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Brake Regeneration - Low To Non-Existent (Aussie Site - Discussion)

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Happy to help you out if you are in Sydney bud. Just let us know where you are. If not in Sydney I am sure others can help.
Thanks that is a very generous offer and very much appreciated.

At the moment I am just thinking through the planning and testing. One suggestion I received was the latest software update may fix it, so may just wait and see.

My aim is not to have a heavy conversation with Tesla. It gets me upset. I hate having to justify the obvious and get push back. It makes me feel like an idiot.

I maybe an idiot, but I don’t need to feel like one 😉

Thank you very much for the offer.
 
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To be honest, team, I've been thinking this for a number of months with my M3LR too - regen braking is a lot more subtle than previously. Local govt installed aggressive speed bumps along the street I live on over a year ago, so every day I drive it's obvious too me should regen change. And, no, I rarely charge the M3LR more than 80%, and two tyres are almost new.
It does appear to be variable though, so I've previously written it off as either my imagination or alignment of the planets.
 
Sorry to hear of your issue. I only experience the reduced regeneration when I have charged to 100% for a trip (2022 M3LR). I also get the blended braking icon on the screen until I lose a few % of charge but regen comes back within 5% loss. On Xmas Eve we had drinks with friends out of town. The return trip is all steep downhill and we can actually get more back in the battery from regen than we use on some trips. The pic shows my TeslaFi stats for the trip. Efficiency is through the roof. The trip out though is around 76% efficient. You might benefit from using either TeslaFi or Tessie to capture your regen and usage for ammunition with the service team in future if it can't be sorted.

Screenshot 2022-12-27 at 9.44.20 am.png
 
Tessie has a good graph of energy usage for a given trip. The regen is displayed on the graph as a green trace so you can see if it is operating efficiently. This graph is of a longer drive to illustrate the data it captures for your drive. If you hover the cursor over the trace it will display how much energy you are using or gaining through regen.

Screenshot 2022-12-27 at 10.16.36 am.png


From memory both apps have a trial period which may suit your purposes to gather some data.
 
Driving an hour and a bit today, I remembered that the regen might have changed a bit a few months ago: I don't think it's weaker, but I think there is now a bit of a delay / ramp-up after you lift off before full regen kicks in. It's not long - less than a second I'd say - but that could be the different feel you're experiencing. I'd forgotten about it because I've adjusted my driving to take it into account, lifting off that tiny bit earlier.

(All of this is very hard to prove of course, and I wouldn't be surprised if someone showed that nothing had changed at all and it was all in my mind!)
 
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Tessie has a good graph of energy usage for a given trip. The regen is displayed on the graph as a green trace so you can see if it is operating efficiently. This graph is of a longer drive to illustrate the data it captures for your drive. If you hover the cursor over the trace it will display how much energy you are using or gaining through regen.

View attachment 889050

From memory both apps have a trial period which may suit your purposes to gather some data.
This looks very very positive. I will follow it up. Thank you very much.
 
Coincidentally, I felt that regen was non-existent through a couple of long drives taken yesterday. A/C was howling as the day was 34C, so I'm now wondering if regen efficiency can be affected by heat? Regen isn't reliable when the battery is charged into 90+%, and so I'm wondering if regen kicks down also when the battery is hot and so is more resistant to a charge? Just putting it out there...
 
Tessie has a good graph of energy usage for a given trip. The regen is displayed on the graph as a green trace so you can see if it is operating efficiently.
If you have some IT skills you can run Teslamate on your own hardware/cloud account to capture the same data. Negative power numbers is power recorded going back into the battery. You can use any of TeslaFi/Tessie/Teslamate to capture the actual regen figures.

1672187500955.png


I'm wondering if regen kicks down also when the battery is hot and so is more resistant to a charge?
It's generally the opposite, regen is weakened when the battery is cold as the cells are unable to accept high rates of charge when cold. The 2021 M3 should have a heat pump to keep the battery at a suitable temperature so a hot day shouldn't impact regen.
 
Today, watering my garden, a penny dropped. I believe I been goosed!

I was thinking about the different analysis tools out there, I have been looking into them on the web a bit, and the Tessie/Teslafi apps and the output they can provide.

So, I now must believe Tesla must have the same tools either;

- built in,
- or they have bought the same tools we can, from the internet
- or had the same companies modify them for their use.

If Tesla don’t have an equivalent standard of equipment, as a minimum, I would be thinking they are crazy.

They keep referencing their online analysis, so why not show the physical output to clients, by printout or on a digital screen. Why not simply provide me with a copy of the before and after data, back in Sept/Oct.

Thinking aloud, as a policy, wouldn’t it be best to simply show customers the physical data, provide a print out, or provide a digital output via email for the clients records.

And then sit down with the client (if they are local to a service centre, or by zoom) explaining the output from the vehicles data analysis. This would be a very good way to build customer buy in, and trust.

At the moment, all I can assume is that they don’t want to provide the data, because I may actually have a problem, and they do not want to fez up.

Again I have to ask, why! I can only believe, they simply don’t have a fix for the problem.

Yeah! You guessed it, I watch too many Bond movies, ahh such is life 😉

If I provide my own data extraction, would Tesla dispute it’s authenticity, just as they presently dispute my memory and experiences today. Is there a Tesla certified data extraction tool? (No need to answer, just a rhetorical question)

I guess I just don’t know what is what, anymore.

But I do believe it is now appropriate that I get a data analysis tool, as suggested. This tool will help me baseline my thinking, as things arise in the future. To give me more confidence in myself.

I really hope everyone has a great new year! And I cannot thank you enough for your input.
 
Today, watering my garden, a penny dropped. I believe I been goosed!

I was thinking about the different analysis tools out there, I have been looking into them on the web a bit, and the Tessie/Teslafi apps and the output they can provide.

So, I now must believe Tesla must have the same tools either;

- built in,
- or they have bought the same tools we can, from the internet
- or had the same companies modify them for their use.

If Tesla don’t have an equivalent standard of equipment, as a minimum, I would be thinking they are crazy.

They keep referencing their online analysis, so why not show the physical output to clients, by printout or on a digital screen. Why not simply provide me with a copy of the before and after data, back in Sept/Oct.

Thinking aloud, as a policy, wouldn’t it be best to simply show customers the physical data, provide a print out, or provide a digital output via email for the clients records.

And then sit down with the client (if they are local to a service centre, or by zoom) explaining the output from the vehicles data analysis. This would be a very good way to build customer buy in, and trust.

At the moment, all I can assume is that they don’t want to provide the data, because I may actually have a problem, and they do not want to fez up.

Again I have to ask, why! I can only believe, they simply don’t have a fix for the problem.

Yeah! You guessed it, I watch too many Bond movies, ahh such is life 😉

If I provide my own data extraction, would Tesla dispute it’s authenticity, just as they presently dispute my memory and experiences today. Is there a Tesla certified data extraction tool? (No need to answer, just a rhetorical question)

I guess I just don’t know what is what, anymore.

But I do believe it is now appropriate that I get a data analysis tool, as suggested. This tool will help me baseline my thinking, as things arise in the future. To give me more confidence in myself.

I really hope everyone has a great new year! And I cannot thank you enough for your input.
A side by side car comparison is indisputal data.
fyi the tesla data recently showed by 12v battery in good health. It wasn’t.
 
They can certainly get that data when troubleshooting but I doubt they want to be pre-emptively recording every trip by every Tesla vehicle out there and responsible for holding that data.

The amount of data stored overall, I would guess depends on what is stored locally on the car, and what is stored at base, and for how long.

Before and after views, I think would be an almost mandatory requirement for them to trouble shoot. With a set timeframe for storage. And I am thinking they would need to be prepared for customer concerns of this nature wouldn’t they. As I said I am starting not to know what is what anymore

But, my understanding is the most valuable thing in our society today, is data. And data mining a core industry. Tesla must have internal standards on storage and retrieval. I cannot believe they do not analyse and analyse customer day for so so many different uses.

But even an instantaneous shot can still be compared to “Normal” behaviour.

I think comparing with another, like for like car is a great tool. But more difficult to achieve, config to config. And I have been thinking about this.

And I wonder that, if it is a software fault, and both cars have the same software, would that mean the fault does not exist, yet it does. I am getting lost in all the if’s and buts.

My head hurts, with all the possibilities, I am simply starting to believe, that at least in my case, Tesla could have done more. Provided data based evidence to support what is what.
 
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To be honest, team, I've been thinking this for a number of months with my M3LR too - regen braking is a lot more subtle than previously. Local govt installed aggressive speed bumps along the street I live on over a year ago, so every day I drive it's obvious too me should regen change. And, no, I rarely charge the M3LR more than 80%, and two tyres are almost new.
It does appear to be variable though, so I've previously written it off as either my imagination or alignment of the planets.
Punchbuggy... I think we live very close to you (and those speed bumps!). I seemed to have lost my regen for months on the M3SR+ but got it back with the new update and loving it once again. I also had a new tyre put on, but now charge to 100% and still get the regen.
 
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Sorry to hear of your issue. I only experience the reduced regeneration when I have charged to 100% for a trip (2022 M3LR). I also get the blended braking icon on the screen until I lose a few % of charge but regen comes back within 5% loss. On Xmas Eve we had drinks with friends out of town. The return trip is all steep downhill and we can actually get more back in the battery from regen than we use on some trips. The pic shows my TeslaFi stats for the trip. Efficiency is through the roof. The trip out though is around 76% efficient. You might benefit from using either TeslaFi or Tessie to capture your regen and usage for ammunition with the service team in future if it can't be sorted.

View attachment 889039
Best to gross error check your logs before you post them @zarbs. No way that one reflects reality. Unless you were driving at 370kmh?? Driving time is 6 minutes or 1/10 of an hour and distance covered is 37km. Do the maths. You said the drive was all steep downhill, whereas recorded altitude loss is a mere 40 metres with an uphill section for almost a third of it ??

Here is a more realistic drive in my MY20 3LR from two days ago. My regen is working perfectly fine. On this trip is was hobbled for the first 5% as I had charged to 100%.

1672260636512.png
 
I have heard that even worn tyres can effect brake regeneration.
I can't see how that can be the case. Different diameter tyres (like when you put on a spare) will give error messages about the anti-lock braking, but the difference has to be fairly pronounced - a lot more than just a good tyre on one side and a worn on the other. I have two front tyres in very different states of wear right now (due to a replacement when on a road trip) - regen is unaffected and the car computer copes without complaint.
 
They can certainly get that data when troubleshooting but I doubt they want to be pre-emptively recording every trip by every Tesla vehicle out there and responsible for holding that
This maybe of interest. I just noticed this clause on the Tesla service invoices. It’s part of the “ conditions “ clause at the bottom of the invoice.

“Tesla, its affiliates and their respective employees may access, download and use the information stored on your vehicles data recorder to service and diagnose issues with your vehicle, and Tesla may store and aggregate such data for its own purposes;”

So it appears, to me, that every Tesla stores data locally, and that Tesla can access, and does access, this data as part of its diagnostic process.

Another interesting clause I found was,

“Goods presented for repair may be replaced by refurbished goods of the same type rather than being repaired. Refurbished parts may be used to repair the goods.”

It makes me wonder what warranty applies on those parts. But that is a whole different matter, something for me to keep in mind in the future, too much other stuff to worry about right now😊