dave Ramsey as the independent test lab (ITL).

The pricing on self driving will likely need to come down to $2K...

Anyway, I'll set the table. But Tesla will have to send it to Dave's ITL.

Thank you for a path to higher share value and long term health for Tesla.
 
I don't expect us to reach 'max pain' today but I do expect some pressure early and late to see if the SP can at least be reduced.

maxpain

Max Pain may have moved up quite a bit due to options positioned opened yesterday. I'm not sure how frequently this data is updated.
 
I appreciate the simplicity - no 0% financing, or we'll make your first 5 payments, or mfr. rebate with $1,500 dealer cash - just drop the price.

Buy now though - we took delivery on our Model X earlier this week, and got 0.99% / 6 year financing through Tesla's auto financing partners (do the application on the website and deal directly with Tesla).

1%!! Practically free!
 
I don't think Tesla will announce a "Tesla semi charging/swap network". I think it will be partner based and probably running for warehouses and stores. Starting with a roadster is a lot less complicated than trying to build shared infrastructure.
I think swapping the tractor would be easier and faster than swapping the pack. Why spend extra for all the equipment needed for a fast swap. The company owning and using the trucks could figure where and when to place replacement tractors.
 
The other day I saw an ad for $8500 off an MSRP of $37k.

In small print the ad said you must finance through the dealership and you must have a FICO score BELOW 600. First time I have seen an ad mentioning buyer credit worthiness and instead of restricting deal to well qualified buyers it was for poorly qualified buyers.

This dealer,apparently, wanted to get into the loan sharking business instead of the selling cars business.

In line with your note on the disgusting practice, my conversations with several credit analysts also indicate extremely loose credit conditions.

We're not in a bubble, but headed in that direction. I expect asset prices to rise in the near term, but it will not end well, as it never does.
 
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In line with your note on the disgusting practice, my conversations with several credit analysts also indicate extremely loose credit conditions.

We are not in a bubble, yet, but are headed in that direction.

I expect asset prices to continue to rise for the near future, but it will not end well, as it never does.
Once upon a time, I worked for a sub-prime financing company that who's parent company was owned by one of the big 3 automakers. This finance company had a great track record of doing the following:
Finance a used Cadillac Escalade to a customer who has previously filed for bankruptcy, and charge them 19-20% interest on their $50k+ purchase. (Not kidding here.) The customer usually manages to make 6-9 payments before it is repossessed due to non-payment.
Finance company sells the vehicle at auction, writes off the immediate loss of the financed principal, interest, and associated fees for tax purposes.
Finance company then takes customer to bankruptcy court. As they cannot file for bankruptcy again due to being a recent bankruptcy, they garnish wages on the difference of the total owed minus the auction sale for the remainder of the bankruptcy period, typically at 1/5 or so of the original car note. That vehicle that was sold at auction might go through this process a few more times during its life. Rinse and repeat.
These loans, combined with the sub-prime mortgages that the parent company had a large hand in, would be securitized into packages to be sold to potential investors, while charging a service fee for each account that they maintained on the investor's behalf within that package. There were some "quality" guarantees within the packages, so occasionally some bad accounts would be rolled out of the package and some "good" ones would be rolled in to replace them.

This was 2006. We all know what happened in 2008...

The inherent problem with these security packages are that they remove the immediate hazard for those issuing the loans. Those buying the securities should not take the originators for their word that the customers contained within the packages are actually what they say they are. A lot of it is smoke and mirrors, with people lying on income and assets, and the originating underwriters not verifying because they know they will wash their hands of it in 2-3 months when it gets rolled into a package.

Loose credit is hazardous for sure, but when you allow the original underwriters to roll the loans into packages to sell to investors, that's where things go completely awry, and in my opinion, shouldn't be legal beyond a certain amount. Yes, we will see another 2008 drop in the future if creditors continue to play fast/loose with sub-prime credit.
 
Elon Musk Adds $5 Billion to His Fortune After SpaceX Soars

"<
Elon Musk’s net worth on the Bloomberg Billionaires Index hit $21.3 billion after Space Exploration Technologies Corp.’s most recent fundraising made it the world’s fifth-mostvaluable startup. The closely held rocket company was valued at around $21 billion, according to documents reviewed by Equidate last week, up from $12 billion in 2015.
>"
View attachment 239669

Yes, old used analogy...but couldn't resist:

Looks like a great launch! :)
 
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I think swapping the tractor would be easier and faster than swapping the pack. Why spend extra for all the equipment needed for a fast swap. The company owning and using the trucks could figure where and when to place replacement tractors.

It's an intriguing idea.
My personal opinion is Tesla will have special charging stations for big rigs (cars can use them too). The additional surprise that will be revealed in September along with the semi should be the new charging stations. 30 min to charge the semi to 80%.
 
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It's an intriguing idea.
My personal opinion is Tesla will have special charging stations for big rigs (cars can use them too). The additional surprise that will be revealed in September along with the semi should be the new charging stations. 30 min to charge the semi to 80%.
I don't disagree, but I really want to know the technical details behind how they pull that off - by my physics first principles calculations a semi travelling in a day what a semi is currently allowed to will add around 42kW of load-leveled load to the grid 24/7 PER SEMI. In most places, that one semi alone is nearly enough to start triggering demand charges of $500/mo+ from the utility
 
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