240V Outlet Install with a poorly placed main panel

[nrardin]

I had an electrician come out today and quote me over $3000 for installing a 240V outlet in the garage.

I’m in a connected townhome and the panel is inside a storage closet at the rear of the house. He explained the quote was so high because he would have to drill through a lot of drywall and run a long cable.

Has anyone else run into this? I can probably get by with trickle from a 120 but I figured I’d see if someone else has figured this problem out.

 

[Eric33432]

I had an electrician come out today and quote me over $3000 for installing a 240V outlet in the garage.

I’m in a connected townhome and the panel is inside a storage closet at the rear of the house. He explained the quote was so high because he would have to drill through a lot of drywall and run a long cable.

Has anyone else run into this? I can probably get by with trickle from a 120 but I figured I’d see if someone else has figured this problem out

Dry wall is pretty easy to drill through.

But pulling a long wire through wall cavities covered with dry wall, so it is concealed, is another story. Often you have to cut out dry wall to pull the wires. Does his price include patching / painting the dry wall if he needs to do that?

How long a run is it, and will the wire have to be concealed?

120 volt charging is not desirable unless you drive very little.

Sometimes, a 120 volt circuit can be repurposed for a 240 volt circuit. For example, if there is a dedicated circuit in or near the garage that you can do without, it can sometimes be repurposed as a 15 amp (#14 wire) or a 20 amp (#12 wire) circuit. You have to know what you are doing to do this.

Any 240 volt circuit, even 15 amp, is better than 120 volt charging.

And to answer your question directly, I have seen many people who had to run long wire runs, some longer than 100 feet. In my case, my electrical panels are in my garage, so it was easy to install two Tesla Wall Connectors for our two Tessies.

 

[Kairide]

Get more quotes, if they are similar in price you know that’s the going rate. Never get just one quote.

 

[flai54]

120V is not ideal for most people. Trickle charging at 3 or 4 miles/hour via 120V is not sufficient enough especially if you have a decent commute or want to charge up for a road trip.

I would look to get more quotes from multiple electricians on your proposed electrical build before you decide to abort this desire.

 

[nrardin]

He didn’t give me an exact length but said it’d be at least 30 feet. The dry wall would have to be repaired to conceal the wire which is the main cost factor he included which does seem fair, just unfortunate.

I’ve got another electrician coming out tomorrow I’ll ask him about repurposing a 120v in the garage and see if he’s got any other ideas. I’m just learning about electrical for the first time so I definitely won’t be trying anything myself.

Thanks for the advice! Is there anything else you think I should ask the guy about tmr?

 

[Pianewman]

Is there no 240v circuit nearby that could be repurposed? Electric dryer?

 

[nrardin]

Is there no 240v circuit nearby that could be repurposed? Electric dryer?

So the dryer is actually above and slightly beside the garage. I hadn’t thought of that. Would I still be able to use my dryer if I ran my charger from that circuit? Sorry if that’s a dumb question.

 

[flai54]

He didn’t give me an exact length but said it’d be at least 30 feet. The dry wall would have to be repaired to conceal the wire which is the main cost factor he included which does seem fair, just unfortunate.

I’ve got another electrician coming out tomorrow I’ll ask him about repurposing a 120v in the garage and see if he’s got any other ideas. I’m just learning about electrical for the first time so I definitely won’t be trying anything myself.

Thanks for the advice! Is there anything else you think I should ask the guy about tmr?

You have to be careful about repurposing the 120V circuit in the garage especially if it is not on its own circuit. If you are to charge over 120V you have to make sure the outlet you are using is on its own circuit breaker.

So that one electrician is quoting $3K to run 30 feet of wire through drywall? That seems pretty pricey to me even if it means repairing some drywall and definitely need a 2nd opinion and would run that scenario through this electrician as well.

So the dryer is actually above and slightly beside the garage. I hadn’t thought of that. Would I still be able to use my dryer if I ran my charger from that circuit? Sorry if that’s a dumb question.

Your dryer circuit is a 30A circuit which can work with the Tesla mobile connector but your statement about that NEMA 14-30 outlet being above and besides the garage is not very descriptive. How far is this circuit from where you want your car to be.

If you were to plug in a Tesla mobile connector into the dryer outlet, would it be close enough to charge your car with the 20 foot cable? If that works then the only thing you would need to do is buy the Tesla NEMA 14-30 adapter and be able to charge at 24A. Obviously you can't run both the dryer and EV charger at the same time. But my only other concern is that the dryer outlet plug may not be suitable for this constant swapping in and out of the dryer/EV plug that might wear out the prongs inside the NEMA 14-30 outlet. If you were to seriously consider this option, I would definitely upgrade that NEMA 14-30 outlet to a Hubbell industrial grade NEMA 14-30 outlet that can withstand the constant connect and disconnect of plugs.

 

[QtownTaxiGreg]

Sounds like you have a almost ready made solution in hijacking the dryer power supply.

If aesthetics aren't a problem it could be way cheaper to duct through to the garage and along the garage wall interior without disturbing much drywall at all?

 

[snellenr]

If the closet is on (or near) the outside wall, consider running the wire in conduit around the house's exterior wall to the garage. It depends on the actual layout, of course, and whether it coincides with your aesthetic sensibility - you can paint the conduit to match the house, of course, but brick-patterned paint would be a custom order.

 

[shingles]

It feels to me that $3000 for 30 ft (or even 50 ft) or so is high, even if you have to run through a few walls. BUT, it's hard to say since every market is going to be different. About 3 years ago, I paid under $3000 for TWO runs of about 100 ft each (so ~200 ft total) from my panel to my garage. My panel is on the outside of the house opposite the garage and my runs had to go up the side of a two story house, across the house, then across the top of the garage (inside the drywall) and then down the middle garage. The quote included the conduits as well as the labor to install the Tesla wall connectors.

Probably should get a couple of more quotes

 

[johnnycnote]

Drilling drywall is not a big deal, running 30' of cable is not a big deal, installing a 240 circuit is not a big deal unless your panel is full (prob not because he would have mentioned this right off the bat). Yeah, more quotes

 

[Acps110]

Can you run the conduit along the ceiling of the basement or crawl space? That might involve less drywall cutting and patching.

I agree with the others on getting more quotes from different electricians. I ended up talking to 4 different electricians before I settled on the one I ended up using.

 

[Skavatar]

i got 3 quotes last January.

my main panel is on the opposite side of the house, a 50amp breaker, 100' of 6/3 Romex through the attic and down the garage wall, and wire up the wall charger for $1,500.

 

[parsec]

You have to be careful about repurposing the 120V circuit in the garage especially if it is not on its own circuit. If you are to charge over 120V you have to make sure the outlet you are using is on its own circuit breaker.

So that one electrician is quoting $3K to run 30 feet of wire through drywall? That seems pretty pricey to me even if it means repairing some drywall and definitely need a 2nd opinion and would run that scenario through this electrician as well.

Your dryer circuit is a 30A circuit which can work with the Tesla mobile connector but your statement about that NEMA 14-30 outlet being above and besides the garage is not very descriptive. How far is this circuit from where you want your car to be.

If you were to plug in a Tesla mobile connector into the dryer outlet, would it be close enough to charge your car with the 20 foot cable? If that works then the only thing you would need to do is buy the Tesla NEMA 14-30 adapter and be able to charge at 24A. Obviously you can't run both the dryer and EV charger at the same time. But my only other concern is that the dryer outlet plug may not be suitable for this constant swapping in and out of the dryer/EV plug that might wear out the prongs inside the NEMA 14-30 outlet. If you were to seriously consider this option, I would definitely upgrade that NEMA 14-30 outlet to a Hubbell industrial grade NEMA 14-30 outlet that can withstand the constant connect and disconnect of plugs.

Just as there can be numerous 15 amp outlets on a single 15 amp circuit breaker, there can be two dryer (or dryer like) outlets on the original pair of breakers. So adding a new high quality outlet would make sense, so that nothing has to be unplugged repeatedly. Of course, charging and drying at the same time would not be possible.

 

[parsec]

Another low-budget possibility: find two 120 outlets that are fed from different sides of the breaker panel. There might not be two in the garage, however. Search this forum for "Quick 220" or "quick 240" Local codes may forbid such things.

 

[flai54]

Just as there can be numerous 15 amp outlets on a single 15 amp circuit breaker, there can be two dryer (or dryer like) outlets on the original pair of breakers. So adding a new high quality outlet would make sense, so that nothing has to be unplugged repeatedly. Of course, charging and drying at the same time would not be possible.

That is true but we don't know the OP's electrical panel setup. We don't know if it has 2 x NEMA 14-30 dryer outlets in the garage so that it runs 60A to the garage. Is having 2 x 30A outlets in the garage really that common? Usually I would think it is just 1x NEMA 14-30 outlet in the garage.

What some people do instead is that you plug in a NEMA 14-30 extension cable which you don't pull from the wall out to avoid wearing out the prongs but switch between dryer and EV from the adapter end. Either way its not the most optimal solution so its simply better to run a new circuit which if the OP had to run a new circuit anyways then he mind as well run a NEMA 14-50 plug instead to maximize the outlet.

Another low-budget possibility: find two 120 outlets that are fed from different sides of the breaker panel. There might not be two in the garage, however. Search this forum for "Quick 220" or "quick 240" Local codes may forbid such things.

This makes even less sense and more dangerous. I wouldn't jerryrig a quick 240 volt plug via 2 x 120V circuits in series that is clearly violated electrical codes.

 

[tga]

Does the wire have to be completely hidden in the walls? Depending on the layout, you could install a surface mount receptacle and conduit along the garage wall/ceiling before going into/through the wall. That could greatly reduce labor in general and drywall repair specifically.

Of course, then you have surface mount conduit in your garage. That seems to upset some people. I don't care; it's a garage/workshop, not my living room.

You can also consider installing a hard-wired wall connector. This may be cheaper (even with the WC), since you don't need an expensive GFCI breaker ($100) and high quality outlet ($50), and give you faster charging to boot.

 

[davewill]

One final option to ask about is a path that doesn't go through the home. Maybe around the outside, or through an attic or basement. It may be longer, but easier. I would not mess with the dryer circuit. It's one thing if the dryer is in the garage and you just have to have some sort of switch, but anything that involves running a second outlet will never pass code for EV charging.

Finally, if your garage ever gets into freezing temperatures, be aware that 120v may charge your car VERY slowly.

 

[Eric33432]

He didn’t give me an exact length but said it’d be at least 30 feet. The dry wall would have to be repaired to conceal the wire which is the main cost factor he included which does seem fair, just unfortunate.

I’ve got another electrician coming out tomorrow I’ll ask him about repurposing a 120v in the garage and see if he’s got any other ideas. I’m just learning about electrical for the first time so I definitely won’t be trying anything myself.

Thanks for the advice! Is there anything else you think I should ask the guy about tmr?

Just as there can be numerous 15 amp outlets on a single 15 amp circuit breaker, there can be two dryer (or dryer like) outlets on the original pair of breakers. So adding a new high quality outlet would make sense, so that nothing has to be unplugged repeatedly. Of course, charging and drying at the same time would not be possible.

Most electricians:

1. Do not like to be told how to do a job by people they consider to not be knowledgeable about electrical work.

2. Do not like to repair sheet rock.

3. Do not like to do jobs in a non-standard way.

You might suggest that you will take care of any sheet rock repairs. Either do it your self or hire a handy man to do it.

Repurposing a 120 volt circuit for 240 volts can be a problem if there are other outlets on the circuit. Those have to be removed, and a blank cover with "240 Volts" marked on it. That is why I said you have to know what you are doing if you do that. I would only do this as a last resort and some electricians might not like this idea as they do not consider it to be "the right way" (the standard way) to install a 240 volt circuit, and might not find it worth their time to do.

There are devices made to share dryer outlets. You can find them on Amazon. This really is only something that works well if the dryer is in the garage or on a wall that is between the garage and the laundry room. You do not want heavy #10 extension cords running around your house.

This is one such device, there are many other kinds available:

https://www.amazon.com/briidea-Automatic-Power-Switch-Charge/dp/B0B8RWRKK8/ref=sr_1_4?crid=23JQUG2JHJ83L&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.2bnC0AvERJaoaykukiXUjv9_aCqR-hJEpKQyZwTrMTGAyZjDr_wFMLuw8QJY2HeK6pxC2_5VuJmJgeknMzdyQCHmXi0TO393i8LfGtMfysgrv4fgP4cRrsTCZNVVN7GxKU1BQrf_eRgngeXgnONSaOFSBwJaPmr9ilSgqn14TUV7hyJ5FqVYzV0ZjGrw39aLSxqoqZ-GdyiRC8LTHL_HDARe5AjZGV25Ykg1AvIGAt8.0C31L6xvvcBESKLogz0ljdZ2Uf26LHFAhk9psg1sGgc&dib_tag=se&keywords=dryer+buddy&qid=1718122445&sprefix=dryer+buddy%2Caps%2C171&sr=8-4

I second tga's suggestion. Consider installing a Tesla Wall Connector as it is not much different in price from using the Mobile Connector.

I would not add a second NEMA 14-30 to the original dryer outlet circuit.

Do let us all know what you end up deciding to do and good luck!