-
Want to remove ads? Register an account and login to see fewer ads, and become a Supporting Member to remove almost all ads.
Audio: Sound System Quality?
- Thread starter STxTesla
- Start date
-
- Tags
- Model S User Interface
AndyM
Member
Did you kiss a Model S, and did you like it?
[ We all have our guilty pleasure songs, no judging from me ]
Tommy
Member
ferrarimanf355
Member
I attended the Amp up test drive event in Houston today and was successful at connecting my phone via bluetooth and was able to hear the premium sound system with MOG which utilizes 320 kbps bitrate. The sound was very good....full, clean and more than loud enough. I commented in another post that it might not be the best sound system out there....but it is pretty good.
The Tesla copilot that rode with me said that the car that I get should sound even better. I don't know if that means that they are still working on improving the quality or the software for the equalizer....but he stressed that it will more than likely sound much better by the time that I get my car. I was impressed with the quality...and my truck has Focal brand high end speakers.
The Tesla copilot that rode with me said that the car that I get should sound even better. I don't know if that means that they are still working on improving the quality or the software for the equalizer....but he stressed that it will more than likely sound much better by the time that I get my car. I was impressed with the quality...and my truck has Focal brand high end speakers.
I thought bluetooth stereo was 250 or so on a different CODEC so it would need to cross encode. So the 320 MOG is prolly downgraded by the bluetooth re-encoding.
Nice to know it still sounds good tho. I was worried about quality re: bluetooth stereo.
chmod a+wrx
Member
I am not so sure........
The maximum data transfer rates between Bluetooth devices depends on the maximum negotiated speeds between the two devices. So, it depends on the versions of Bluetooth on your phone (presumably) and the receiver (Model S).
Bluetooth 2.0 has a functional data transfer rate of 2.1 Mbps, which is more than enough bandwidth for 320kbps mp3s, etc.
I think Bluetooth 1.2, which is older but still common, has a theoretical max of 732 kbps, so the practical throughput may be taxed by 320kbps files.
? ? ? ? ?
Sound system could definitely be better. Auditioned today. OK at low to moderate levels, but turn it up at all and it becomes distorted. Tried two different cars at the Houston Event today. (both with the upgraded audio)
Hopefully they will get it sorted with minor tweaks before delivery. Its so easy to get great sound these days. Surely it's not a difficult improvement.
Ken
Hopefully they will get it sorted with minor tweaks before delivery. Its so easy to get great sound these days. Surely it's not a difficult improvement.
Ken
Transfer rate is different from streaming audio. Transfer rate is if you are transferring files via the protocol where audio streaming is a realtime encode/decode process. A2DP is the bluetooth streaming mechanism and that uses SBC codec as a mandatory with others like MPEG3 and 4 or AAC optionally.I am not so sure........
The maximum data transfer rates between Bluetooth devices depends on the maximum negotiated speeds between the two devices. So, it depends on the versions of Bluetooth on your phone (presumably) and the receiver (Model S).
Bluetooth 2.0 has a functional data transfer rate of 2.1 Mbps, which is more than enough bandwidth for 320kbps mp3s, etc.
I think Bluetooth 1.2, which is older but still common, has a theoretical max of 732 kbps, so the practical throughput may be taxed by 320kbps files.
? ? ? ? ?
In other words the source and how it is played matters. The stereo cannot outperform the source music. That's why folks are using a USB drive with uncompressed music as the benchmark. Anything else (like KenEE's review) brings in questions regarding source material.
Yes hopefully the Model S sound system will be better. Particularly the bass. My comparable for car stereo sound is my Hybrid Escalade which I can't stress enough how awesome and rich it sounds no matter what song/source and at any volume. Elon has said he wants the Model S to have the best sound system, and make the Model S a no compromises kind of car....and if not, "they're doing something wrong".
I have faith in Tesla that the bass will sound fuller/richer by the time I take delivery - although I know there is no guarantee. The only guarantee is that it would probably be difficult for me not to mention on a youtube video review of the Model S that I paid $107k+ and received sub-par stereo.
It's a categorical variable to me: the stereo is either good or bad. What is good? Elon, get into a Hybrid Escalade or perhaps into a Mark Levinson system (actually I've never heard a Levinson system, but the sound quality must be close to or superior to the Hybrid Escalade with the Levinson's 17 speakers and 700watts).
PS I don't like to play the music too loud, and Mark Levinson 700 watts seems obnoxious and bordering harmful. I just want good bass like in the Escalade. So really the Model S should be able to achieve this with an adequate subwoofer and this is part if the reason I have faith in Tesla to pull through.
chmod a+wrx
Member
Right....I see what you're saying.
So subband codec is the mandatory protocol for streaming. I'm familiar with the Toshiba Bluetooth stack protocol in which there are three quality ratings (at least for Windoze) 1) high quality 328kbps, 2)middle quality 229 kbps and 3) low quality 201 kbps.
So, I guess it depends on the source and recipient as we both mentioned.
Tommy
Member
Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, however hi-end audio does discriminate between song/source material and bass is definitely dependent upon level of volume. Your description of your system's unfailing rich sound is describing a sound system tuned to the lower frequencies, what is referred to as "one note bass". If a reviewer of an audio system reports that all material sounded rich on a particular system, he is describing a system with low resolution abilities. Those are the facts.
bonnie
I play a nice person on twitter.
I thought the sound system sounds fine. I didn't get an extended test but will probably get the chance in someone else's car at the end of this month. I've never heard the Hybrid Escalade's sound system but I don't think the Model S sounded 'sub-par' at all. If it doesn't have car-shattering bass then that's something that can probably be fixed aftermarket. It would be nice if it was included but why don't we wait until people who have final production cars review the sound before panning it completely.
What Tommy said. If you haven't listened to some modern music and gone, "ugh, the mix sounds horrid", you probably don't have a high end system. Or you're picking only very well-mixed music.
The mark of a truly hi-end audio system is that it's "neutral and revealing". Meaning that for better or worse, you hear exactly what the recording engineer mixes in. Unfortunately, a lot of stuff mixed today (and over the years) is mixed for crummy stereos and crummy speakers and sounds horrid on good systems. The really good engineers will spend the time so the mix sounds good (albeit somewhat different) on anything from $2 headphones to $20,000 speakers but not all of them have the time or the skill to do that.
A number of expensive speaker systems out there are not high-resolution and add a certain amount of their own "color" to the sound. Making them high-cost but not what I'd call high-end.
Sadly, Bose is at the top of that list. And I think the system in the Hybrid Escalade is a Bose system.
In which case, you may want to seriously consider skipping the premium sound system. Because if you really love that Bose sound and it sounds like you do, you probably won't be happy with what Tesla delivers in the Model S. You might be able to play with the EQ and get something that sounds ok to you. But there's no guarantee.
The mark of a truly hi-end audio system is that it's "neutral and revealing". Meaning that for better or worse, you hear exactly what the recording engineer mixes in. Unfortunately, a lot of stuff mixed today (and over the years) is mixed for crummy stereos and crummy speakers and sounds horrid on good systems. The really good engineers will spend the time so the mix sounds good (albeit somewhat different) on anything from $2 headphones to $20,000 speakers but not all of them have the time or the skill to do that.
A number of expensive speaker systems out there are not high-resolution and add a certain amount of their own "color" to the sound. Making them high-cost but not what I'd call high-end.
Sadly, Bose is at the top of that list. And I think the system in the Hybrid Escalade is a Bose system.
In which case, you may want to seriously consider skipping the premium sound system. Because if you really love that Bose sound and it sounds like you do, you probably won't be happy with what Tesla delivers in the Model S. You might be able to play with the EQ and get something that sounds ok to you. But there's no guarantee.
contaygious
Active Member
I can't stand my Bose fx system. Much rather listen to my mini Harmon kardon? Bringing music tomorrow on two drives so will report back.
I know what you mean by high end like my shire headphones have less bass than others but it's crystal clear. I can hear all the good and the bad of recordings.
I know what you mean by high end like my shire headphones have less bass than others but it's crystal clear. I can hear all the good and the bad of recordings.
I took a USB stick with uncompressed audio to today's event. I sat in the Sunset Red car, which does have the premium audio system. I had the windows closed and the A/C on. Dolby was engaged and disengaged (I tried both) and EQ was set flat with fader and balance centered.
Tracks played:
Sail - AWOLNATION
The Enormous Room - Michael Manring
Hide and Seek - Imogen Heap
Woolly Mammoth - Béla Fleck & Edgar Meyer
So Far Away - Dire Straits
Running to Stand Still - U2
Digging in the Dirt - Peter Gabriel (from Secret World Live)
All of these tracks have, roughly, a metric crapload of bass in them (I am a bass player, so I tend to like such things).
Now, let me be clear. In my home, I have Aerial Acoustics Model 9 speakers. The Tesla does not sound as good as the Aerials. For a car, it is terrific. If I had to find complaints, I would say that the highs are a little bit over-emphasized (easily cured with the EQ) and there aren't enough steps in the volume control.
Playing those tracks at levels between 8 and 10 (I didn't go to 11 -- 10 was plenty loud), the sound was clear and undistorted and extremely satisfying. On the AWOLNATION track, the bass was powerful enough that I could feel it through both the seat under me and the steering wheel.
I had two other folks (reservation holders) in the car with me, and they both thought the sound was outstanding.
Tracks played:
Sail - AWOLNATION
The Enormous Room - Michael Manring
Hide and Seek - Imogen Heap
Woolly Mammoth - Béla Fleck & Edgar Meyer
So Far Away - Dire Straits
Running to Stand Still - U2
Digging in the Dirt - Peter Gabriel (from Secret World Live)
All of these tracks have, roughly, a metric crapload of bass in them (I am a bass player, so I tend to like such things).
Now, let me be clear. In my home, I have Aerial Acoustics Model 9 speakers. The Tesla does not sound as good as the Aerials. For a car, it is terrific. If I had to find complaints, I would say that the highs are a little bit over-emphasized (easily cured with the EQ) and there aren't enough steps in the volume control.
Playing those tracks at levels between 8 and 10 (I didn't go to 11 -- 10 was plenty loud), the sound was clear and undistorted and extremely satisfying. On the AWOLNATION track, the bass was powerful enough that I could feel it through both the seat under me and the steering wheel.
I had two other folks (reservation holders) in the car with me, and they both thought the sound was outstanding.
stephenpace
VIN S00219
@KenEE: Were you using the EQ? I had about 20 minutes on and off in the Brown Performance vehicle today in Houston, and I tested chunks of the following, mostly without EQ, but some with EQ fully centered), all 256 kbps songs via Bluetooth, very similar to MikeK's list:
Sarah McLachlan - Black & White, Telemann - Trumpet Concerto in in D Major, Richard Souther - Compañero, Glen Miller Orchestra - A String of Pearls, Mark Keali'i Ho'omalu / Lilo & Stitch - He Mele No Lilo, Imogen Heap - Hide and Seek, Dire Straits - Money for Nothing, Megalithic Symphony - Sail, The Black Eyed Peas - Boom Boom Pow, and (perhaps my favorite) Black Box - Strike It Up (Original Remix).
@pguerrra: Back in the day I had a fairly decent professionally installed aftermarket system, but lately have been suffering with the standard Lexus system (10 years old now, and I've blown the passenger door speaker, twice). I haven't heard the system in the Hybrid Escalade, so I'll take your word for it that it is better, but this system was the best I've heard in a long while. I was listening at 11 for some of that time, and I didn't hear anything muddy with my samples. What's more, the mids and highs were there too. God, the drums alone on Money For Nothing was worth the headache I'm feeling now.
Random notes:
1) I was using Bluetooth, but if you are also connected via wifi, is there a method to tell it to stream using that method instead? I assume it would be higher bandwidth. At the moment, from the time you start a song playing until the album artwork shows up on the screen (presumably via A2DP) is 3 or 4 seconds. I didn't time it, it might have been longer.
2) Currently the Bluetooth connection knows when you are seated and stops when you get up. I agree, most of the time this is what you want, but I wanted to get out and listen for external rattle on some of the songs but couldn't. Presumably there will be an option somewhere to disable that feature, but if not, you won't be able to use the car as a portable jukebox, at least via Bluetooth.
3) I was testing the car in stationary position, and on heavy bass, I could see the driver's side mirror shaking, especially on Strike it Up at 11. I couldn't hear any interior rattle, though.
4) Just a minor thing, but at one point, the music skipped for a second--it could certainly have been my phone, but it seemed to correspond to a load event, perhaps the air conditioner compressor kicking on? Something to keep an eye out for, anyway. Obviously one aspect of having the infotainment integrated with other systems is that operational events have to take priority (e.g. you'd want to update the speedometer before the album art on the driver display), but up to now I've never had to worry that music might (albeit briefly) stop because the computer is busy doing other things in addition to also decoding and playing my music stream.
Overall, I think I'm going to be very happy with the upgraded stereo.
Sarah McLachlan - Black & White, Telemann - Trumpet Concerto in in D Major, Richard Souther - Compañero, Glen Miller Orchestra - A String of Pearls, Mark Keali'i Ho'omalu / Lilo & Stitch - He Mele No Lilo, Imogen Heap - Hide and Seek, Dire Straits - Money for Nothing, Megalithic Symphony - Sail, The Black Eyed Peas - Boom Boom Pow, and (perhaps my favorite) Black Box - Strike It Up (Original Remix).
@pguerrra: Back in the day I had a fairly decent professionally installed aftermarket system, but lately have been suffering with the standard Lexus system (10 years old now, and I've blown the passenger door speaker, twice). I haven't heard the system in the Hybrid Escalade, so I'll take your word for it that it is better, but this system was the best I've heard in a long while. I was listening at 11 for some of that time, and I didn't hear anything muddy with my samples. What's more, the mids and highs were there too. God, the drums alone on Money For Nothing was worth the headache I'm feeling now.
Random notes:
1) I was using Bluetooth, but if you are also connected via wifi, is there a method to tell it to stream using that method instead? I assume it would be higher bandwidth. At the moment, from the time you start a song playing until the album artwork shows up on the screen (presumably via A2DP) is 3 or 4 seconds. I didn't time it, it might have been longer.
2) Currently the Bluetooth connection knows when you are seated and stops when you get up. I agree, most of the time this is what you want, but I wanted to get out and listen for external rattle on some of the songs but couldn't. Presumably there will be an option somewhere to disable that feature, but if not, you won't be able to use the car as a portable jukebox, at least via Bluetooth.
3) I was testing the car in stationary position, and on heavy bass, I could see the driver's side mirror shaking, especially on Strike it Up at 11. I couldn't hear any interior rattle, though.
4) Just a minor thing, but at one point, the music skipped for a second--it could certainly have been my phone, but it seemed to correspond to a load event, perhaps the air conditioner compressor kicking on? Something to keep an eye out for, anyway. Obviously one aspect of having the infotainment integrated with other systems is that operational events have to take priority (e.g. you'd want to update the speedometer before the album art on the driver display), but up to now I've never had to worry that music might (albeit briefly) stop because the computer is busy doing other things in addition to also decoding and playing my music stream.
Overall, I think I'm going to be very happy with the upgraded stereo.
I don't really know. I'm not an audiophile. The Hybrid Escalade just sounds good to me that's all I know. I also know there is no equalizer in the stereo other than "Bass" and "Treble" and they are both set to the middle I think. Also, I stream Bluetooth from my IPhone and use Pandora or listen my own songs that come from iTunes.
I don't know if Hybrid Escalade is tuned to low frequencies, and it doesn't matter to me if it is Bose or Harmon Kardon or whatever. It certainly seems to be able to play several low sounding notes and is not only one note in bass. But I just want a car stereo that kicks ass like Bruce Lee for 100k car.
Maybe my preference/opinion is for low range and not all treble. Others would prefer a treble sounding system. For example, I had CarToys add a subwoofer to my Prius to improve its thin sound. I told them to "just make it sound good". When I got the car back, it sounded like a teenager's car shaking the rearview mirror to the hilt with every low note, and it was embarrassing b/c I'm 36. I made CarToys take it back and put a smaller subwoofer in it. The sound is better for sure than my Prius's non-premium stock stereo, but it still doesn't compare to my Hybrid Escalade.
But, I'd probably say that the Model S premium sound I heard in Mahwah sounds as good or just a little less than my upgraded Prius (with the smaller subwoofer, not the teenager version!).
Sure I can settle or make excuses and just take whatever Model S comes with, but for $100k+ car, I think most people would agree that it should have superior sound compared to all other cars that cost less. But that's just my opinion. Even Elon has said he wants Model S to be considered to have the best stereo or "we're doing something wrong"...Unless of course this falls under CEO/company hype. But then that's why I try to be on the lookout for any Tesla Kool-Aid that's being offered.
Or if it's not going to be the best stereo system, then Tesla should just acknowledge it. For example, I would be fine with: "a compact, minimal, and efficient subwoofer designed to save energy, maximize EV range , and still sound adequate." After all, no matter what field you are in, isn't it important to manage carefully people's expectations?
@MikeK and StephenPace: these have been the most insightful comments Ive read regarding the testing of the sound system. Thank you. I guess it'll probably be alright even if sound is not the best to me. The Model S will sure have better gas mileage...
Last edited:
Similar threads
