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Canadian supercharger rates

Discussion in 'Canada' started by SmartElectric, Jan 12, 2017.

  1. SmartElectric

    SmartElectric Active Member

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    Supercharging

    Quote :
    Below are additional program details which apply to Model S and X ordered after January 15, 2017.
    • 400 kWh (~1,000 miles) of Supercharger credits are awarded annually.
    • For usage above the complimentary annual credits provided, a small fee applies.
    • In North America, pricing is fixed within each state or province. Internationally, pricing is fixed within each country. All prices include taxes and fees.
    • <In Canada>, we bill for the service per minute.
    • When billing per minute, there are two tiers to account for changes in charging speeds, called “tier 1” and “tier 2”.
    • Tier 1 applies while cars are charging at or below 60 kW and tier 2 applies while cars are charging above 60 kW. Tier 1 is half the cost of tier 2.
    • Tier 1 also applies anytime your vehicle is sharing Supercharger power with another car.
    Region per minute for tier 1 per minute for tier 2
    Alberta $0.12 $0.24
    British Columbia $0.14 $0.28
    Ontario $0.13 $0.26
    Quebec $0.13 $0.26
    Nova Scotia $0.14 0.28

    Credit to @DMC-Orangeville
    Eastern Canada Superchargers
     
    • Informative x 4
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  2. rypalmer

    rypalmer Member

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    Nova Scotia??!! Please tell me where they've hid the Superchargers in NS!
     
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  3. SmartElectric

    SmartElectric Active Member

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    #3 SmartElectric, Jan 12, 2017
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2017
    I have an early 2013 Model S with the original "A pack" battery and have unlimited free supercharging.
    These early packs see peak charging rates of ~88kW from 20% to 40% SOC and then progressively drop to under 40kW at 80% SOC.

    What follows is guess work for a 20%->90% supercharge if I did have to pay:

    70% SOC of the 74kWh available pack storage is 52 kWh
    Say charging speed averaged over a session of 20%->90% is 50kW.
    That means it took ~50 minutes for the charging session.
    Most Canadian charging locations (except Toronto which I rarely use as I live near it) will have low likelihood of sharing a charger.
    This means Tier2 rates for about 60% of the total charging time.

    60%*50mins*$0.26/min=$7.80
    40%*50mins*$0.13/min=$2.60
    =$10.40

    70% SOC of a 400 km range battery is 280 km.
    $11/280 km is about $4 to go 100 km.
    Our previous Mercedes SUV was $13 per 100 km.

    Tesla supercharging will be 3x cheaper for long distance travel than fuelling a similar sized gas vehicle in Ontario.
     
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  4. Hugh Mannity

    Hugh Mannity Mediocre Member

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    Cheap like borscht, can't see much backlash on having to pay based on those rates.
     
  5. Lon12

    Lon12 Member

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    So Alberta is the least expensive? o_O
     
  6. mknox

    mknox Well-Known Member

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    Lucky you. The highest I've ever seen (at about 10% SOC) is 80 kW and by the time I'm at 80% it's closer to 20 kW. In fact, I often sit there thinking I would be getting the same 20 kW (or close) at a HPWC. Most of my Supercharging sessions when travelling are usually in the 20% SOC to 90% SOC range and take me about 70 to 90 minutes.
     
  7. doubeld

    doubeld Member

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    I really wish it was a flat per-kWh rate across Canada, but I guess the utilities are set up this way to prevent that.
    Interesting quote:
    "Our costs vary based on both operational and electricity costs but Supercharging is offered to our customers below the price that it costs us to provide the service."

    Montana is $0.08 and $0.16 and that's about as cheap as it gets, so there's at least one thing about Tesla that isn't insanely more expensive on this side of the border. Washington is at $0.11 (lowest in the states).

    This is a good fair system from what I see, and a bonus for only paying Tier 1 rates if you start charging and get full speed and someone comes in immediately after you but you're still getting > 60kW.

    Again, Alberta may not have rebates for EVs, but we save on fuel costs no matter what you drive! :) (and no PST)
     
  8. mknox

    mknox Well-Known Member

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    Federal laws under Measurement Canada are very strict when it comes to the metrology used to measure electricity sales. The metering device has to be approved for use by Measurement Canada, sealed and is subject to periodic re-verification testing. Not sure about Alberta, but in Ontario, the OEB regulates the sector and you have to be a licensed retailer to sell electricity by the kWh, but you don't necessarily have to be a utility.
     
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  9. hingisfan

    hingisfan hingisfan_Mark_V

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    Very smart by Tesla to do the two tiered system.

    Anyone figure out roughly what the Ontario per kwh charge would be if they ever changed to that? Just curious.

    Surprised you can't rollover unused, but it's probably to simplify resales.
     
  10. doubeld

    doubeld Member

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    If you can't burn through 400kWh on the SuperCharger network, you're doing it wrong. :)
     
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  11. sandpiper

    sandpiper Active Member

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    At some point this is going to have to change; it's absurd. This is like paying for your dinner at a restaurant by the "minutes in the chair", with two tiers - one for big plates, and one for small plates.
     
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  12. jbcarioca

    jbcarioca Active Member

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    Not too far in the future, not to far away, we all hope!
     
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  13. sandpiper

    sandpiper Active Member

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    If you assume that your average charge rate in Tier 2 is 80 kw, then that equates to 0.26 $/min * 60 min / hr / 80 kw*hr = 19.5 cents/kw. That's not out of line given the absurd rates for electricity in Ontario.
     
  14. jbcarioca

    jbcarioca Active Member

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    There are restaurants that do exactly that. It produces very, very fast eaters. in the handful of times I was in such places (Tokyo of course) my bill was high because I simply could not eat and drink quickly enough.Per minute pricing will decimate Supercharger congestion, if nothing else.
     
  15. wayner

    wayner Active Member

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    What about SK? Didn't Elon promise one in 2017?
     
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  16. 11thIndian

    11thIndian Member

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    I've seen complaints about the rates around the web- but I'm struggling to rationalize them.

    1. You should be charging at home. Obviously during off-peak hours, which on Horizon here in ontario is 8.7c per kWh from 7pm to 7am. Can you program the Tesla to charge during only off-peak hours?

    2. You get 400kWh free every year, which is over 1,600 km. You have to figure this free distance into any annual cost per km calculation you come up with. So if you figure you drive 5,000 kms a year that you'd need supercharging for, it's not just the pure per kWh rate at the supercharger. It's that rate minus the free 1,600 km. Everyone seems to be forgetting that free distance exists their calculations.

    I can only spitball based on my own use case.

    Drive from Hamilton to Toronto, 140km round trip. No supercharging needed.

    During the year we probably drive Hamilton to the Bruce Peninsula about 10 times. 400 km round trip plus local driving. I can charge at the other end on free local community chargers (plus there's no superchargers up there). No supercharging.

    If I decided to drive out to Halifax to visit relatives it would be 3,600km round trip. 1,600km of that is free. Leaving only 2,000 km of paid charging along the way.

    I think the only way this is bad is if you have no capacity to charge at home and are a VERY heavy driver.

    Am I wrong?
     
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  17. sandpiper

    sandpiper Active Member

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    8.7 cents, plus a bunch of other charges. It comes to around double that, once everything is added in. Which is insane.
     
  18. hingisfan

    hingisfan hingisfan_Mark_V

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    Actually the per min structure will encourage ppl to move their cars a lot more than the per kwh system... Cause u won't want to pay for the much slower charging speeds when the car gets up over 85 or 90%.
    It would probably combat the congestion issues a lot more if they did per min across the board. Many people would set to 80% and then move their car promptly to avoid idle fees.
     
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  19. 11thIndian

    11thIndian Member

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    Looking at my bill, looks like the overhead after specific off, mid, and on peak breakdown is "Delivery" and "Regulatory" charges which appear to be proportional to the billing period charges, and not a flat rate. Interesting.
     
  20. ItsNotAboutTheMoney

    ItsNotAboutTheMoney Well-Known Member

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    If Horizon is your utility then ...

    Rates for Smart Meter customers

    See the delivery section.

    On another company's site ...
    2017 Delivery Rates
    ... it says that the variable transmission charges will be phased out over several years and there will be a fixed transmission fee.
    That approach is bad for residential solar, but good for EVs...
     

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