3% Price increase across the board

[dmurphy]

Don't know what was up with that leasing a 3 news, but might want to see if that comes up sooner rather than later for your situation.

That's what's going to determine my next vehicle. The next one I buy outright will be a Model Y -- but I need something to bridge the gap. That will be a lease... if Tesla can get leasing going by September this year (actually, ideally by June so it basically becomes a wash with the tax credit reduction) - I'm in for a Model 3. Otherwise, I'm going to have one more round of gasoline.

 

[Rawlings2019]

That's what's going to determine my next vehicle. The next one I buy outright will be a Model Y -- but I need something to bridge the gap. That will be a lease... if Tesla can get leasing going by September this year (actually, ideally by June so it basically becomes a wash with the tax credit reduction) - I'm in for a Model 3. Otherwise, I'm going to have one more round of gasoline.

I'm in the same boat but man I really don't want to spend anymore money on gas... It's like throwing money away ideally a lease would be perfect since I want the Y so it's a good option while Y arrives...but if there's no lease I think I'll just purchase a 3 and make sure I'm not upside down by the time I want to trade it in...even if I lose some money I guess..cause to me it's better I'll have a much better vehicle and one I'm truly happy with rather than some ice vehicle I'm fed up with

 

[MXWing]

The first side bar in many economics text books is that there is no such thing as a "free lunch" unfortunately.

You pay for the depreciation whether its making lease payments or taking a hit when reselling.

Why leases appear cheap is because they are heavily subsidized.

I have not gone through the calculations but I am thinking I ought to as I have an expiring lease as well.

What is the cost versus resell of a 35K Model 3 today - tax credits - other incentives versus the down payment and payment streams needed for a lease?

 

[ninpb]

I remember Tesla was letting people off several months off their model S lease for the big year end, 100% EV credit push. Might do the numbers on an S lease too. I agree, feels like a waste to spend money on gas even for the short term.

 

[jgs]

You pay for the depreciation whether its making lease payments or taking a hit when reselling.

Well, except that the lessor assumes the risk of greater-than-expected depreciation. On the other hand, they get the upside if depreciation is less than expected.

Why leases appear cheap is because they are heavily subsidized.

And "heavily subsidized" is different from "free lunch" how?

 

[Rawlings2019]

Well, except that the lessor assumes the risk of greater-than-expected depreciation. On the other hand, they get the upside if depreciation is less than expected.

And "heavily subsidized" is different from "free lunch" how?

That's sort of how I saw it when I decided to lease in 2016. My lease is coming up June 6th. People who lease pay the estimated depreciation plus a use tax etc. The cost is usually less than what it would be if you financed. At the end of it you just return you don't have to worry about being upside down or w.e that's all the banks responsibility. While if you buy and decide to trade in /sell vehicle you have to deal with figuring out depreciation, what people are willing to pay for the car ..etc... Like I said I probably will still buy if a lease option is available by May for the model 3 just because I'm in love with the idea of an electric vehicle that's fun to drive, has all the features I want and I won't be paying 150 a month on gas, but rather 30-40 per month on electric. That's a huge savings per year.

 

[UnderCharged]

hey i am learning as much as I can, I do my taxes every year I just didn't know exactly how the credit worked as I was confused. I read online and now I understand. My wife and I make over 90k a year plus we have side gigs that are 1099 that we have to pay additional taxes come tax time...so the EV credit will be applied at full for us. I have to buy a car in June. I was thinking of waiting for Model Y but now it seems like deliveries won't come till Spring 2021 since production is fall 2020...guessing I will pull trigger on an LR RWD with AP and then change it for a Model Y in 2022 :/ cause I don't want to keep driving an ICE, I spend 150-200 in gas per month....would rather give that money to tesla and help environment a bit :/

I feel your pain on spending money on gas, I was paying almost $500 a month in my diesel truck. Needless to say that truck is gone and I'm on the hunt for a performance 3, I just wish they would release air suspension for it

 

[Upscaleman]

The coils are fine. Then again, I'm coming from a car that bounces you around the road.

 

[Rawlings2019]

I feel your pain on spending money on gas, I was paying almost $500 a month in my diesel truck. Needless to say that truck is gone and I'm on the hunt for a performance 3, I just wish they would release air suspension for it

I was almost convinced on buy a used S 85D for $44k through Tesla. Had Air suspension, AP1 and obviously double the storage as Model 3. However I read that in the last year or so Tesla decided to stop doing the full refurbishing of these CPO vehicles and even changed the web to just show them as "Used vehicles" they still come with additional 4yr 50k mile limited warantee on top of the 8 year infinite mile battery/drive terrain warantee but without the reconditioning process...I can't fathom buying a 44k used vehicle that will inevitably have some dings, scratches and wear that Tesla no longer conditions. If I go for a 3rd party I will save a couple grand but then also doesn't come with the limited warantee...also heard they aren't consistent with pictures and delivery times. So for me I guess its just better to go with a new M3 LR RWD or LR AWD put 5-7k down and hope in 2021 or 2022 my payments have kept up with depreciation. I think as long as I get 27-30k at 3 years I will break even. I do put gas savings into consideration because I drive 15k miles per year in a car that does 22mpg. I spend 130-150 per month on gas sometimes $200.

Edit: Air suspension are nice but can be costly to replace or fix :S from what I hear.

 

[dmurphy]

I'm in the same boat but man I really don't want to spend anymore money on gas... It's like throwing money away ideally a lease would be perfect since I want the Y so it's a good option while Y arrives...but if there's no lease I think I'll just purchase a 3 and make sure I'm not upside down by the time I want to trade it in...even if I lose some money I guess..cause to me it's better I'll have a much better vehicle and one I'm truly happy with rather than some ice vehicle I'm fed up with

I feel EXACTLY the same way. The thing is.... aside from it being a gas vehicle, I genuinely LOVE my vehicle. (Cadillac XT5). I think it's woefully under appreciated in the general market.

The interior is nicer than the Model 3 ...
It's got a bunch of features the Model 3 doesn't have (360 camera, rear view camera, heated steering wheel, illuminated door handles (Elon wants to talk about s3xy - these are gorgeous at night!), hands-free liftgate, Apple CarPlay, cooled seats, plus a bunch of other goodies I'll remember once I don't have them.) ...

... but it's a gasoline vehicle, and it doesn't have Autopilot. So I just might convince myself to get into a Model 3 for the short term, until the Y arrives. Or, re-up for another 2 years with the XT5.

Not having a lease option will HEAVILY swing me towards the XT5 again. The upfront layout will be minimal, the monthly payments would be less than a Model 3 purchase, and I'll likely get a few month pullahead from GM to get into a new XT5 early. And, the end of lease fee would be waived.

Why Tesla can't do a nice, tan interior for the Model 3, I'll never understand ...

 

[MXWing]

I feel EXACTLY the same way. The thing is.... aside from it being a gas vehicle, I genuinely LOVE my vehicle. (Cadillac XT5). I think it's woefully under appreciated in the general market.

The interior is nicer than the Model 3 ...
It's got a bunch of features the Model 3 doesn't have (360 camera, rear view camera, heated steering wheel, illuminated door handles (Elon wants to talk about s3xy - these are gorgeous at night!), hands-free liftgate, Apple CarPlay, cooled seats, plus a bunch of other goodies I'll remember once I don't have them.) ...

... but it's a gasoline vehicle, and it doesn't have Autopilot. So I just might convince myself to get into a Model 3 for the short term, until the Y arrives. Or, re-up for another 2 years with the XT5.

Not having a lease option will HEAVILY swing me towards the XT5 again. The upfront layout will be minimal, the monthly payments would be less than a Model 3 purchase, and I'll likely get a few month pullahead from GM to get into a new XT5 early. And, the end of lease fee would be waived.

Why Tesla can't do a nice, tan interior for the Model 3, I'll never understand ...

IIRC, you don't pay sales tax on EV sales in NJ.

I'd seriously look at going for the 35K Model 3 and resell it when the Y comes out. How cheap will it get? People think 15K after 2-3 years. I am thinking not.

 

[Rawlings2019]

I feel EXACTLY the same way. The thing is.... aside from it being a gas vehicle, I genuinely LOVE my vehicle. (Cadillac XT5). I think it's woefully under appreciated in the general market.

The interior is nicer than the Model 3 ...
It's got a bunch of features the Model 3 doesn't have (360 camera, rear view camera, heated steering wheel, illuminated door handles (Elon wants to talk about s3xy - these are gorgeous at night!), hands-free liftgate, Apple CarPlay, cooled seats, plus a bunch of other goodies I'll remember once I don't have them.) ...

... but it's a gasoline vehicle, and it doesn't have Autopilot. So I just might convince myself to get into a Model 3 for the short term, until the Y arrives. Or, re-up for another 2 years with the XT5.

Not having a lease option will HEAVILY swing me towards the XT5 again. The upfront layout will be minimal, the monthly payments would be less than a Model 3 purchase, and I'll likely get a few month pullahead from GM to get into a new XT5 early. And, the end of lease fee would be waived.

Why Tesla can't do a nice, tan interior for the Model 3, I'll never understand ...

Hahaha we are in the same boat, my lease is a 2017 MKC Select. It has all those features you mentioned though I think the caddy is a bit better in terms of materials. I do love my android auto integration and the puddle lights and door handle lights greeting me as I walk up to my MKC at night haha. I average 22.5 mpg on a good week but some weeks 19-20mpg cause I do like to floor it from time to time hahah. I think if I stay with an ICE lease the payments are still about 100 less than an LR Model 3 but most good chunk is going towards gas.. I'd rather have my gas money go towards a faster, more fun to drive car that is also more environmentally friendly. BTW I been looking at XT4s...they have massage seats and all these great features. I just can't fathom one more round (3 more years of an ICE lease)

Right now I am between an M3 LR RWD + AP + FSD or an M3 LR AWD with just AP. since my budge is 50-52k. What do you think would be better the LR RWD with FSD or the AWD with just AP? idk if the .5 seconds faster 0-60 is that noticeable though AWD may be a bit better in some snowier weather and I do live in Missouri.

 

[chadever]

translated: Oops, we have leases we can't get out of. Someone should have thought of that... in their defense they probably did but couldn't manage that up. had to let this course of action play out.

Maybe they're flushing inventory before an update (AP hardware, sir suspension etc)?

Maybe it didn't increase demand the way they thought it would?

 

[Rawlings2019]

Does anyone know if the new $3000 AP option include lane changing? So if I signal to the left the car will automatically change lanes (obviously if there is enough space) or does this new new $3000 AP only stay in the current lane and drive on that lane and I would have to do all lane changes manually?

 

[Knightshade]

Does anyone know if the new $3000 AP option include lane changing?

it does not. Autosteer and TACC. That's it.

 

[Rawlings2019]

it does not. Autosteer and TACC. That's it.

That's pretty lame...for 5k we used to have EAP option that would change lanes...even AP1 has lane change doesn't it? I would happily pay 3500-4k for the lane change part is this $3k AP option also going up in price with the car prices? seems pretty useless to by the autosteer and TACC if it doesn't do lane change..i don't care too much for navigate on AP yet but its nice to jsut turn on your blinker and the car makes a lane change for you...

 

[Love2Run]

That's pretty lame...for 5k we used to have EAP option that would change lanes...even AP1 has lane change doesn't it? I would happily pay 3500-4k for the lane change part is this $3k AP option also going up in price with the car prices? seems pretty useless to by the autosteer and TACC if it doesn't do lane change..i don't care too much for navigate on AP yet but its nice to jsut turn on your blinker and the car makes a lane change for you...

I agree, I wonder if they'll add that feature into $3k autopilot at some point. Doesn't seem like that would cannibalize FSD orders, so why not.

 

[dmurphy]

IIRC, you don't pay sales tax on EV sales in NJ.
I'd seriously look at going for the 35K Model 3 and resell it when the Y comes out. How cheap will it get? People think 15K after 2-3 years. I am thinking not.

This is indeed true - and certainly plays a factor. The no-sales-tax is a huge advantage. And would give me the ability to sell it as soon as the Y comes available, whereas with a lease I'd be in the same waiting game I'm in now.

Decision, decisions, decisions ....

Hahaha we are in the same boat, my lease is a 2017 MKC Select. It has all those features you mentioned though I think the caddy is a bit better in terms of materials. I do love my android auto integration and the puddle lights and door handle lights greeting me as I walk up to my MKC at night haha. I average 22.5 mpg on a good week but some weeks 19-20mpg cause I do like to floor it from time to time hahah. I think if I stay with an ICE lease the payments are still about 100 less than an LR Model 3 but most good chunk is going towards gas.. I'd rather have my gas money go towards a faster, more fun to drive car that is also more environmentally friendly. BTW I been looking at XT4s...they have massage seats and all these great features. I just can't fathom one more round (3 more years of an ICE lease)

Right now I am between an M3 LR RWD + AP + FSD or an M3 LR AWD with just AP. since my budge is 50-52k. What do you think would be better the LR RWD with FSD or the AWD with just AP? idk if the .5 seconds faster 0-60 is that noticeable though AWD may be a bit better in some snowier weather and I do live in Missouri.

So, my $0.02 (for all it's worth) - I'd go with the LR+AWD+AP. You can always add FSD on later; you can't add AWD. Being in Missouri, I think it's a no brainer. And yes, the XT4 is a pretty sweet vehicle; which is exactly why the Model Y means so much. If I could meld the Y and the XT5, I'd be in heaven. The Cadillac design and interior, with Tesla's powertrain and software? Yeah. That's what I'm talkin' bout!!

The vehicle currently in my configurator is LR AWD, Pearl White, 18" wheels, Black Interior, AP + FSD. $57k+$1200 delivery, no sales tax.

NJ is in CampbellFCU's area. 2.25%@60mos. For interest rates that low, I'd just finance it. No sense paying cash - I can get 2% APY in a danged savings account these days.

 

[MXWing]

This is indeed true - and certainly plays a factor. The no-sales-tax is a huge advantage. And would give me the ability to sell it as soon as the Y comes available, whereas with a lease I'd be in the same waiting game I'm in now.

Decision, decisions, decisions ....

I did the calcs and verified with a friend who is a math wiz and we figured out as long as a Model 3 SR is worth 20,000 after 36 months of ownership it was only a little over 300 a month to drive a Model 3.

This is counting all fees and all incentives out the door.

Y wait? I don’t see a reason at those blowout prices.

Stripper 3 but there are worse cars to slum in for that money.

Buddy thinks closer to 15K value but I say closer to 20K or more based on depreciation curves not being linear.

That and there’s the corrections for s+d, availibilty of substitute goods, availability of subsidies that shift prices.

 

[Knightshade]

That's pretty lame...for 5k we used to have EAP option that would change lanes...even AP1 has lane change doesn't it? I would happily pay 3500-4k for the lane change part is this $3k AP option also going up in price with the car prices? seems pretty useless to by the autosteer and TACC if it doesn't do lane change..i don't care too much for navigate on AP yet but its nice to jsut turn on your blinker and the car makes a lane change for you...

What's funny is, when EAP was 5k everyone complained "5k too much! I really just want TACC- I'd pay like 2 or 3k for just that!"

Now that they offer TACC (and autosteer) for 3k, people are upset it doesn't include other stuff EAP had and they'd like to pay more to get that stuff.

Ultimately Tesla is never going to a-la-carte each feature so they have to offer packages of them- and some section of owners will be unhappy no matter how they bundle them.