Jeremy3292
Active Member
Hmmm…so now maybe some inventory Model Ys with LG packs?!? Thus ineligible-E Eligible
-I Ineligible
Wonder when they will start selling the ineligible Model Y? Plot twist! They are all ready for it.
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Hmmm…so now maybe some inventory Model Ys with LG packs?!? Thus ineligible-E Eligible
-I Ineligible
Wonder when they will start selling the ineligible Model Y? Plot twist! They are all ready for it.
Yeah it is possible. It cannot be that hard to get some Monroneys and post them. Maybe it is but a window sticker is a basic thing to look at before committing to buy a vehicle. Even in this day and age when they aren’t on the window.Hmmm…so now maybe some inventory Model Ys with LG packs?!? Thus ineligible
I don’t think there’s anything “weird” about it.I noticed that today too. Some are quicksilver and do not have the eligible for the ta credit label.
Really weird.
Are you Sure? I got this from the IRS site.The POS credit does not require you to owe any specific amount of federal taxes though--- If you took a $7500 POS credit this year, but only end up with $500 in tax burden when you file in January of 2025, you will not owe the difference back. The ONLY limitation on the part of the buyer (vs. the car itself qualifying) is your MAGI can't exceed the 125k single/250k married-joint max.
(note this benefit of not needing $7500 in tax burden is specific to the POS version of the credit)
Are you Sure? I got this from the IRS site.
"If you do not transfer the credit, it is nonrefundable when you file your taxes, so you can't get back more on the credit than you owe in taxes. You can't apply any excess credit to future tax years."
Does anybody know with 100% certainty that it is not a tax credit. In other words, offsetting actual tax liability vs a flat out incentive payment? It is confusing. Typical government. They make it clear as mud.
IRS said:Q4: What if a buyer has insufficient tax liability to fully use a transferred credit? (added Oct. 6, 2023)
A4. The amount of the credit that the electing taxpayer elects to transfer to the eligible entity may exceed the electing taxpayer's regular tax liability for the taxable year in which the sale occurs, and the excess, if any, is not subject to recapture from the dealer or the buyer.
If a customer places an order to lease a Model Y Tesla can assign a VIN that does not qualify for the tax credit on a purchase. Most people just place an order through the order page rather than specifying a VIN on the inventory page.There no difference in the lease rates between an eligible pack and non, so there is no method to steer the lease only person into the lease only eligible pack.
And i am not sure we can say for sure they are pack limited. So it seems odd to me that they would take a vehicle that is widely advertised as one of the few that is universally eligible and create a version that is not.
That’s the part i find weird.
I don’t think there’s anything “weird” about it.
Tesla has two sources of long range batteries for the 3/Y. One is manufactured in the US and is eligible for the tax credit. One comes from China and is not.
They only have so many tax credit-eligible packs to go around, so they’re making sure that people who want it can get it in any model/trim, and those that don’t or are leasing don’t “waste” one. Pretty smart.
What would be funny if that's the case is that BOTH the folks saying the now-eligible 3s are getting US packs and the folks saying Y sales haven't declined enough to provide all the packs that they sell worth of LR AWD would both be right.... Since it'd mean Y sales did NOT decline enough to provide all the 3 packs needed, but by putting ineligible packs in leased Ys they make up the difference to cover non-leased 3s.
Clever solution if that's what they're actually doing.
1) LG is slightly lower initial capacity. 78-79kWh vs. 80-81kWh (very roughly, it varies in each EPA test).Is there any proven performance/quality or similar difference between the 2 batteries?
For vast majority of people they won’t be able to tell the difference. Even driving them back to back.Is there any proven performance/quality or similar difference between the 2 batteries? My guess is Telsa will do everything they can to assign Lease customers one of these I models for the 3 or Y ; so does that mean lease customers may get a lesser car?
Or are the batteries basically the same? And the software and motors more important?
There is no noticeable better degradation for the LG packs (NMC) vs the Panasonic's (NCA) at least according to my Tesla specific survey:1) LG is slightly lower initial capacity. 78-79kWh vs. 80-81kWh (very roughly, it varies in each EPA test).
2) LG charges noticeably slower (@eivissa gave the taper points above)
3) Degradation may be slightly less for LG? Not as sure about that, @eivissa or @AAKEE could comment as Europe is very familiar with these packs.
I don’t think this is correct. The charge curve will be the most noticeable. Someone downgrading from a 5-year-old 2170C is really going to notice the LG when it tapers at 10% rather than 30%!The most noticeable difference would be range,
My 2021 LR with Panasonic 2170L pack doesn't taper until 25-30%...250 kW until then when on a V3/V4 supercharger. Old pic below but at 22% thereI don’t think this is correct. The charge curve will be the most noticeable. Someone downgrading from a 5-year-old 2170C is really going to notice the LG when it tapers at 10% rather than 30%!
And the 2170L tapers at closer to 14% it sounds like, so that would be noted as better than LG - more noticeable than the negligible range difference. Not a huge difference but real world would be more relevant.
Good to hear. I don’t know about the @eivissa numbers then? Something about European superchargers? No idea. This does make more sense; 14% seemed very low. You have a post-April-2021 LR it sounds like? (Before that is 2170C.)My 2021 LR with Panasonic 2170L pack doesn't taper until 25-30%...250 kW until then when on a V3/V4 supercharger. Old pic below but at 22% there
View attachment 1059349
If for an order yes. But for inventory, if the non credit eligible person chooses to lease the credit eligible car and the eligible person wants to buy one and all they have is non eligible cars, you cut your SAM on the inventory cars. There is nothing keeping the non credit eligible person from taking the eligible car. It’s not that big of a deal, but my point was it wasn’t straightforward genius.If a customer places an order to lease a Model Y Tesla can assign a VIN that does not qualify for the tax credit on a purchase. Most people just place an order through the order page rather than specifying a VIN on the inventory page.
This verified 2170L by battery pack part number or CAN Full Pack When New value?My 2021 LR with Panasonic 2170L pack doesn't taper until 25-30%...250 kW until then when on a V3/V4 supercharger. Old pic below but at 22% there
It seems low indeed, but in Europe that is the limit. I've also watched some US charge tests and saw the drop at the same spot. I was expecting the US model to pull 250kW for longer and therefore proving that this is another limitation to align (sort of) with the LG packs.Something about European superchargers? No idea. This does make more sense; 14% seemed very low.